nah, that's not a theory I'm aware of and it seems quite a stretch. Dean's money issues only came to a head once he returned from the trip.

I guess detailed cliffs are necessary, I'll see if anyone fancies helping me summarise all this ****. Super disappointed that after our chat last week Dean has disappeared again.

i have no problem editing cliffs/summary into the first post of the thread, but someone is going to have to come up with a readable version of everything that has happened

Did he definitely scam some of his stable? The website says something about $20k?

Confused as to why there hasn't been anyone outing him for staking scams ITT, someone definitely needs to compile cliffs soon because this whole thing is very confusing atm.

It's definitely become clear that the only reason he came clean was to try and get rid of the website, as soon as he realised it won't happen - he dissapears again. He never gave a **** about what he did, I hope all the people defending the fact he came clean, and arguing for removing the website now realise this. It's clear he'll be scamming someone again soon.

Feel like I ought to clarify. I'm not willingly/maliciously holding back any info, as my only involvement in this has been as a conduit between Dean and the affected parties. The reason I haven't posted a specific summary of the info I have is simply that the people who've spoken to me have asked me not to divulge their private dealings in public.

What I can say is there's no evidence that Dean stole from any of his horses at any time, nor is there anything to suggest that he was involved in anything untoward prior to returning from his world tour. There's a (disputed) allegation that he scammed his friends/business partners for a 5-figure sum last autumn, which will hopefully be resolved privately. There are also other issues relating to private staking relationships more recently, plus a few outstanding private debts. And of course the headline act, the charity money. But I ought to repeat that there's nothing I'm aware of that suggests Dean scammed any of the players he was involved in staking, so hopefully that will allay the concerns of the many players who may have been worried about their own potential losses.

Hey all. Don't really wanna get involved in all this too much but I just got a message from Dean, the end of which was "can u let ppl know ill be back on thurs and ill be sending through some money".

I think if Dean pays back what he owes or dies then the site can come down.

"When somebody commits a crime, after serving their punishment, they have a criminal record. The site staying up is, in a sense, his 'criminal record'.

To only blacklist him in the poker community is completely flawed logic, you're allowing him to scam people in other communities."

I feel like this summarizes my thoughts on taking the site down. People need to know when they will have potential disasters in front of them, why not help out your fellow man and let people know who may be susceptible to be scumbaggish behavior.

When/If he comes to an arrangement that he satisfies his obligations to the poker community, then at that point update the site with the final conclusions of the situation.

dean/bogan gives poker players a bad name and should never be trusted by anyone. i've been scammed twice by poker players, and it sucks. the community doesn't like it but there are degens everywhere and even among the top tier of 'pros' in australia I can think of several scammers who continue to show up to live events with no consequences (sam youssef apparently, allegedly brendan rubie if monsterdong is to be believed, drrunsick, plus the constant stream of people borrowing money with no means to pay it back (sam khouiss))

these peoples actions are a blight on the game and excuses must not be made for them until they make it right

site stays up, if he repays funds, that information is added to the website. maybe he pays extra to the charity, and we get confirmation he has repaid the people he scammed then the whole story gets told and in time he can work towards some level of redemption

also eh777 keep the government out of this, it could adversely affect other australian poker players, we have anti-gambling zealots like wilkie and xenophon who would LOVE the opportunity to ban poker in australia and this would fuel their cause, and the status quo is quite comfortable for australian online poker players right now (myself included).

also people who stood up for bogan without knowing the facts early ITT should probably post apologies/retractions now that they have been proven wrong and it has come to light that bogan4life/dean bryden is a thief, a scammer and a degenerate

bogan: i never had any dealings with you, you always struck me as an annoying personality on 4L even though I mostly lurked, what you have done is stealing, and your behaviour after the fact borders on sociopathic. make it right, or if you have no intention of making it right then i hope you die alone, broke and miserable like most scammers will.

lol at apologizing for thinkin you had a trusted friend and were worried about their well being. What are you 6?

what are the thoughts on the power of these outing-a-scammer sites being used to seek just a personal vendetta?

example?

i think entim is referring to people in this thread lobbying for the site to stay up indefinitely because they've had run ins with bogan in the past.

