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Old 06-08-2020, 01:16 AM   #11151
Stupor
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Stlls View Post
It's unfortunately a completely mishandled case. You get a guy to apparently cheat almost 40 sessions on camera, and yet fail to out him redhanded. That was all it took. Choose a spot where he plays for a significant pot, snap his cell-phone, and make sure the screen doesn't get locked. You simply need to take one photo from his chat and you got everything you need to seal the deal.
how many times over the last 8 months have people who are late to the party or who somehow haven't comprehended the sequence of events come up with some post along these lines? your smoking gun idea makes no sense.

some players and veronica and possibly some stream viewers sensed something strange about Postle's style of play and huge winnings. but no one knew (and we still don't know for sure) exactly what was going on - ie. that he was using a phone app, or hidden headphones, had accomplice or whatever.

those theories all came out AFTER Veronica went public. as i understand it sequence was something like this:
1. Veronica reports suspicions to Stones poker mgmt. they say they investigate and there is definitely nothing wrong
2. Veronica goes public that something weird is going on and that she is convinced Postle is somehow cheating. Sometime soon after this Postle goes to ground
3. Internet sleuths (particularly Joey) get stuck into the hundreds of hours of streams and notice the crotch staring, bulging hat, coinciding with impossibly successful plays. Only then do all the people following this conclusively agree Postle was cheating.

so there was no opportunity after the crotch staring etc. was known about to "catch him in the act" as he had gone to ground. this type of comment is really just an uninformed example of victim blaming

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Originally Posted by Stlls View Post
I'd be actually suprised if any of the plaintiffs has a legal counsel. Like wtf, none of what synth_floyd mentioned has been initiated, but instead they have approached a court that, based on the complaint, isn't even in charge.
is this sarcastic? the plaintiff's legal counsel has been one of the main players through this whole saga. from all your posts you do not sound like you are in any position to provide legal (or other) advice to anyone involved. And no, this is nothing to do with you not being a native english speaker - your english is fine
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Old 06-08-2020, 03:50 AM   #11152
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by TimM View Post
Not sure about this. The reason the court didn't want to hear the case because of the difficulty of determining damages. But criminal cases are binary: guilty or not. So even though the civil case has a lower burden of proof than a criminal one, I feel that the reason for dismissing the case here does not preclude a criminal one. But the hard part is getting some prosecutor interested in pursuing one, apparently.

Prosecutors need to be darn certain they will get a conviction before they try any case.

I don’t see a non-poker playing jury putting a guy in prison based on statistically anomalies.

They need real proof and they are sorely lacking it. You also have the casino saying they investigated and found no improprieties.

At least this was exposed. Sucks for the players.
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Old 06-08-2020, 02:48 PM   #11153
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

"Spock, I've found that evil usually triumphs unless good is very, very careful."
– Leonard McCoy, 2268 ("The Omega Glory")

"Evil does seek to maintain power by suppressing the truth."
"Or by misleading the innocent."
– Spock and Leonard McCoy, 2268 ("And the Children Shall Lead")
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Old 06-08-2020, 02:57 PM   #11154
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by golfnutt View Post
Prosecutors need to be darn certain they will get a conviction before they try any case.

I don’t see a non-poker playing jury putting a guy in prison based on statistically anomalies.

They need real proof and they are sorely lacking it. You also have the casino saying they investigated and found no improprieties.

At least this was exposed. Sucks for the players.
Why are so concerned about the endgame of resolution at trial and punishment? The question is whether the Plaintiffs sought criminal investigation of the cheating through either law enforcement or the gaming commission and what was the result of such activity, if it occurred.
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Old 06-08-2020, 03:59 PM   #11155
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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The state of California has a policy/ law not to get involved with civil issues between private gambling parties. So basically anyone with any gambling related issues in California is ****ed. I would say that people shouldn’t be doing any poker loans or backing in California for this reason alone. I would also imagine scammers are loving this thread just thinking of ways to rip people off in California.
So the plaintiffs' legal representation was not aware of California's "public policy against civil issues related to gambling"? Nice. Did they collect lawyers' fees to file for this?
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Old 06-08-2020, 04:12 PM   #11156
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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So the plaintiffs' legal representation was not aware of California's "public policy against civil issues related to gambling"? Nice. Did they collect lawyers' fees to file for this?
I am not an expert on this, but they might not have known if the judge would interpret the law that way. Things may not be so clear cut. I also assume they are getting contingency fees.
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Old 06-08-2020, 04:37 PM   #11157
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by jjjou812 View Post
Why are so concerned about the endgame of resolution at trial and punishment? The question is whether the Plaintiffs sought criminal investigation of the cheating through either law enforcement or the gaming commission and what was the result of such activity, if it occurred.

