Such a great example of why free markets and competition are great for consumers. The lack of those things in Tampa obviously craps on the customer. It sucks that they don't seem to realize that making some player friendly changes would most likely still make them more $ overall.

I was talking with a few people lately about the games in Biloxi. I have not played there, but I hear they are among the sickest 1/2 and 2/5 games anywhere. I will 100% stop there and play if I am traveling through. In fact, I will probably plan a trip just to go play there at some point. Now, if I was not from Tampa and passing through, I probably would not stop and play due to the lack of great reputation. I certainly would not plan a trip to Tampa just to play poker.

How can they not see that making the games more "standard" would be better for them overall? Do they not see that different structures are more prevalent because they work in favor of both the player and house? This stuff is not zero sum. Changes can be made to benefit both the customer and the business. That is how some of the biggest, most successful companies in the world have come to be.

Hopefully Tampa will get a destination casino or two if/when legislation goes through and the compact expires. This should make things much more player friendly in the area.

Bowser, thank you, you have summarized 95% of the reason I avoid THR at all costs. that plus the fact they try to be a casino but make you pay for drinks. What's the matter, half a billion in profit isn't good enough? Not to mention the fact that every Seminole citizen is getting handsomely paid in dividends from the gambling profit millions in federal aid are still given to them. All that and they have VERY little regulation. I personally cannot wait for other casinos to start building in Florida and put them out of business.

This article was written in 2006 and gives some insight into the business. I can only imagine how much they are making now.

http://www.sptimes.com/News2/seminol...yone/main.html

I stated the management there doesn't have a clue really in all aspects of poker and probably business too. With that said and them not currently listening, how would you go about trying to bring about changes?

Browser I totally agree with what you said if we are dealing a well run operation. But since its not, wouldn't written stuff taken to higher ups be more beneficial. Is the current system working? We are not dealing with HHR or the Isle. Thinking that you can approach the HRT the same way is laughable and it should be obvious that it won't work, but people still try to do it.

To them this is just some silly internet poker forum with poker geeks. They have no understanding of the 2+2 and how powerful of a tool it can be. So I don't fault them. I don't fault people for being stupid. I'm patient and try to teach or work with them.

Sorry guys, but it just annoys the hell out of me that the biggest room is crappy as hell and the player base in Tampa cannot bring about needed changes when we are the knowledgeable ones.

Futile effort TW. I have been making suggestions to management for years, even back when the poker room was in that smokey barn in the back. They don't care. Even when they lose money, they don't care. Look at when the old SNG's used to run alllll day and night, they upped the rake and people stopped playing them as much. They didn't bother change the buy-in and rake back to where it was. Same thing with their tournaments, the old $355+$45 Sunday deep stack was the nuts, 180-220 runners every week for years, and then they decided to make the structure so bad that people abruptly stopped playing it. You would think they would change it back... Nope. THR is a litany of getting everything dead wrong, despite obvious changes in gross revenues and constant customer complaints.

Paging Jack of Rock..........

Paging Jack of Rock..........

I think it would be worthwhile if you checked this forum daily and responded one way or another to requests. Even if the response is just, "We'll look into that and get back to you by xx date."

Right now it looks like you only joined the thread to promote the WPT event and not address player concerns.

I don't disagree with you that given the current situation, we made need to put our complaints in writing. What tilts me is that all the times I've spoken to management, no one has EVER said to me, "you know, you should put that it writing, it will help us make the change". I just figured they would take player issues up the chain.

TBH I'm now wondering if even putting it in writing will make any difference. If management isn't interested in what the players have to say, it may not make much difference if it's verbal or in writing.

Does anyone know who the actual decision maker is on poker room policy? Who is the highest ranking manager who actually appears on the floor? Who is that person's boss? I guess when I say "up the chain" I don't really know exactly who that is. It just seems like it all goes into a black hole.

Ok, this is speculation ( I don't want to be accused of spreading false information) but I think there is an older gentleman named Henry who is the top boss of the room. I've seen him once or twice and I swear he's mentioned he's the room director. I could be 100% wrong, and sure I'm going to be flamed by the masses if o am, but iirc that's his name, and from what I heard he's not on the floor much.

Jack of Rock/whoever said we are "whiny 2+2'ers" should probably consider the fact that you draw a paycheck, at least partly, from the play of the members here. People may take offense to that comment and the lack of representation that's been showed since you joined and decide to play elsewhere. Look at it from an outsiders point of view, a poker room rep joined a forum full of the most knowledgeable poker players claiming:

The questions/comments from that point on continued to pile up with no response. People grow increasingly irritated by the lack of representation from a guy who introduced himself saying one thing, but doing almost the opposite. Your 'presence' here, if anything, has alienated customers. I now feel like management doesn't care what the customers have to say and are adding a **** you on top. Conducting business in this fashion pushes people away, which in turn could lead to somebody losing their job. I'm not sure all those suits are needed to stand around the room anyway.

qft....even if they did listen to customers, first on the list would be the grinders at the hothotpenny and wheel of fortune slots....not the poker tables

Just to clarify, the whiny comment came from numerous private conversations i have had with staff.

