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**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] **** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH]

03-26-2010 , 09:54 PM
Note to self: never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever **** with Jalex.
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-26-2010 , 10:02 PM
jalex, I think thats a fair offer, however if they do decide to come forward will all that data, you should keep it private even if you do find out something malicious and just make a decision on the bet.

You know like poker sites do, when they find something, they dont give out any information about it, they just say, busted, I mean "jalexed!"
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-26-2010 , 10:13 PM
Jalex, you should have little mercy regarding this case because it's quite obvious to EVERYBODY that they were cheating. Roseeker's last desperate attempt to dodge this was to pm you, and you should definitely not let him off the hook.
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-26-2010 , 10:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cftw
Jalex, you should have little mercy regarding this case because it's quite obvious to EVERYBODY that they were cheating. Roseeker's last desperate attempt to dodge this was to pm you, and you should definitely not let him off the hook.
it should be obv but this is BBV
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-26-2010 , 10:27 PM
wow jalex you rock! nice job.

if RoSeeker doesn't do the first 2 things, then it's pretty clear that this propbet was a big scam.
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-26-2010 , 10:37 PM
Nice job to all judges. After reviewing the thread and details several times I have changed my mind and I do believe Gary did cheat on this whenever he ended up being down. After he dropped a lot of buy-ins to start he probably felt like ****, but his play was not affected too much knowing that he had several chip dumpers waiting incase it got too bad.
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-26-2010 , 10:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CardsNbooze
Started reading the thread this morning and honestly its been better than most books ive read. Ive kept unbiased opinions the whole way through and probably couldnt make a 100% decision either way. Putting what you already think aside, there are so many variables to consider. I also have no interest/stake in this whatsoever.

-this all started due to "abnormally" played hands late on a Friday night

-a decent percentage of the players are either drinking, drunk, stoned, or tired after a week of work/studying/etc.

-OP is at the tail end of a 30k hand session hyped up on red bull and mentally and physically exhausted. Im sure most of you know what its like when caffeine is the one and only thing keeping you going. I do it sometimes just for the hallucinations themselves. So airtight play from a losing reg cant be the bar that is set.

-breez was 2-3 tabling. OP was 12-24 tabling (I think 24 at the time but this could be wrong). If im taking a shot and some guy that seems agro takes me off a pot on one table and then tries it again on another, i might shove 107 into him too. this hand can mean alot of things to different people, but it doesnt prove anything at all.

-the fact that this happened at the end of the bet could be key or it could be trivial. Whatever side of this you're currently on is the side that you will defend.

-the fact that he knows someone that knows someone that lost money to him on this day is also not solid evidence. ive been a tourney reg for awhile now and know some big names out there personally. These big names know alot of people and im sure i have played with most of them at one time or another. That doesnt mean that we know each other.

-take a look through your last 30k hands and tell me how many pots you have taken off of micro regs or randoms that are taking a shot/tilting/drunk. I bet it is a lot more than 2-3. (really take a look. i found 6 that spewed uncontrollably in the first 2k hands.) this is not proof of anything imo.

-OP acted very strange when questioned about all of this. This was actually the first time I had suspicions. I thought about this for a long time and still dont really know what to think. Out of personal experience, I know when questioned by accusations most of the time people are going to act out of character whether innocent or guilty. The innocent people dont want to act guilty and end up acting strange (i.e. being overly nice,inquisitive, helpful.) The guilty people dont want to act guilty so they end up acting the same way (i.e. being overly nice,inquisitive, helpful.)

-I dont know if this is standard, but the fact that the judges posted multiple hand histories seems very wrong. That would be like a court judge posting all of the facts of the case on the internet and then making a decision based off of responses. Make the decision and live with knowing you made the best one you could. The fact that there was only 1 judge was messed up too.

All in all it is a complete mess. The only "right" thing to do is not going to make everyone happy. So how can it be right.
read more books
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-26-2010 , 10:48 PM
time to bag it up and give the money to the bettors. I was quite ardently on the side of Gary initially when the QQ hand came out, but the more and more info that comes out, the more clear it is that something shady was happening.