Gotcha.

My guess is they did go to law enforcement and after a cursory review, they all declined.

Without any evidence, it is an extremely weak case. No chance of non-poker players sending someone to prison based on an abnormal win rate.

Each hand of itself shows nothing. The amount of time to prepare would be astronomical. They would have to go through hours and hours of videotape. They would have to show the jury hours and hours of play.

Hopefully they’ll get some break and figure out how he did it. The problem is that you would probably need the casino to help out and there is no way they will assist when they are a defendant as well.
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Old 06-08-2020, 04:57 PM   #11158
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Stupor View Post
how many times over the last 8 months have people who are late to the party or who somehow haven't comprehended the sequence of events come up with some post along these lines? your smoking gun idea makes no sense.

some players and veronica and possibly some stream viewers sensed something strange about Postle's style of play and huge winnings. but no one knew (and we still don't know for sure) exactly what was going on - ie. that he was using a phone app, or hidden headphones, had accomplice or whatever.

those theories all came out AFTER Veronica went public. as i understand it sequence was something like this:
1. Veronica reports suspicions to Stones poker mgmt. they say they investigate and there is definitely nothing wrong
2. Veronica goes public that something weird is going on and that she is convinced Postle is somehow cheating. Sometime soon after this Postle goes to ground
3. Internet sleuths (particularly Joey) get stuck into the hundreds of hours of streams and notice the crotch staring, bulging hat, coinciding with impossibly successful plays. Only then do all the people following this conclusively agree Postle was cheating.

so there was no opportunity after the crotch staring etc. was known about to "catch him in the act" as he had gone to ground. this type of comment is really just an uninformed example of victim blaming



is this sarcastic? the plaintiff's legal counsel has been one of the main players through this whole saga. from all your posts you do not sound like you are in any position to provide legal (or other) advice to anyone involved. And no, this is nothing to do with you not being a native english speaker - your english is fine
I’m indeed a little late to this thread
You sound so offended, which isn’t what I was aiming for. I just thought it would have been a better way to gather privately and start reviewing the videos to find out about the CTO and then trying to catch him redhanded. This isn’t any “smoking gun idea”. They should’ve beEn aware that once they start to air their suspicions to third parties and Joey, they will be left with what’s on the table. That means unless he confesses or you get the metadata of his phone, you’re left without a phisical proof. And I watched Joey live when he started his investigations so I know very well that it didn’t take anywhere near hundreds of ours to get aware of that.
But the way that they handled it, i.e. reporting it to Stones, seems understandable as well even if it unfortunately wasn’t the best thing to do.

Finally, no I am not qualified to provide legal advice. I wasn’t aware that this is a necessary requirement to post on this thread. I’m not asking how you come to the conclusion that I am not qualified to give “any” advice, because it again sounds just like an offended entitled ... But even without having graduated from law school one should come to the conclusion, that a legal counsel advising someone to advance a case to a court that By law doesn’t even handle such cases is apparently as qualified as no legal counsel at all.

Edit: The fact that the legal counsel is one of the main affected players is even more amateurish. Even the best lawyers take other lawyers to represent them in court rather than handling it on their own. Even the amateurs do that tbh.

