Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

News, Views, and Gossip For poker news, views and gossip.

View Poll Results: (Public Poll) I am siding with...
Chris Moneymaker 62 82.67%
Jason Young 13 17.33%
Voters: 75. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-02-2013, 01:07 PM   #1351
Jbrochu
banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 16,076
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Chris you say made the bets in May. When did you first find out about Jason Young's debts?
Jbrochu is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:10 PM   #1352
dunlap
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,828
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

I requested information from jason to be shared only with me and have not received anything
dunlap is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:15 PM   #1353
TheRiverSniper
journeyman
 
TheRiverSniper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Your worst nightmare
Posts: 325
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dunlap View Post
I appreciate all you guys have opinions and want the whole story and want to debate about it. I was personally involved obv and know what happened. I could of easily paid jason and been done instead of taking this line. I am paying the money out to a charity as I think that is best course because I was wrong during this time as well and need to pay up.

If jason can somehow prove to ME not you guys he had cash in May (my timeline was wrong as I made the bets in may not April) or somehow prove the bookie is real as he told me they were in business for 5 years at one point or show me the computer betting sheets of the people I pmed him about I will do what I said 2000 posts ago. I will pay him and apologize. I have requested this and got no answer just a phone call with promises and assurances.

As for the text messages he posted they don't bother me that they public. I am a big boy in more ways than one and I am also human and I overextended myself for awhile with loans. I have tried to learned that lesson and don't loan or borrow anymore with anyone. But that's my issue
Congratulations! I think it is commendable that you have been able to turn this situation into a positive. Well, I think all issues have been settled and its time to move on. Great choice for a well respected charity!!! Perhaps JY will send a matching amount to them as well. I think that would be a great idea.
Good luck!
TheRiverSniper is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:19 PM   #1354
Assani Fisher
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Assani Fisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 48,128
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilowatt View Post
I will volunteer to help collect for you. If you agree, tell Jason so he can contact me and I will send him the details for payment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
That's fine with me and thanks for the offer, but I'm going to let Jason do his restaurant business tonight- I think it's unreasonable to expect him to respond to a bunch of texts on a Friday night. If he hasn't already seen it here in the thread, ill message him tomorrow. Thanks again, and ill PM u with info on how to send me the money.
PM sent to Kilowatt. Since JY and Kilowatt have had their differences during this thread, I'll handle all communication and keep in touch with both of them. Will send a text to JY as soon as Kilowatt replies to my PM.
Assani Fisher is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:23 PM   #1355
Assani Fisher
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Assani Fisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 48,128
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PSUMike1999 View Post
Wow, I just realized Assani that you have over 46,000 posts on here.

Is that the most you've seen???

It's the most I have seen on here.

That's worth $2000 on its own, lol.
Haha, for a good 2-3 years my daily schedule was to sit at PLO8 tables and wait for heads up action while surfing the internet....this led to many many 2p2 discussions, lol. Mostly I post in Sporting Events, some in H&F, and then some in poker threads too.

A lot of people have way more posts than me though. Just a quick search found that metsandfinsfan has almost 120k: https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/members/46078/
Assani Fisher is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:25 PM   #1356
boobies4me
veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 2,233
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Chris, read Kilowatt's post that succinctly explains why giving money to a charity is noble and all but no where near the correct play here.

So far we still have assani, jk87, and sheets all confirmed to have not been paid, yet we still have the JY shills or JY accounts coming in trying to convince everyone he's a stand up guy. The thread that keeps on giving.
boobies4me is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:26 PM   #1357
Edgelooker1
grinder
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Bulgogi and Yaki Mandu Avenue
Posts: 650
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Seeing the betting sheets would be good. I'd like to see if he was collecting from losing players while at the same time stiffing winners.
Edgelooker1 is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:27 PM   #1358
Banned4lyfe
Sup-Bah? Pop-Bah Pooh-Bear Permanently Pooh-Bah Billy Walters Jr
 
Banned4lyfe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: SoCal ✈
Posts: 13,932
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dunlap View Post
I could of easily paid jason and been done instead of taking this line.
Not according to your text...