I have no personal relationship with Dean. I think the site should remain up forever with resolution posted on the site if it ever happens.

I just feel that the more successful these sites are for their current purpose that if someone was cooked enough to out a poker player or similar who had done nothing wrong whatsoever they could easily get away with it. I suppose a response to that is that you could just reciprocate until you have internet slandering mexican standoff

QFT

Site has to be taken down if following conditions are met:

a. funds are paid back
b. over a certain period of time, he demonstrates a change

After a certain point, leaving the site up doesn't even make sense. So if he paid everything back, that is updated. If he goes on to regain credibility, is all of that also going to be updated on a regular basis on the site? For how long?

Morally, its a no-brainer to take the site down eventually.

However, seems like he is a long way from meeting those conditions so that's still the first step.

Site should stay for a minimum of 7 years.

Why does it make no sense for the site to stay up? If it comes down he's basically got away with scamming a charity, like I've said before, this is the equivalent of a criminal record, to stop him scamming other community's.

It's so illogical to take the website down, it sets a precedent that you can steal from the community and essentially take a loan from everyone without their permission, with no repercussions - as long as you pay it back.

If he pays everything back, it will be updated... End of, there won't be more updates, and you're delusional if you think he can regain credibility after this.

Morally it's a no brainier to keep the site up, where do morals come into play by taking down the website?

Thought I mentioned I'm not advocating taking the site down immediately. The person has to take steps to repair his reputation, eventually then.

Not sure anyone can write it off as "he's never going to regain credibility after this," it has happened before.

I'm overall on this side of the issue but it's a bit early as no one knows how it will turn out.

This is the main problem I have with keeping the site up in the event of Dean repaying. It's not supposed to be a form of punishment, and it's not our duty to permanently document Dean's (or anyone's) transgressions for the good of mankind. To those who insist the site should stay up forever, do you believe that everyone who ever committed any crime should also have their own website? If not, where do you draw the line? And what gives you the right to make such a call?

The current situation is that Dean has stolen charity money and most likely also stolen from some of his staking partners and friends, he's communicated terribly and there's no immediate solution in sight. Having the website up right now is absolutely right, and if he never resolves the situation then it should stay up indefinitely. But once it's resolved, leaving the site up would be a punitive act and the simple fact is that none of us have the authority (either legally or morally) to pass sentence.

I realise I'm hardly an unbiased party in this matter, but my history as a close friend of Dean doesn't influence my opinion on this.

Big plus one to LO. These sites/2P2 threads should be PSAs, not mob justice for revenge.

On the other hand, employers obviously have the right to ask for criminal records, so I suppose there is an equivalent situation in law

why not? there are tons of people throughout the world who have committed much less serious crimes and have to put up with the fact their reputation is tarnished for future employment / business opportunities. as things stand he is lucky to only be dealing with people who are standing up against him on-line. he should be getting dealt with by the police as any other 'guilty' thief would be.

This is crazy. How is it a no brainer?

If he hopefully clears his debt, he will have a clean name to those who don't see this thread if the site is taken down. Then he can go off and do the same thing to other people for larger sums of money.

The website 100% has to stay up IMO. His background, his scams and (hopefully) his repayments to those he scammed all have to be on the site.

If a man does jail-time, he has a record against his name. This is no different IMO.

Can't believe people would let him get off this easily by taking the one thing he is scared of down from the internet and let him have some sort of 'rep' again.

The fact is that this is theft, and if its not going to be reported to the police, then I don't see why the website shouldn't be a form of punishment?

Otherwise, like I've said before, if the website comes down, then this is a temporary inconvenience for him - and he'll never actually be punished for his crime.

This.
Stealing from the poker community, or in this case charity, doesnt show up on a criminal record. Thats why it must be made public in the form of a website so that future employers know he has a history of fraud.

What if I told you guys that you could stop debating the web site thing because this thread and the site are cached on the internet in some facet forever and just getting rid of the site will never change that?