Full Tilt wrongfully suspends long-time players’ accounts (inquisition in progress) - from 2010
03-15-2010
, 06:26 PM
Introduction:
I’ve read numerous threads on here about Full Tilt account closures. Often, the person turned out to not be clean—this seemed especially true if the person was a new member of Two Plus Two or had a very small post count. However, other times it seemed as though the innocent were getting false positives as a result of Full Tilt’s overzealous security team. It seemed that Full Tilt was, at least at times, throwing some innocent people under the bus along with those that were guilty.
Still, I always thought I’d never have to deal with that myself. I knew I had done nothing wrong and thought those inquisitions always just happened on other people. I guess it just never really hits home until it happens to you or your family personally.
Just recently, Full Tilt has decided to make my wife and me its latest victims. After being its customers for three years, Full Tilt has decided to close both my and my wife's accounts. It is hard for me to put into words how betrayed by Full Tilt we feel right now. My wife and I have both been loyal customers to Full Tilt for years. We have gotten several other people to sign up at their site. My wife and I are avid poker players and have always tried to be open and upfront with Full Tilt. I always felt that would keep us from their inquisition; alas I was wrong.
I know that the community expects full disclosure in these threads, and the following is my attempt to do just that.
Our Background:
My wife and I are happily married, and we have three awesome children. My wife and I are both avid poker players. Some time ago, we decided to play poker as a way to support our family. This provides us both an opportunity to spend time together playing poker, and gives us more time to spend with the kids.
For the past three years, my wife and I have both played poker on Full Tilt. We have maintained separate accounts. We have also always been very upfront with Full Tilt about the fact that we both have an account on Full Tilt poker and that we both live in the same household. Both of us have rakeback accounts—that is not the issue. We have also both given Full Tilt our ID information, and have both made multiple cashouts and deposits.
Over the years, either I or my wife has reminded Full Tilt that our spouse also had an account. For example, two or three years ago my wife and I qualified for the same free Iron Man tournament. My wife borrowed a laptop from a friend so that we could both play. However, several days before starting the tournament, we sent Full Tilt an email stating that we were married, that we both had qualified for the same free Iron Man tournament, and asked if that would be a problem. Full Tilt told us it would not, and simply advised us that if we ended up on the same table to not share any hole cards or other collusive information. Of course we agreed and we would never do that anyhow. We never ended up on the same table and both got knocked out before making the money. Since that time, we both decided it would be better to never play in the same tournament, nor on the same table just to avoid any suggestion of impropriety. As a result of our decision, that is the only tournament that we both played in together. We have never played in the same tournament since. And, we have not played a single hand together on the same table (since we never played a hand together even in that tournament). And, we never play together at the same cash table.
So, for three years, Full Tilt has known we were married, that we each had separate poker accounts, and that we both played regularly on their site. Full Tilt never had a problem with that before. So, what has changed?
Full Tilt Targets Me and My Wife
On March 11, 2010, I wrote a thread calling Full Tilt’s email privacy policy into question. Here is the link to that thread:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...-lists-732365/
FTPSean PM’d me shortly after I started the thread. He requested the following from me:
So, to cooperate with their “investigation” I immediately and freely sent him my Player ID. After FTPSean got my Player ID, he quickly notified Full Tilt Security of my Player ID and within hours of me giving him my Player ID, Full Tilt Security had closed both my and my wife’s account.
The timing of the closures is beyond coincidental. For three years, both my wife and I have played on Full Tilt. Full Tilt never had a problem with us having accounts before, yet all of sudden they did now. Apparently my wife and I both having an account at their site was okay so long as neither of us ever called them out on one of their policies. Once one of us called them out on something, Full Tilt suddenly had a problem with my wife and I both having accounts. Is this just coincidental, or is it just me?
The Inquisition Begins:
At first, Full Tilt did not even say why the accounts were closed—simply that the accounts were being investigated. I immediately asked them and Sean what was going on. Several hours later, Full Tilt Security finally sent me an email accusing my wife and I of multi accounting. I quickly responded and also requested help from FTPSean. However, Full Tilt already seems to have made up its mind. I don't think they care what either me or my wife has to say.