Last edited by Stlls; 06-08-2020 at 05:04 PM.
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Old 06-08-2020, 05:27 PM   #11159
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by golfnutt View Post
G
My guess is they did go to law enforcement and after a cursory review, they all declined.........
Thanks for guessing.
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Old 06-08-2020, 05:32 PM   #11160
jjjou812
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Stlls View Post
I’m indeed a little late to this thread
You sound so offended, which isn’t what I was aiming for. I just thought it would have been a better way to gather privately and start reviewing the videos to find out about the CTO and then trying to catch him redhanded. This isn’t any “smoking gun idea”. They should’ve beEn aware that once they start to air their suspicions to third parties and Joey, they will be left with what’s on the table. That means unless he confesses or you get the metadata of his phone, you’re left without a phisical proof. And I watched Joey live when he started his investigations so I know very well that it didn’t take anywhere near hundreds of ours to get aware of that.
But the way that they handled it, i.e. reporting it to Stones, seems understandable as well even if it unfortunately wasn’t the best thing to do.

Finally, no I am not qualified to provide legal advice. I wasn’t aware that this is a necessary requirement to post on this thread. I’m not asking how you come to the conclusion that I am not qualified to give “any” advice, because it again sounds just like an offended entitled ... But even without having graduated from law school one should come to the conclusion, that a legal counsel advising someone to advance a case to a court that By law doesn’t even handle such cases is apparently as qualified as no legal counsel at all.

Edit: The fact that the legal counsel is one of the main affected players is even more amateurish. Even the best lawyers take other lawyers to represent them in court rather than handling it on their own. Even the amateurs do that tbh.
If you look at his opposition brief to Stones, counsel devoted seven pages to distinguish this case from Kelly, discuss other CA litigation involving gambling losses and arguing that the public policy reason should be updated as gambling is now legal in California.
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Old 06-08-2020, 05:39 PM   #11161
Stupor
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Stlls View Post
I’m indeed a little late to this thread

Finally, no I am not qualified to provide legal advice.

Edit: The fact that the legal counsel is one of the main affected players is even more amateurish. Even the best lawyers take other lawyers to represent them in court rather than handling it on their own. Even the amateurs do that tbh.
for someone who knows very little about this situation you sure do like typing a LOT of words about it

ps. not offended (perhaps this was lost in translation?). just a little tired of hearing a few uninformed people trying to suggest that the one person who was smart enough and ballsy enough to put their neck on the line and come out with this "should have done it better"
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Old 06-08-2020, 06:09 PM   #11162
Stupor
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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I don’t give two fokkas about your friends and their pitiful attempt of a legal counsel.
mate

ok if this is true let's see if you can hold yourself back from weighing in with your strident opinions about it from here on in
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Old 06-08-2020, 06:21 PM   #11163
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Go on with your life, I don’t give two fokkas about your friends and their pitiful attempt of a legal counsel.
If you don’t care anyway, now might be the perfect time to be done posting in here unless you have something to provide that hasn’t been discussed multiple times.
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Old 06-08-2020, 06:28 PM   #11164
Stupor
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Stlls View Post
but don’t spam here
says the guy who has posted here 20+ times in the last 3 days after admitting that he isn't up with the play regarding this thread and doesn't give "2 fokkas" about this anyway
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Old 06-08-2020, 06:34 PM   #11165
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

FYI: I will come back later to clean up the mess caused by Stlls (who has now been temp-banned after continued terrible, ignorant posting in this thread after repeated warnings) later this afternoon.
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Old 06-09-2020, 02:19 AM   #11166
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Wilbury Twist View Post
My uneducated guess is that this would classify as theft/larceny, and would thus no longer be considered a mere gambling dispute.
Why would this, then, not be considered fraud, and not a mere gambling dispute?

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Originally Posted by PointlessWords View Post
. I would also imagine scammers are loving this thread just thinking of ways to rip people off in California.
Quite the imagination.

If I understand correctly, this is only applying to civil suits.

I assume civil suits involving gambling between private parties would be rare since scammers don't have any money.

I also doubt that scammers are deterred by the prospect of a civil suit. You know, scammers being notoriously bad with money.

If anything, prison deters them.

Does this impact the ability of the law enforcement community to go after alleged cases of fraud in the gambling community?

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Originally Posted by TimM View Post
I feel that the reason for dismissing the case here does not preclude a criminal one. But the hard part is getting some prosecutor interested in pursuing one, apparently.
Part of the problem is that the liklihood of the harm being repeated is small. Postle has been exposed nationally as an alleged cheater, and he is also a single father. Putting a person inside a cage is not necessarily just - even if you are certain that person deserves it. Let the man be.