Origionally i was concerned that the QQ hand could introduce nefarious elements in future prop bets, but by now its clear that if that QQ hand had happened, and there was zero link between the two players, the judges would have awarded the money to Gary_Neville, so it seems clear now that the bettors should get the chips.
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-26-2010 , 11:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalexand42
Also, he has asked me to stop calling him names, so I'll do my best not to call him scumbag anymore. I'd suggest everyone else try to comply with this request, because he's also apparently contacted moderators/admins.
this is incredibly lol. i guess hes trying to save face in case he makes future $2 180-man mtt videos on one of his two accounts?

this guy multiaccounts 2p2, multiaccounts pokerstars, multiaccounts facebook ...

roseeker, you brought this all upon yourself. good riddance.
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-26-2010 , 11:17 PM
and guys this is off topic but its so good for bbv in case you missed it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAD3wFjqWDc
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-26-2010 , 11:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NANONUTS
It probably be best if people like this who don't seem to have even read half the thread refrained from posting cliffs.
I've read almost the entire thread. Like I said I'm sure I missed things. My post was just intended as a quick response to a couple people who were asking to be filled in.

Quote:
About 20 pages or so ago even guys who had been staunch defenders of gary from the start agreed that chip dumping occurred during the prop bet after watching the thread unfold and seeing the absolute mountain of evidence uncovered.
I agree, my post concurred with that interpretation, my only question was whether there was sufficient evidence to actually have Gary lose the bet. But my opinion is of no consequence as I have no involvement in the bet and don't know anyone who is--I hope no one took it too seriously, but TBH I'm sure I thought it out better than the most of the random opinions that are being spewed out here.

Quote:
Guys coming in a posting cliffs that leave out tons of important info are just muddying the waters and will lead to others coming in and saying stuff like 'so he is guilty because he 3bet with 86o'. It's setting the discussion back 20 or 30 pages.
I don't think I left out tons of important info and I certainly don't think I implied that he's guilty due to any of the hand histories. Actually I specified that the hand histories in a vacuum would not be suspicious at all. The important evidence is the relationships.

Quote:
If someone is going to post cliffs make them comprehensive. A proper cliffs post at this stage is going to be quite long after all the evidence that's been uncovered.
Sure, fair point.
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-26-2010 , 11:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ra]\\[dom
however if they do decide to come forward will all that data, you should keep it private even if you do find out something malicious and just make a decision on the bet.

Won't happen, DUCY?
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 12:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalexand42
Okay, so RoSeeker just PM'ed me. I won't post the PM, but I'd like to post an excerpt from my response:
Here's the deal. I certainly do have lots of personal information on you saved up. I have not posted any of it, because _I_ do have a sense of justice and propriety.

You have not been forthcoming at all and neither have any of your buddies. Want to prove your innocence?

1. Have Pokerstars email me your transaction history on both of your accounts.
2. Have FTP email me your transaction history on the Sol Reader account.
3. Have your good friend breeezzz do the same for his accounts.
4. Have your real life friend StoppedClock do the same.

I'll put up $10,000 in escrow that I won't violate your privacy or their privacy related to these details, assuming they show nothing malicious.


5. Did you have action in this prop bet?
6. Do you still claim you were 'watching breeezzz's tables' when he 4 bet folded as you stated in the thread?

IMO, you won't do any of the above, because your crew was involved in chip dumping. The language you used in the thread, the fact you guys are running and hiding, the obvious evidence linking you to the random accounts, ALL points to the fact that you are guilty. And noone I have implicated is trying to clear their name other than lame denials.

Prove me wrong, otherwise this PM, like your posts, is a ton of smoke.
Also, he has asked me to stop calling him names, so I'll do my best not to call him scumbag anymore. I'd suggest everyone else try to comply with this request, because he's also apparently contacted moderators/admins.
So he does this and OP wins bet? or he does this and you just go "Oh well, the other evidence still proves him guilty?".

