IIRC, $150 an hour is correct. But at $6 a person time rake for 2/5 PLO 9 handed, it's only $108 an hour and then less when you get short. Also, PLO does not get 30 hand an hour. The real problem is when you don't have a full table and how you would keep the list and who's in charge. That works fine when you have a weekly game with a specific person running it who's there all the time, but it's not really viable with a game that runs every day, often with 2 tables.

Any more info you can give on the colluders, i.e. details of who they are and how they're colluding? This sounds pretty messed up. I would hope Scott or somebody could look into it and warn them to stop (if not ban them right away, but it depends how innocuous a form of soft-playing it is -- i.e. maybe they are friends who are too clueless to know better and just need to be confronted by management)

See post 7412 in this thread, the conversation carries on for a couple of pages about it.

I'm new in town. I just recently moved back to Tampa and haven't lived here since I was a boy so I don't remember much. I played in the 2/5 PLO but didn't notice much soft-playing--just a lot of generally bad play.

Is anyone interested in hanging out at all and/or talking cards that plays at hard rock often? PM me.

Don't forget that you can deduct gambling losses to the extent of gambling winnings. So keep track of your losses for the rest of the year, and you'll be able to offset at least some of this.

Of course, you're also supposed to claim all your winnings, so the question is always if you want to risk opening that box with the guys in D.C....("Yes, I won $10K in one tournament but then lost $15K the rest of the year...")

At least talk to an accountant and see what the rules are. (I'm a lawyer, but not a tax lawyer, so I won't pretend to know all the specifics - and there are some.)

I keep track of everything electronically, but after talking with some other players apparently the physical paper slips are supposed to be kept track of, not just app data?

Any Insight on this?

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The IRS has a publication on this. Generally, the rule is that you have to provide receipts, tickets, statements etc. to show losses and gains, and you have to itemize to claim the deduction. The actual publication is IRS Publication 529. http://www.irs.gov/publications/p529/index.html

Pertinent part cut and pasted below. Again, I am NOT an authority on this. Check with your accountant, but this is not all that complicated. I'd guess even most chain prep services would be able to help (although if you're itemizing, I'd strongly recommend paying a "real" professional a few hundred dollars to do it).

Gambling Losses Up to the Amount of Gambling Winnings

You must report the full amount of your gambling winnings for the year on Form 1040, line 21. You deduct your gambling losses for the year on Schedule A (Form 1040), line 28. You cannot deduct gambling losses that are more than your winnings. Generally, nonresident aliens cannot deduct gambling losses on Schedule A (Form 1040NR).

You cannot reduce your gambling winnings by your gambling losses and report the difference. You must report the full amount of your winnings as income and claim your losses (up to the amount of winnings) as an itemized deduction. Therefore, your records should show your winnings separately from your losses.

Diary of winnings and losses. You must keep an accurate diary or similar record of your losses and winnings.

Your diary should contain at least the following information.

The date and type of your specific wager or wagering activity.

The name and address or location of the gambling establishment.

The names of other persons present with you at the gambling establishment.

The amount(s) you won or lost.

Proof of winnings and losses. In addition to your diary, you should also have other documentation. You can generally prove your winnings and losses through Form W-2G, Certain Gambling Winnings, Form 5754, Statement by Person(s) Receiving Gambling Winnings, wagering tickets, canceled checks, substitute checks, credit records, bank withdrawals, and statements of actual winnings or payment slips provided to you by the gambling establishment.

For specific wagering transactions, you can use the following items to support your winnings and losses.

These recordkeeping suggestions are intended as general guidelines to help you establish your winnings and losses. They are not all-inclusive. Your tax liability depends on your particular facts and circumstances.

...Table games (twenty-one (blackjack), craps, poker, baccarat, roulette, wheel of fortune, etc.). The number of the table at which you were playing. Casino credit card data indicating whether the credit was issued in the pit or at the cashier's cage.

Tax inquiries see a CPA. But, if you absolutely must take your tax advice from the internet please see this thread:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/57...-poker-740589/

I couldn't agree more (which is why I think I told him three times in 2 posts to see an accountant). It's always good to remember the oft-quoted fact that it was the IRS that got Capone...

And get a CPA vs. a tax lawyer. They live the day-to-day specifics more than MOST tax lawyers, and so are usually the better option.

I think I pay around $2,500 a year to have my taxes done and for what I get it's some of the best money I spend all year.

I plan on getting them done professionally no worries but was just wondering in the mean time lol. Appreciate the help

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I was just going over my book for last year, and had a session marked as suspected cheating.

I play all over the country, and even though I mostly live in Tampa I play very rarely here in public games. The game I had marked was in October in the 2/5PLO at THR. Glad to read I was right, and not just really tired and/or really drunk.

Should be around Tampa for next month or so, I may go out to that game just to **** with them.