Really, if you had no plans of paying Jason while sending those text you deserve an academy award for your performance. You really came across as someone who didn't have the money and not someone who thought was being freerolled.
Banned4lyfe is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:28 PM   #1359
andrewga
banned
 
andrewga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 201
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Quote:
Originally Posted by boobies4me View Post
The thread that keeps on giving.
It is great isn't it? This thread might be the greatest in history.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banned4lyfe View Post
You really came across as someone who didn't have the money and not someone who thought was being freerolled.
Agreed.
andrewga is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:33 PM   #1360
dunlap
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,828
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banned4lyfe View Post
Not according to your text...

Really, if you had no plans of paying Jason while sending those text you deserve an academy award for your performance. You really came across as someone who didn't have the money and not someone who thought was being freerolled.
During that time I only knew of one balance jason owed and he assured me he was on top of it and paying him his balance. I don't like owing anyone money and felt like **** with my given situation. I was promised from 4 people I would have my loans repaid during that period. It was a lot of money and between that and series run bad I was gambling broke. Again I am human and make mistakes as I did in this situation that's why I am paying to make right
dunlap is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:35 PM   #1361
dunlap
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,828
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

But even at that point when I got some money paid back I told him I would pay him only when he paid the guy that won
dunlap is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:36 PM   #1362
Assani Fisher
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Assani Fisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 48,128
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dunlap View Post
As for the thread I will leave it for you guys to debate and will only look for ideas on charities.

Make a wish is the first one I have choosen.
I thought I got to pick the charity
Assani Fisher is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:37 PM   #1363
dunlap
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,828
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Not going further in my personal stuff on public forum. Facts remain and if I get any of information I requested I will do as I said.
dunlap is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:38 PM   #1364
dunlap
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,828
Quote:
Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
I thought I got to pick the charity
Going to pick 3 or 4 charities. You def get to pick one
dunlap is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:39 PM   #1365
NLSoldier
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
NLSoldier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Hello Ted
Posts: 24,250
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dunlap View Post
During that time I only knew of one balance jason owed and he assured me he was on top of it and paying him his balance. I don't like owing anyone money and felt like **** with my given situation. I was promised from 4 people I would have my loans repaid during that period. It was a lot of money and between that and series run bad I was gambling broke. Again I am human and make mistakes as I did in this situation that's why I am paying to make right


Chris this is the part of your version that doesn't quite seem to add up. (assuming bolded refers to the time of the text convos with Jason)

Didn't those text messages occur after the skype conversations with the others who said they were owed by Jason?

Quote:
As I am sitting in airport headed home I get a Skype message from another guy that used to bet in the forum. He asked if Jason owed me money and I responded that I owed him. He told me Jason has owed him 18k for a few weeks and hadn't paid and asked I pay him instead of Jason. I told him at that time I would not pay Jason and pay him. When I got home I stalled paying Jason to see how the situation would shake out. Over the next 2 months 2 other people I know messaged me asking if Jason owed me money. I gave them dame answer that I owed him. The total thathe owed the 3 guys was over 40k.
These skype convos seem to have occurred right after the losses were incurred, whereas the text convos were months later, if I am following this all correctly.

edit-I guess it looks like the initial skype message corresponds to the 1 balance you knew of that he "assured you he was on top of", and the others you became aware of sometime around/after the time of the text convos? It seems like it would have had to been more than 2 months later though if the debt was incurred in may and the texts extended into september.

