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Old 06-06-2020, 11:56 PM   #11126
Stlls
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

It's unfortunately a completely mishandled case. You get a guy to apparently cheat almost 40 sessions on camera, and yet fail to out him redhanded. That was all it took. Choose a spot where he plays for a significant pot, snap his cell-phone, and make sure the screen doesn't get locked. You simply need to take one photo from his chat and you got everything you need to seal the deal.
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Old 06-07-2020, 12:07 AM   #11127
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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True. But I guess, even in the absence of a logical justification, it would still be common for those affected to react emotionally and confront the cheater. I mean, would you rather say nothing and wait for the off chance of a kid on the internet devoting his time to analyze and cover the issue.



Does the law not get involved in anything related to a private gamble? What if he e.g. had stolen a few chips from the ppl sitting next to him over and over again and they had all on camera. Would that also be ignored?
I was just expanding on my what was posted earlier. I have no clue if this is how it actually works
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Old 06-07-2020, 12:56 AM   #11128
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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It's unfortunately a completely mishandled case. You get a guy to apparently cheat almost 40 sessions on camera, and yet fail to out him redhanded. That was all it took. Choose a spot where he plays for a significant pot, snap his cell-phone, and make sure the screen doesn't get locked. You simply need to take one photo from his chat and you got everything you need to seal the deal.

The players reported their concerns to the casino. The casino investigated and said there was nothing amiss.

I don’t know if they’re required to turn over their results of the investigation.

Can’t go back in time. The players sued. They didn’t let this slide. Unfortunate the way our ‘justice’ system works because it seems like you can certainly get away with stealing.
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Old 06-07-2020, 01:03 AM   #11129
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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I am willing to hear his side of the story though.
Really? Is it really going to be much different than what he said on Matusow's joke of an interview? He told his side of the story then which was basically that he was just that good. Don't see what else he could have to offer that would be of any interest.
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Old 06-07-2020, 01:10 AM   #11130
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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The players reported their concerns to the casino. The casino investigated and said there was nothing amiss.

I don’t know if they’re required to turn over their results of the investigation.

Can’t go back in time. The players sued. They didn’t let this slide. Unfortunate the way our ‘justice’ system works because it seems like you can certainly get away with stealing.

Yeah true, what's past is past.

If the players concern fails because of the absence of hard evidence, players know for the future that catching someone redhanded should be favored over reporting it to the organiser. However, if it fails because of the legislation, this incident should be reason enough to push for a change.
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Old 06-07-2020, 01:13 AM   #11131
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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The players reported their concerns to the casino. The casino investigated and said there was nothing amiss.

I don’t know if they’re required to turn over their results of the investigation.

Can’t go back in time. The players sued. They didn’t let this slide. Unfortunate the way our ‘justice’ system works because it seems like you can certainly get away with stealing.

Postle can literally admit he's guilty and the courts wouldn't care.

After some quick googling, it looks like the related legal term would be "sponsiones ludicrae" from old UK common law. Gambling disputes are too trivial to waste the time of the court or for the law to consider them. I can kind of see that -- there's a lot of dumb gambling disputes.
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Old 06-07-2020, 02:03 AM   #11132
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Really? Is it really going to be much different than what he said on Matusow's joke of an interview? He told his side of the story then which was basically that he was just that good. Don't see what else he could have to offer that would be of any interest.

Because you are either interviewing the biggest cheat or the best player ever in poker history. He is either one or the other.

A lot of people find it fascinating. Me included.

This case being dismissed is huge news.
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Old 06-07-2020, 03:12 AM   #11133
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Does the law not get involved in anything related to a private gamble? What if he e.g. had stolen a few chips from the ppl sitting next to him over and over again and they had all on camera. Would that also be ignored?
My uneducated guess is that this would classify as theft/larceny, and would thus no longer be considered a mere gambling dispute.
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Old 06-07-2020, 03:36 AM   #11134
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

That is what I was aiming for.

One example from my country was the issue with PayPal offering its service for online-poker. Online poker, as you probably already know, is merely tolerated in most EU countries, as EU law on this issue conflicts with most sovereign national state-laws. Many players took this as a reason to charge-back past deposits on poker-platforms for as much as 8 weeks. And they got away with it, which is why PayPal stopped offering its service in many (all?) EU countries.

However, that didn't prevent all players from getting prosecuted. There were quite a few cases where the respective banks and PayPal started suing people not as they initially did, based on law of obligation, but instead for fraud, alleging them to having deliberately exploited this gray area. And they were successful.

There should be a legal basis to prosecute him for something. Pretty sure Stones and their lawyers would`ve found such a basis if he and a dealer had scammed them at BlackJack.

Last edited by Stlls; 06-07-2020 at 03:43 AM.
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Old 06-07-2020, 04:04 AM   #11135
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

I wonder if some people already settled individually with Stones. Can the victims go the the gaming commission? Can the plaintiffs get some kind of settlement now to drop the appeal and with a confidentality agreemeent?
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Old 06-07-2020, 07:08 AM   #11136
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Fellas,

Poker was invented as a cheating game. The fact that it got some respectability for a short period of time, was really an historical fluke.
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Old 06-07-2020, 12:17 PM   #11137
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Because you are either interviewing the biggest cheat or the best player ever in poker history. He is either one or the other.

A lot of people find it fascinating. Me included.

This case being dismissed is huge news.