This does include some dealers and supers.

Jack of Rock or whoever that is(i don't know them) never said that. I do agree that Jack needs to step up and be a rep. The once a week popup isn't going to fly.

Which further proves that they don't see the value of this forum. Jack either doesn't realize, know how, or feel the need to do more here.

Pretty sure I can say who it is as it is public info, but mods please delete if I'm not. Henry Funky runs the room, I cannot recall seeing him on the floor more than twice in 10+ years. Based on seniority I would think the scottish or british or whatever with a first name that starts with J should be top dog on the floor.

nah he's #2(scottish guy). i forget the name of #1 on the floor. Because the #1 supervisor came over one day and made a ruling and i asked for a different supervisor and he said he is the #1 guy on the floor. Supervisor with name beginning with "B" came over who knows I'm a reg and I asked him if a player requests a second supervisor floor decision can he get one, and he said no because the other guy was #1.

FWIW, I think the floor is a group of pretty nice people overall, but have made some poor rulings in the past.

Funke. He came from Gary IN Trump Casino which is now Majestic Star back in 06 or so. Big Blinds and I have a lot of knowledge and reasons why the poker room is the way it is. The basic reason is Jim Allen and Max Osceola realize the bottom line is maximized with slot square footage and other class 3 gaming solutions. Trickle down economics allows poker to live as a courtesy to customers who may possibly spend money in the high profit areas.

I could elaborate more as to why this place is not out front leading in poker but it just isn't worth the additional typed characters.

Correct PS. Damn autocorrect. What really amazes me is that more people haven't voted with their feet. It's not like there aren't three competing rooms within 20 minutes or less.

This is certainly true, but it is also true for every casino. That doesn't stop other casinos from having well run rooms and improving the poker experience by listening to/incorporating player feedback. If that's done, then it's win/win. The poker room still won't be a profit leader, but could do better than it does now.

+1

I mean PS is it really possible that the higherups are that dense as to not try and improve a multimillion dollar wing of their operation for more profits?

Why have it in the first place if you are not going to try an at least maximize its potential earnings when its already establish you can have other higher generating revenue things occupying the space?

Well its obvious why there is a I dont care attitude with alot of staff in the room. Seems like a trickle down effect from the higherups unless it involves pointless protocol rules.

What do you guys think about a petition with a list of changes the customers would want with maybe a few hundred signatures?

I would definitely go for it. As you said, the current method isn't working. Jack of Rock is a total joke. I agree with the sentiment that they chosen not to give their name to avoid responsibility. If we get a bunch of regulars to sign something and give it to a head floor (I know the black lady whose name starts with an L is a higher-up floor, she's been here for eighteen years) maybe we'll get more results. It can't hurt, anyhow.

While I agree with you the main difference between othe casinos and this one is obvious: The Seminoles do not have competition. They have the only class 3 gaming in town. They can do what they want.

Any PLO list going now?

The players here already received a brand new room relocated to a less premium gaming square footage area. Why do you think this occurred? It is because they wanted the space for slots and probably did cost analysis and realized the additional slots in the old card room area would pay for the new card room costs in a month of gaming.

Look at Hollywood- they moved the poker room out of the casino entirely! It is in an old club/ bar whatever.

Yeah, but even in an old club/bar they are still running promotions that are decades beyond what they are doing here in Tampa. They have a representative on here that responds to people and listens. Does he always do what they want? No, but at least the perception is that he cares (except for the issue with deposit boxes, that seemed to be a sore subject ) The tournaments seem to be promoted well and well received from my understanding, while here in Tampa, they are an afterthought. Even with this hastily put together WPT event, and I will say it seems like it was hastily put together, all tournaments at 11am? No real variety except for a Limit O8, a 6max and then just straight NLHE. Derby Lane at least has a little more variety, a mix NLHE/PLO, 6max, LHE, AND a wide range of buy-ins. I can play a 170, 245 355.... other than the re-entry tournaments, everything at THR seems to be 400 or more.

Poker is a second class citizen for most casinos, I get that. But it can be a money generator, if done well. For one month, try the promotions that HHR has in Tampa and see the overflow of people flock to the room. This will put Derby Lane, The Silks, even Lucky's on their toes to do something in response and finally poker competition comes to the Tampa Bay Area.

Andy,

While I agree with you that Hollywood has better communication on here because William has made it a priority, poker still struggles for equity in Hollywood. Just recently The Rock and Roll Series was relegated to the poker room I stead of the ball room which was a huge success last series. The attendance was clearly way off for this series due partly to the lack of the ball room venue. Apparently the ball room was not available.

The jackpot in Hollywood has 100% more funding. This offers more flexibility in promotions and giveaways.

But even if everything was identical regarding resources in Tampa amd Hollywood I feel Hollywood has the edge based on the willingness of Mr. Mason amd his crew to listen to their players and offer changes based on feedback.

I agree with the poster who said Jack of Rock is a gimmick so management at Tampa cannot be held accountable or be visible. Until they decide to take customer service seriously by offering an actual person to interact with, THR will not improve, and Derby and Silks will have plenty of opportunities to gain customers.