annnnd, ive still yet to see Ziigmund win a dollar on tv. very unimpressive in everything ive seen

I think he's saying "no limit", and "pot limit" omaha. are 2 different things.
No limit pot limit omaha makes no sense.

careful now, the durrrland dwellers may take your comment as an insult.

Got a question. I never watch online play. What's the deal with Ziggmund? Between seeing him on PAD, high stakes poker, and the game, he's gotta be down $2 million or so. Is he really good/big winner at omaha? Or does his money come from somewhere else? How big is this guys BR to be able to loose $2 million on tv in ~1k hands like it's nothing, and be betting 50k a hand on props?

The Ivey-Dwan hand with Td 8d v 8 7o was heavily influenced by the prop bets imo, Dwan knew Ivey was likely re-raising with any two red cards and so he 4 bet .But Ivey knew Dwan could put him on red junk so he retook the inititive and forced Dwan to fold .Brilliant poker.

I get you. Durrrr did make a mistake there at first. He later corrected himself though and called it no limit omaha.

I think Ivey's just pretending to write down the prop bets. In reality he's taking notes on durrr.

he himself admits he's a fish in nlhe

So is he that good in omaha, where he can just throw $2 million away in 1k hands of nlhe, or does he have money from some other venture?

He just keeps trying to ziggy when he should zaggy

Dwan had no reason to ask how much he was playing, he knew Ivey was deep...and it was a 12k pot..plenty of implied odds there, any moron knew that...obvious set up for a bluff imo..and apparently Ivey felt that way as well with the brillant pick off

Absolutely correct...Ivey is so much better than Dwan imo

Dwan made the bluff KNOWING he was out of position to Ivey which makes this an even worse play on Dwans part

Anybody else notice that anytime Howard is in the hand the game just comes to a stop?..he takes SO long to act doing his lil chip dance is like watching paint dry

I'm not going to evaluate his skills since I'm not capable of doing that, but Ville Wahlbeck says the following:
"Ilari is definitely one of the best PLO players in the world. His A-game is simply amazing. His reads are exceptional, and he plays so tough he makes even the strongest opponents look like weak-tight nits compared to him. In heads up he dominates the play totally if his confidence is up and he is able to play his best game. On the other hand, his game is always teetering on the brink of insanity. If his A-game is not working, his B-game is often worse than many players' Z-game. And his C-game is not just tilting, it's more like chip dumping. When that happens, he is just giving his money away, and afterwards he cries his shirt wet and then complains to everybody who listens how he must be the unluckiest player that ever lived."

Can't say anything about how properly rolled he is for the swings but he is up several millions and has set aside enough to live the rest of his life easily.

durrrr looked super exhausted. I don't think he played his best game on yesterday's show.

Ziigmund is up 3.5 million online over 325k hands. this is dating back to the start of 2007, and the majority of that is from plo.

All these ppl itt who say durrr is on another level....his sick 4bets with air and post flop bluffs arent really working in THIS game...theres a BIG difference between sitting at a PAD cash table with laak, hellmuth and friggin bob safai as opposed to Patrik and Ivey...he knows this! you can tell by the way he is playing that he has a huuuge level of respect for ivey and pa's game whereas in the earlier games he was pretty much cocky KNOWING he could just outplay everyone at the table including Kenny tran and Antonio who are both great great players...this time its a lil bit different becuz ivey and company cant be bullied and a huge part of dwans game is that intimidation factor...can u imagine him trying that overbet shove on the river he did on safai vs. ivey?? lol ivey would snap him..just like he did against ziggy's 50k bet...btw that call deserves waaaay more love...im pretty sure 99% of 2+2 wouldve folded in that spot...its just such a sick crazy call that i dont think its getting the credit it deserves...to do that he had to put ziggy on EXACTLY 98...and as far as Eli being a fish?? lol he plays in bobbys room all the time...but they hardly ever play nlhe...hes a very good mix games player...so ppl calling him a fish yet defending Zig's play is pretty absurd...Zig's play has been worse than Eli's...his bluff vs. PA's trips wasnt just bad timing guys it was just BAD! obviously with hole cards its way easier to say that...but just judgin from this session (yeah sample size watever) PA has not been getting out of line at all...he's been showing down the
goods alot and Illari didnt seem to put any thought behind that bluff..he just thought im gonna bluff with air here and take it down...if youre gonna bluff anybody at this table HOWARD ftw! the other guys are not gonna back down at least dwan is smart enough to realize this..and yes that T8 vs. 78 hand gave me a hard on! weeeeeeeeee /rant

Ninja EDit!!!! NOT!

Yeah cuz Ivey is just gonna pay off 51k when the straight hits right?? lol...come on man its Phil Ivey! Im sure we've all played against guys who are gonna pay off HUGE when teh straight hits BUT to think that Ivey is gonna pay off the river when the biggest reason he called is because he was able to peg Zig on 98 is pretty wierd thinking on your part...so no he doesnt have implied odds to hit his straight...a raise at sum point wouldve been a much better way to play sais me who has never played with more than 2k at a table before and durrr saying "no limit PLO" was kinda funny Eli was like HUH??

the call with the 10 2 that ivey made vs ziig was pretty easy tbh. ziigmund cant really represent anything except k10. also the fact that ziig went into the tank forever and then finally bet the pot kinda gave it away too, he would get more folds if he bet something like 32k into the 50k pot imo.

Last night had to be the worst episode of Props After Dark yet:
- Phil Ivey paying more attention to props than to the game
- Durrrr missing for first 15 minutes
- Antonius and Ziigmund talking in Finnish (no subtitles?)
- Durrrr asking Antonius for wasabi while Antonius is playing a hand
- Elezra grumpy and irritable
- Howard Lederer

no. Precisely because he is out of position he has to bluff 4 bet instead of just calling the 3 bet.

He has to reduce the stack to pot ratio so that he doesn't have to play multiple streets with Ivey when Ivey has position on him and has initiative.

Calling Ivey's 3 bet there with 87o is beyond horrible.

I'm not saying you're wrong but I'm curious, do you know he's set aside a lot of cash or are you guessing?

He said so in the 2+2 Pokercast.

By the way, it seems that everybody is using the check raising monsters on dangerous flops in spots where they would normally lead out trick and they are getting paid off big.