Last edited by inmyrav; 06-09-2020 at 02:29 AM.
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Old 06-09-2020, 03:30 AM   #11167
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Veronica's lawyers may take issue with the judge's determination her libel per se allegation fails due to his conclusion that the tweet could refer to any number of allegations, and any number of people.

I think it's clear that the tweet refers to the big accusation in the room, and by saying the accusation was fabricated, this tweet singles out Veronica.

The tweet read:Earlier this year an accusation was made that a
player was cheating in our game[.] We conducted
a full investigation & found no evidence that
cheating had occurred[.] Stones Live stream
remains a secure poker streaming platform[.]
The recent allegations are completely
fabricated[.]
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Old 06-09-2020, 03:47 AM   #11168
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Angry_Polak View Post
LFG!! DO IT!! truth is a defense and i get discovery time!!! This would not fair well for any of them
Have you not had discovery yet? Did you get his phones? Stone's wifi record? Could you be able to see with what device was connected, at what times, and file txfers?

Didn't you get this information?
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Old 06-09-2020, 07:26 AM   #11169
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

It appears the case was dismissed before discovery started.

You are going to have to wait for the movie.
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Old 06-09-2020, 03:39 PM   #11170
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Turdzilla View Post
It appears the case was dismissed before discovery started.

You are going to have to wait for the movie.
Should the case against Stones be continued, and Plaintiffs' counsel stated an intent to amend and proceed, there should be discovery. I think some discovery would be available as what relevant facts Mr. Postle may know about the matter as well, discovery is not limited to seeking information under oath only from parties.
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Old 06-09-2020, 05:35 PM   #11171
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

Is it true that one of the plaintiffs is also an attorney on the case ???

I can’t believe it if so
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Old 06-09-2020, 05:55 PM   #11172
inmyrav
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by Gzesh View Post
Should the case against Stones be continued, and Plaintiffs' counsel stated an intent to amend and proceed, there should be discovery. I think some discovery would be available as what relevant facts Mr. Postle may know about the matter as well, discovery is not limited to seeking information under oath only from parties.
Isn't Postle's lawyer likely to recommend he take the 5th, even if he doesn't think he broke any laws since there is obviously accusations out there he broke the law. Postle won't testify. He can only be forced to if he is granted immunity. Doesn't sound like the authorities are interested.
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Old 06-09-2020, 09:50 PM   #11173
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

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Originally Posted by inmyrav View Post
Isn't Postle's lawyer likely to recommend he take the 5th, even if he doesn't think he broke any laws since there is obviously accusations out there he broke the law. Postle won't testify. He can only be forced to if he is granted immunity. Doesn't sound like the authorities are interested.
... A wtiness can take the Fifth all day perhaps, but inferences can be drawn in a civil proceeding from taking the Fifth.

" In essence, and contrary to popular opinion, assertion of the Fifth Amendment by present or former employees can lead to an adverse inference of improper or wrongful conduct by the corporation in civil litigation, in certain circumstances and often within a court’s discretion."

https://www.gibsondunn.com/wp-conten...AgainstYou.pdf

Putting the correct questions to a guy who was specifically marketed as an attraction by a company defendant may indeed support drawing an inference as to the answer to the specific questions posed.
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Old 06-09-2020, 10:02 PM   #11174
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

2p2 should reach out to Mike Postle about publishing a book on the scandal. He could title it: "If I Did It: Confessions of the Cheater" by Mike Postle.

He could get real creative with the cover too. I envision it saying (in huge letters):

I DID IT
Confessions of THE CHEATER

You are probably wondering where the "if" went and that would go in small letters inside the first I in the title. This is an absolutely brilliant idea and I'm not going to charge 2p2 or Mike Postle a penny for it. Just run with it!
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Old 06-09-2020, 10:33 PM   #11175
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Re: Mike Postle cheating allegations (FAQ in first post)

The last book they tried to promote didn’t turn out that well for 2p2...


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