Last edited by NLSoldier; 11-02-2013 at 01:49 PM.
NLSoldier is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:41 PM   #1366
Assani Fisher
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Assani Fisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 48,128
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewga View Post
He can't even pay Assani Fisher 2k though. If Assani Fisher gets paid by JY within 7 calendar days of today, I will ship your next 2 weekly payments of 20 cents each to PSUmike.
we've set up a payment plan that is satisfactory to me. I won't be getting my money that quickly. There are quite a few things you guys can rightfully criticize JY for, but so far he seems willing to stick to this payment plan so I'm content and would ask that you guys not criticize him on this particular aspect anymore. Yesterday was a step in the right direction imo.
Assani Fisher is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:49 PM   #1367
andrewga
banned
 
andrewga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 201
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Good luck.
andrewga is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:51 PM   #1368
Banned4lyfe
Sup-Bah? Pop-Bah Pooh-Bear Permanently Pooh-Bah Billy Walters Jr
 
Banned4lyfe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: SoCal ✈
Posts: 13,932
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dunlap View Post
During that time I only knew of one balance jason owed and he assured me he was on top of it and paying him his balance. I don't like owing anyone money and felt like **** with my given situation. I was promised from 4 people I would have my loans repaid during that period. It was a lot of money and between that and series run bad I was gambling broke. Again I am human and make mistakes as I did in this situation that's why I am paying to make right
Think everyone would be on your side if:

1) This 18k mysterious person showed up and confirmed he was owed in or around March.
2)
3)

That's it.
Banned4lyfe is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:54 PM   #1369
Jbrochu
banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 16,076
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Quote:
Originally Posted by NLSoldier View Post

edit-I guess it looks like the initial skype message corresponds to the 1 balance you knew of that he "assured you he was on top of", and the others you became aware of sometime around/after the time of the text convos?
In the part you quoted he says "in the next two months" which by his own timeline (May) would make that no later than July.

Quote:
As I am sitting in airport headed home I get a Skype message from another guy that used to bet in the forum. He asked if Jason owed me money and I responded that I owed him. He told me Jason has owed him 18k for a few weeks and hadn't paid and asked I pay him instead of Jason. I told him at that time I would not pay Jason and pay him. When I got home I stalled paying Jason to see how the situation would shake out. Over the next 2 months 2 other people I know messaged me asking if Jason owed me money. I gave them dame answer that I owed him. The total thathe owed the 3 guys was over 40k.

Sheets confirmed that he was one of the two that reached out and Sheets says he placed his winning bet in October and I presume took a little while before contacting Moneymaker.

Also, in the texts we see from Moneymaker to Jason he makes no mention at all of the debt that is causing him to withhold payment.
Jbrochu is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:56 PM   #1370
Kilowatt
banned
 
Kilowatt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,101
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Chris, aren't you broke right now? How are you going to come up with 20k to pay this charity? And if you aren't broke, isn't that going to be a healthy percentage of your cash net worth right now?

I suggest you forget the charity angle and just get your own life in order.

But if you really do want to donate $20k to charity in lieu of paying Jason, make sure it is in YOUR name, so you can get the writeoff instead of him.

Also, tax tip for you:

If you were a net loser in gambling in 2013, I suggest waiting until January to make the donation, as that will allow you to write it off your 2014 taxes. If you had no taxable income in 2013, definietly wait until 2014, as that's just 2 months away.
Kilowatt is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 01:59 PM   #1371
andrewga
banned
 
andrewga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 201
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilowatt View Post
Also, tax tip for you
Not sure if this was supposed to be funny.

Chris Moneymaker is an accountant remember?

ITT poker players giving accountants tax advice.
andrewga is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 02:00 PM   #1372
mullion
grinder
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 516
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503)

[/QUOTE]I am an interested party in this situation, so I am not completely unbiased to the outcome, but if adding some facts will help, here they are:


About 2 years ago (not 100% sure of the timeline here please forgive that) I wanted to put some sports bets in, as I had a friend who said he knew what he was doing (sigh lol I know i know its impossible whatever but I trust him). Having no idea in this day and age how to go about getting bookies etc, I reached out to someone on 2_2 and he told me to contact Jason, as he did business with people and could hook me up or whatever ....