+1, im interested in listening to what he has to say, do we know when this podcast is happening?
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Old 06-07-2020, 01:06 PM   #11138
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Why has the gaming commission not been involved in this? Where are the police and investigators? Why has the only action been taken so far a civil lawsuit filed by other poker players?
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Old 06-07-2020, 01:22 PM   #11139
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

I'd be actually suprised if any of the plaintiffs has a legal counsel. Like wtf, none of what synth_floyd mentioned has been initiated, but instead they have approached a court that, based on the complaint, isn't even in charge.
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Old 06-07-2020, 02:51 PM   #11140
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

If poker players want change in this case we need to all call the Sacramento FBI office and make a hacking complaint against Mike postle. If 3,000 people called the FBI and complained at some point this **** would get looked into. They often only handle cases dealing with $100k of fraud or more and I think this would qualify. Lawyers will tell you to handle the criminal side of the case later, mostly because they won’t get any money if dude is arrested but they may get paid it they win in civil court.
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Old 06-07-2020, 03:12 PM   #11141
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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+1, im interested in listening to what he has to say, do we know when this podcast is happening?
Not really sure what you're expecting to hear from him that's going to be so fascinating. It's way better right now in your imagination. He's a cheater, no mystery there.

Reality is going to be a bunch of responses that we've already heard:

"I mean I was the best player on UB"

"You can come check my hat if you want."

"The stacks weren't always counted correctly you know and there were add ons."

"I'm good at reading people at the table."

"I have a daughter and health issues so that's why i only played at Stones and I didn't cheat."

Only addition will be, "Well the case was dismissed, I wasn't worried at all because I didn't cheat."

And some talk about how this has negatively affected his livelihood.
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Old 06-07-2020, 04:16 PM   #11142
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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If poker players want change in this case we need to all call the Sacramento FBI office and make a hacking complaint against Mike postle. If 3,000 people called the FBI and complained at some point this **** would get looked into. They often only handle cases dealing with $100k of fraud or more and I think this would qualify. Lawyers will tell you to handle the criminal side of the case later, mostly because they won’t get any money if dude is arrested but they may get paid it they win in civil court.
V said she spoke to law enforcement several times. They have no interest in pursuing.
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Old 06-07-2020, 04:20 PM   #11143
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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I wonder if some people already settled individually with Stones. Can the victims go the the gaming commission? Can the plaintiffs get some kind of settlement now to drop the appeal and with a confidentality agreemeent?
Nope, the existence of an NDA does not typically mean you can't say there is an NDA.

If there were a settlement there would be a court filing removing the relevant plaintiffs.

Mac loves the publicity and would be on every podcast bragging about a settlement.

The case looked like a loser from the start. The first thing you do is STFU during litigation to control discovery.
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Old 06-07-2020, 04:23 PM   #11144
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

multiple sources have told me that Justin and Mike are still talking and in contact.
here are the only options from that continued contact

if Justin was not involved:
1. then he believes Mike and is still in contact with him. This means that he does not actually know anything about poker and refuses to acknowledge the multiple pro poker players who have come to a unanimous consensus that Mike cheated. This is a terrible way to be a tournament director and should not be a quality for poker room managers.
2. if he wasn't involved, a natural reaction would be anger towards Mike for ruining his livelihood right under his nose not continued contact

if Justin WAS involved:
1. then there would be a good chance that he's still in touch with Mike
2. he would be angry with me (as I've heard he is) because i outed their operation
3. he would HAVE to side with "nothing happened"
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Old 06-07-2020, 04:58 PM   #11145
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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V said she spoke to law enforcement several times. They have no interest in pursuing.
Which law enforcement? There’s like a million different departments that could help with this and I’m certain that maximum pressure has not been applied.

I’m guessing you’re probably right tho- it’s a waste of time
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Old 06-07-2020, 05:03 PM   #11146
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Which law enforcement? There’s like a million different departments that could help with this and I’m certain that maximum pressure has not been applied.

Citrus Heights PD
Sacramento DA

That's it.
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Old 06-07-2020, 06:54 PM   #11147
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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i'm listening
If you really are the first name plaintiff in the California litigation, ask your counsel about depositions or other forms of discovery that might be available to you as a Plaintiff, even against a non-party who has been dismissed from the action.

Listen to him, not some posters on 2+2.

(Also, you might ask your counsel about continuing to post while the current litigation, to which you apparently are a party, is proceeding.)

Last edited by Gzesh; 06-07-2020 at 07:04 PM.
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Old 06-07-2020, 07:20 PM   #11148
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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If poker players want change in this case we need to all call the Sacramento FBI office and make a hacking complaint against Mike postle. If 3,000 people called the FBI and complained at some point this **** would get looked into. They often only handle cases dealing with $100k of fraud or more and I think this would qualify. Lawyers will tell you to handle the criminal side of the case later, mostly because they won’t get any money if dude is arrested but they may get paid it they win in civil court.

I sincerely doubt law enforcement would pursue this when you can’t even try a civil case.

The sad thing is that if he cheated the casino, he would definitely be sued and looking at prison. Stealing from other casino customers registers zero care obviously.

This is a very disappointing ruling. I had the expectation that a licensed casino had a minimal standard to run a fair game for their customers.
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Old 06-07-2020, 10:19 PM   #11149
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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I sincerely doubt law enforcement would pursue this when you can’t even try a civil case.
Not sure about this. The reason the court didn't want to hear the case because of the difficulty of determining damages. But criminal cases are binary: guilty or not. So even though the civil case has a lower burden of proof than a criminal one, I feel that the reason for dismissing the case here does not preclude a criminal one. But the hard part is getting some prosecutor interested in pursuing one, apparently.
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Old 06-07-2020, 10:43 PM   #11150
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Pretty sure local and state police are going to be useless.
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