Congrats on the score TampaGrinder . FYI, i'm the big guy always wearing a black polo hoodie at the table. Last FT we were at was when they were busting your balls for wanting a chip chop once you went from shorty to chip leader lol. Nice to see someone decent "take it down".

Ah yes, the chop birds always like to come out and bash on people who don't wanna chop, lol. If I would have had any chip lead in this one I would have likely held out for more, but the immediate lock up of 10k and having a decent 2/5 roll was important to me.

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I am pretty sure I would have said no if they said no to 10k for me. 10 way chops are pretty bad but I had work next day so I was decided in my mind that if I get 10k I am good to go.
btw apart from 2 guys, that final table is soft and we have perfect stacks to fight even if they didn't agree for our deal.
I just need to worry about your run-good streak. it was like watching Jerry yang when u get it in :-P you ran hotter than sun brother :-D


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Yeah the top people had decent fighting stacks so I didn't mind playing but locking things up was fine by me. Bout time I run good though, ran terrible all last year so hopefully this is the uptick, although I played well the whole tourney, you guys jus happened to see 2 of the sickest hands. AQs was nasty, 88 vs AA short stack was standard IMO and I jus luckboxed it.

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your aq vs jj vs AK was difference between 10k$ and less that 1k$ finish :-) he got u covered and that was prolly biggest pot in tourney at that stage. but then that's how u ship tourneys :-D
that guy took it like a champ. props to him he didn't tilt and slowly made it to final table.


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He handled it very well and was a super solid player. I've been discussing the hand with some other friends idk if I could call it off in that spot facing a 4bet shove from the sb for most of your chips. Good call by him, terrible run out. Def the hand of the tourney for me tho, insane roller coaster ride.

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What was the hand? "Could I get away from it?" discussions are always interesting.

chipleader opens early, late pos 15-20bb stack shoves, tampagrinder is in blinds I think, with like 50bb-60bb (he need to correct me if I am wrong) reshoved with AQss. Chipleader tank called with AKcc.
guy who 3Bet shove had JJ.
that was the biggest pot for sure at that stage. AQss backdoored a flush to scoop that colossal pot and never looked back.

before that he made standard call (raise call?) with 88 and villain had qq. 88>qq for nice pot.

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"Tight" guy opens in EP to 60k at 10/20k 5k ante level, short stack who I've played with since day 1 shoves for 212k, I wake up with AQss in the sb..And tank 4bet reshove for 636k thinking EP Will obviously open wider than the 2% of hands that will call a 4bet reshove.. he's sitting on 1mil ish stack, with 60k invested.. what is Ur calling range? ..

He tanks and calls with AKcc and shorty has Jacks.

FLOP: 835s Turn: 8s River: 6s ship - biggest single pot of the tourney nasty backdoor ftw.

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Left the house, headed to the Hard Rock, and it was like 85 degrees out. "No need for my jacket today!".......WRONG. It was about 25 degrees in the poker room, and Im the only fool in there wearing shorts and a t shirt.

Wanted to play PLO, but then I remembered hearing about the colluders from this thread, so played 3 6 hi/lo instead. Think I was the only person under 65 years old at the table. Those old timers all seem like good people though, no whining or complaining, and fun to play with.

I think calling > shoving there. You're already cold-calling a raise and a shove, which looks super strong. If he's tight, he's probably throwing away suited A's, KQ, QJ and small pairs even to the 212k.

You allow 88-TT (probably) to see a flop by calling, but most people play pretty straightforward postflop with an all-in in these spots.... so it should be pretty easy to identify where you are in the hand after the flop. Shoving sort of turns your hand into a bluff, since EP is never calling with worse, whereas he might come along with ATs/AJs if you just call. So basically, calling gives EP the chance to make a mistake, whereas shoving lets him play perfectly vs. you.

Just my two cents, but I'm glad it worked out either way .

I intended my shove to be strong enough for him to fold all but qq+? Maybe ak?.. but I think calling is jus meh, putting it 1/3 of our stack oop multiway jus smells bad, and if we brick flop we likely won't see all 5, which I'm a fish for lol. Plus if we flat and EP reshoves were SOL.

It's Def a weird spot and Im no where near a sicko at tourneys by any means but I'd like to see what more ppl think about that and the maths lol

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Just how much wider than AK, JJ, QQ, KK or AA do you think the "TIGHT" player raises from EP when there is a short stack in the blinds? AQs obv fold, imo. Looks pretty, but you are facing a raise and a reraise just short of the big money. Both those players are likely to have top hands. AQ isn't even a pair. I don't think I even would want to be in a coin flip against SB for 1/3 my stack at that point. Find a better spot.

The shorty shoves from the CO. I'm in the sb. Also at this point I didn't know he was tight, he called a raise vs me with q4s but I hadn't seen his opening range showdown, plus with a 1mil chip stack I feel like he would def be opening wider than top 5 hands..JT,KQ,Axs, small pairs, etc, are all in his range imo.

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