Jason had a relationship of some kind with a website which took the action...I got a user id etc and Jason handled the money flows....seemingly standard of an agent etc.] Well one day my account was frozen after a few weeks of winning, and I was wondering why it was? Jason was unsure and said he would find out , and told me that the "boss" or..."the site" or whatever, didn't want the action anymore, as apparently they suspected that my action, which did involve some offbeat props etc, was not something they wanted to take.

I said sigh ok whatever, and asked to settle up with what was owed. Jason put me off for a week or 2 but he told me he was in the hospital for knee surgery and he would take care of it soon. I am not going to challenge Jason's word on that...who would lie about that? So I was patient and a week later or so he shipped me online money or whatever...Now that I think about it , it was lock money he sent me loldksjhfsdkfdhkfhsad but ok ok thats fine lol.

Fast forward a year and I reached out to Jason and asked if maybe his guys wanted action again? He told me he would check, and a day later he said sure no problem, and reopened my account. I ran hot again and asked to get paid.

Jason said he would meet me at his bar, or ship money into my boa ...whatever I wanted, the day after he collects from his "guy" which was supposed to be the following tues. I followed up and Jason told me that the guy was a no show, for unknown reasons. Coincidentally, or perhaps not. this was the time when a whole bunch of bookies got arrested, so Jason speculated it was because of this.

A few weeks passed, and eventually Jason told me essentially the same story posted in this thread....the summary being that Chris owed him alot of money, that his bookie left him in the cold, and he couldn't pay what I was owed until Chris paid. He told me straight out that I was 1090% going to get paid, but I would have to be patient, and it would certainly accelerate the process if Chris would pay.

I did reach out to Chris, really just to confirm that Jason's story wasn't BS...Nothing personal against Jason...I just didnt know him very well and I have been around the block, so to speak, and heard alot of stories in my day......I didn't expect or ask Chris to pay me money directly, although I certainly would have accepted that as a result obviously. Chris basically told me exactly what he ended up posting in here, and told me that he was not sure what he was going to do.

I have followed up with Jason every month or so since this time, and he assures me that I am getting paid eventually, and again stresses that Chris's payment drives most of the results here , although, Jason HAS paid me some portion of what I was owed. It certainly is not alot, and certainly does not make up for all of this aggravation, but it certainly demonstrates, to me at least, that Jason for his part wants to do the right thing by everyone.

I also understand that Chris feels victimized in a way, as if he were not famous etc, he would not be pressured in this way to pay, even if he feels he shouldn't due to being freerolled...which may or may not be justified..., due to fear or reputation bashing etc

I actually like both of them, so I really don't want to take "sides" here. I just kind of want to get paid lol.

Hope this helps.


sheets (switzerland)[/QUOTE]

Don't know if I am being captain obvious here, but is this website still functional and can you still log in?
mullion is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 02:08 PM   #1373
dunlap
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,828
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

I knew of one guy at this point and not other 2. Again my timeline could be off as it was over a year ago. We had phone conversations as well during this time. I am not trying to win a thread. I am trying to do what's right. If I am proven wrong I already said I will pay and apologize. No offense to anyone here but not going to spend my day on 2+2 answering questions of people not involved in the situation. I know you all want this gossip but I have agreed to pay if proven wrong and if not pay to charity so there is nothing more I need to discuss unless you have a stake in the situation.
dunlap is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 02:09 PM   #1374
Edgelooker1
grinder
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Bulgogi and Yaki Mandu Avenue
Posts: 650
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Its probably a PPH anyway. They won't give out any names either, of course.
Edgelooker1 is offline  
Old 11-02-2013, 02:10 PM   #1375
JoeSchmo
adept
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,122
Re: moneymaker vs jason young (resolved - see post 497 & 503...and then not - see post 656)

Countdown to CM announcing his 15K donation to the Human Fund.
JoeSchmo is offline  

Closed Thread
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:19 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive