Another one of his mates who can't see the woods for the trees.

Why am I a douche, because I called you out for being an idiot and believing him all this time?

I'm not siding one way or the other. I think there are many solid arguments for both leaving the site up, or taking it down. I'm simply pointing out that you're jumping on the lynch mob band-wagon because you're clearly excited about the prospect of digging the knife in as deep as possible. Says a lot about your character.

Add me to the growing list of people who have you on ignore. What's the common denominator here? Is it you, or is it us?

If you think me digging the knife in to a guy who's scammed a charity and made his 'friends' look like complete morons, makes me a bad person... Then please add me to ignore, and never view my posts.

Ok lets get back to the points Zima brought up:

Can anyone get an accurate figure on what we think Bogan stole from the staking organizations he worked for? I realize it is a **** ton of work to go through conversations/deals and that he can easily lie/make up skype logs. He needs to do this with moderation from an impartial party. Yarbles unfortunately might not be in the best position or want to give his side of things right now, but we have to be able to get a more accurate figure than "I dont know 20-50k" somehow down by going through actual audits. If he is not willing to do this, and yarbles is reasonably confident he stole $20-50k from him, I see no reason why the site should ever be taken down.

Who is dean going to be sending this $100 a week repayment schedule? Can he explain why he is still going out with friends, drinking, when he can only spare $100 a week (according to his own twitter)? The average price of a beer in Australia is about $7-8 or so, assuming he has 4 beers, there is another $30 or so that could have gone to a charity (when we throw in cab, his drinking habits, i don't see how $50-60 is unreasonable too). Dean, why do you continue to go out to drink, go out to eat, and live your life "normally" when you can only spare $100 a week? It will take you over a year to repay the charity on this payment plan, do you plan on making up for the fact that due purely to inflation, the money you give will not even be worth as much then as it is now?

Finally someone speaking some sense.

This is why I'm being so harsh in this thread, because if anyone actually took themselves out of the situation and looked at it from an impartial viewpoint - it becomes pretty clear that Dean won't be able to pay this back, he's just trying to save face.

I really liked Dean after reading his well. He came across as a guy who'd been through some difficult times and come out the other side as a really good person and I was quite touched by how much he loved his family.

I know a lot of people here have known him for years and consider(ed) him to be a good friend and a stand up guy but that image just doesn't match up with some of the facts that have come to light itt. If his only discrepancy was losing the charity money and being slow to make it right i'd be fine with letting him off easily but it seems he has run multiple fairly large scams where he ripped off his friends without feeling any guilt and without trying to make reparations down the line. It's also likely that in at least one instance he scared them into keeping quiet about it.

The decision about whether to take down the website or not is a trade off between making sure the money gets repaid and letting possible future victims know about him but I don't think there can be any doubt that bogan is a serial scammer and not a good person.

I would never have imagined I would be making this post a couple of months ago after reading his well and playing the charity event.

This is a very insular and therefore morally flawed stance to adopt.

I would never of called him a mate, actually the only thing I had to do with Dean was obtaining a staking deal and forwarding a message to him from one of his horses because I live in the same country as him.

Some of your posts are ridic though. I totally agree with leaving the website up for the period of time it takes to pay back all funds that are owed, and if this doesn't happy i think the site should stay up.

what are the solid points for taking the website down at any point? the consensus to keep the website up seems to be to warn people who he may deal with in the future of what he has done in the past.

this time the fall out is that a charity hasn't got a donation (not making light of this at all). what if next time it is a family run business he screws over, it could have monumental affects on a lot of people. or even if it is a multi-national other people may get blamed, lose jobs etc as a result.

he obv may have learnt his lesson and never scam again but ultimately it is tough sh*t. innocent people should be afforded the knowledge of what he has done if they are going to engage with him.

Others have already posted some reasons why taking the website down might be appropriate if and when Dean makes this right.

Like I said, I'm not sold one way or the other. There just seems to be some people who want to go to the nth degree to string him up not to protect future people he may deal with, but because they enjoy the drama.

Ok, you pick out one part of my post where I was talking in a general sense. "Treat people with the amount of respect they deserve". That doesn't mean we have to give him mad respect or anything. Don't twist what I say as me supporting him.

I only came in here purely to address the idiocy you were spewing that may affect the rest of us Australians. But you continue to prove you're just here to argue and try to present yourself as an upstanding individual so pure in his beliefs and morals (aka. Sitting on your high horse).

Just stop being an idiot.

can people stop feeding the trolls?


they will just keep spewing garbage if you keep engaging them.

+1000 and to your other posts man

bogan posting in this thread is not gonna save his rep, but it seems like the chances of repayment are better then they were a week ago

stop getting involved ehhh esp with threats or reporting to govt and re erecting site if it was too be taken down in the future, you have nothing to do with with, (I knew Dean and am an Aussie), so seriously ehh why you trying to stir **** up, as mjw said causing **** for ppl who have good reps and families to feed

btw, bogan go **** yourself, you fkn idiot,

Firstly, you picked out one small comment in my long post that was prefaced with IMO. The other parts of your post were paranoid nonsense, I'm not saying I'm reporting him, but if someone did, nobody would ever know... You think it will spread around the country about the scumbag poker player?.. No, of course it wouldn't, it would be dealt with by the benefit office and/or police, it is, after all, a crime.

Like I said, it was a suggestion, I never said I was going to do it.

I've said similar things to you, so I don't know wtf you're talking about.

What are you talking about? Who am I causing **** for that is innocent here?

Don't twist my words, try and read my post, I clearly said IMO he should be reported... At no point did I make a 'threat' to do it.

.

we don't drink that ghey imported ****! $4/beer

Is this guy really trolling? It really seems like he's being sincere.

Also, there seems to be a disconnect. While there are a few people who seem to think the site should be taken down, most of us are just saying to keep the possibility open depending on how things go. There's a group pf people who seem to think we all want the thread taken down now, or in the near future.

I don't think the thread should ever go but there are definitely ways this can play out where I'd think his name should be removed.

I don't get why people bring up the legal arguments. Who gives a **** what does happen to criminals, all that matters is what should happen to criminals(Dean being one). Imo, after paying their "debt to society", they should absolutely have the opportunity for some sort of normal life. How normal would depend on the crime and how they've made amends.

The real questions are, what constitutes making amends and how public should their past be, once amends are made.

I don't really know how I feel about the non-charity allegations. I completely agree it should be left up to those directly affected to decide if it should be made public (that said I'd certainly understand if someone uninvolved felt compelled to come forward without permission). Even if all the charity stuff is resolved(whatever that entails) there should still be a thread and site up with these other allegations. Without the charity info for context, I don't think it would have the same effect.

So, yea, I guess I don't think this can ever be "resolved" without, at least, some confirmation from a trusted 3rd party on the staking stuff.

People want to take the site down in hopes to have a higher chance to get some money back(giving him incentive).

People don`t want this to have any "publicity" because poker(-players) would get into a bad light, thus hurting their bottomline.

Talk about morals.

Site should stay up obv.

Any of this being reasonable is liberal bull****. Deano you are clearly a world-class clown and bottom-feeder.

$100 a week from your benefits? Get a grip you cripple and go get some jobs. Well thats what you should do, but seen as you only showed up after things got real id put the chances of you sorting any of this out at ~5%. Almost all of that is if you get lucky and walk into/steal enough money to comfortably pay off the debts and still have enough left over to buy pies.

Scammers are a blight on poker and should be dealt with in the harshest possible terms. I seriously doubt giving leeway and chances to people has ever made anyone pay back who wouldnt have anyway. And if they wouldnt **** them. It should be made clear its a bad move to scam people through online poker dealings because of the consequences.

Everyone agrees there should be consequence. The argument is about the type and severity of consequence.

Yeh I dont doubt it. However, I think they should be the harshest possible really, and its not close at all.

There are obv grey areas with people who make a single mistake, and yes things can snowball. But everything ITT leads me to believe Dean is just an intensely dislikeable waster who took advantage of a lot of gullable people.

I mean refusing to send account audits to stakers he works for wtf??

You don't keep striking bargains with people who have a history of repeatedly doing the wrong thing. They're most likely to keep doing wrong things no matter what, and the ones who will do the right thing don't need to be prepaid on the incentive.

This is kind of missing the point. In the scenario the site is taken down he has done the right thing.

At this end of the line, dean is a scumbag. That's just a useful label, though. The reality is he is a complex individual with many faults but probably some good qualities, too. He's probably had a hard life, life is hard enough in the best of circumstance. That's not an excuse but its a reason I have compassion for him (and for murderers and for rapists, etc etc.).

He has a shot at turning his life around (again). One of the ways is to show him that just giving up isn't his only option. If he works hard and legit convinces a community full of cynical poker players that he has changed, the site will come down and he may have a chance at a respectable life.

I'm not asking anyone to shed tears for this guy, I'm certainly not. But there's probably some people in the community who are pretty torn up about this. I just don't see any reason to be uncivil.

the site should never come down. people can write that he made good on the site when the time comes, but to ever take the site down would be a terrible decision.

Dont think the site will ever come down though.


Dean used to talk to me about scammers and how they sucked and how the backing community needed to out them. he came up with this idea there should be some "master list" for backers to all post the scammers on.


its really quite comical when you think about all the stuff he spewed.

I would be all for a "master list" and I wouldn't ever want names removed.