There is NEVER going to be evidence in any transfer history from stars/ftp to prove innocence only guilt (they could exchange money for chip dumping directly via any other online wallet, in person etc). So why would he bother? it's pretty clear the OP is going to loose. Hell, I even think he's more than likely guilty now.
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 12:59 AM
can the judges make a decision ive wasted hours waiting for the end of this one
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 01:03 AM
Jalex is the man
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 01:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HamishB
So he does this and OP wins bet? or he does this and you just go "Oh well, the other evidence still proves him guilty?".

There is NEVER going to be evidence in any transfer history from stars/ftp to prove innocence only guilt (they could exchange money for chip dumping directly via any other online wallet, in person etc). So why would he bother? it's pretty clear the OP is going to loose. Hell, I even think he's more than likely guilty now.
in person is highly unlikely, and although they could use an online wallet, most poker players by habit use stars or ftp to transfer sums.

Thus a full history of all the people involved with stars/ftp history would help them alot if teyare innocent
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 01:55 AM
wow what a mess
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 02:13 AM
I know it may be a given, but where there any stipulations in the rules saying he couldn't chip dump or cheat? If it specifically didn't say he couldn't cheat, then he won!
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 02:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamScaper
I know it may be a given, but where there any stipulations in the rules saying he couldn't chip dump or cheat? If it specifically didn't say he couldn't cheat, then he won!
lol, gary should have cut the crap and went straight for this angle.
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 02:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamScaper
I know it may be a given, but where there any stipulations in the rules saying he couldn't chip dump or cheat? If it specifically didn't say he couldn't cheat, then he won!
Great point! Shipping him the moniez now

Last edited by blackize; 03-27-2010 at 03:05 AM. Reason: jk obv
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 02:59 AM
No transfer history doesn't show that there wasn't an agreement that chip dumping would occur if gary was down $X amount of money. They could have planned to wait several days or even weeks after the prop bet was over and forgotten to then transfer the chip dumpers fee. Also, like other have suggested, online wallets, paypal, in person, other types of payment could have been arranged so it would be very hard to track it. If I were a judge I would say that this is close to being over now with the bettors against Gary being the winners.

Too much random occurance/coincidence has happened to make it chance at this point.

Glad I did not bet on this...
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 03:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdiddy131313
can the judges make a decision ive wasted hours waiting for the end of this one
hahahahahahaha you're stupid as ****
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 03:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexMack24
If there was cheating involved, which, having read the whole thread, it looks fairly convincing (but not 100% conclusive) that there has been, I really think those responsible should just come out and admit it. Salvage what dignity you have left.
what exactly do you mean? as in, those who had vested interest in the bet and they secretly chip dumped without op's knowledge perhaps? they should come out and admit it? i think there is a better case for that, rather than op being guilty himself.

the evidence presented so far is interesting but no where near rock solid enough. its borderline witch hunt with 6 degrees of seperation.

i dont know what kind of perameters the 2+2 court operates under but the evidence so far wouldnt even make it past the district attorney's office in a criminal case and wouldnt even make it past a lawyer's office in a civil case.

with present evidence, op is buffered from any wrong doing. these are the facts so far from an unbiased observation.

it certainly doesnt mean the case is closed though. if anything, the evidence at hand warrants further investigation but it doesnt warrant the unfair speculation.
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 03:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by waow
this guy multiaccounts 2p2, multiaccounts pokerstars, multiaccounts facebook ...
ok seriously what is wrong with multiaccounting 2p2 or facebook?
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote
03-27-2010 , 03:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulletproof Monk
ok seriously what is wrong with multiaccounting 2p2 or facebook?
come on, multiaccounting 2p2 is just plain wrong.

like seriously why the hell would you need two different accounts? obviously only to scam people or something else shady. its a joke.

with 19k posts you should know better, bulletproof monk
**** 30k hands in a day + profit on 200nl 6m prop bet*** [See confessions of cheating. MH] Quote

      
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