The emails from Full Tilt state basically that Full Tilt is already convinced that me and my wife are guilty and that our innocence is not at issue. It claims to have already "garnered significant technical" data against us, and asks us if we have any response to their significant technical data. But Full Tilt doesn't even give us the actual data to respond to. How are either of us suppose to respond to something we don't even have? All we have is a vague reference to chat histories, login histories, transaction details & gameplay.
I believe the only issue Full Tilt currently has is whether we admit something Full Tilt has already found us guilty of. Full Tilt insinuates that if we confess to whatever Full Tilt has found us guilty of, we will receive less punishment. But, if we don't, Full Tilt we punish us more severely. I don't believe Full Tilt is conducting a fair investigation at all. Their last email to us states:
My wife and I don't even know what to say to that email. It reminds me of the Inquisition. People in the Dark Ages would be accused of worshiping the devil. Many of the accused were completely innocent. Yet, in their zeal to persecute devil worshipers, the inquisitors did not seem to care if many innocent people were tortured and killed. Before final sentence was delivered, the accused would be told that their punishment (i.e., their torture) would be less severe if the person would confess their guilt. This left the accused in a very odd situation. On the one hand, the person knew they were not devil worshipers. On the other hand, the person also knew that they had already been judged a devil worshiper by their inquisitors and that if they did not admit to it, they knew they would be severely tortured and killed. Often times a person would confess (to something they did not do) and be tortured, but at least they save their life.
My wife and I feel like Full Tilt has put us in a similar Catch-22. On the one hand, we know we have done nothing wrong. Yet, on the other, we feel like Full Tilt has already made up its mind that we are guilty. To Full Tilt, it's just a matter of us confessing (to something we know we didn't do), or face the consequences of being dealt with in a heavier manner by Full Tilt Poker. What are we supposed to do?
Full Tilt's whole process begs for due process. I mean Full Tilt wants us to confess to something without even showing their supposed evidence against us or giving us the opportunity to answer or explain it after seeing the evidence. Once again, Full Tilt is judge, jury, and executioner. Neither of us feel like we even have a fair chance to explain ourselves. This is an absolutely horrible situation that I hope none of you are ever put in.
I understand the community will want to see all correspondence we've had with Full Tilt. So the remainder of this post contains the emails and PMs sent between us and Full Tilt since this accusation started.
Correspondence (emails and PMs):
1. On March 11, 2010, 3:32 a.m EST. I write the thread that calls Full Tilt’s email privacy policy into question.
2. FTP Sean sends me the following PM:
3. I send Sean the following reply
4. The next morning, I received an email from Full Tilt saying my account is suspended. My wife got the same email:
5. I respond with the following email:
6. My wife also sends the following to Full Tilt:
7. I send Sean the following PM:
8. I also send FTPDoug the following PM:
9. I get the following email reply from Full Tilt:
10. Knowing that I will have limited opportunity to explain myself in Full Tilt's investigation process, I sent Full Tilt the following lengthy email reply:
11. I then received the following PM from FTPSean:
12. My wife sends the following email to Full Tilt:
13. I send Sean the following PM:
14. I send Sean a copy of the same email I sent Peter (see #10 above).
15. The next day, I send Sean another PM:
16. To that PM, Sean sent me the following reply:
17. And then this morning, my wife and I received the following email:
And that's where we are now. Any suggestions or comments anyone has are appreciated.
I’ve read numerous threads on here about Full Tilt account closures. Often, the person turned out to not be clean—this seemed especially true if the person was a new member of Two Plus Two or had a very small post count. However, other times it seemed as though the innocent were getting false positives as a result of Full Tilt’s overzealous security team. It seemed that Full Tilt was, at least at times, throwing some innocent people under the bus along with those that were guilty.
Still, I always thought I’d never have to deal with that myself. I knew I had done nothing wrong and thought those inquisitions always just happened on other people. I guess it just never really hits home until it happens to you or your family personally.
Just recently, Full Tilt has decided to make my wife and me its latest victims. After being its customers for three years, Full Tilt has decided to close both my and my wife's accounts. It is hard for me to put into words how betrayed by Full Tilt we feel right now. My wife and I have both been loyal customers to Full Tilt for years. We have gotten several other people to sign up at their site. My wife and I are avid poker players and have always tried to be open and upfront with Full Tilt. I always felt that would keep us from their inquisition; alas I was wrong.
I know that the community expects full disclosure in these threads, and the following is my attempt to do just that.
Our Background:
My wife and I are happily married, and we have three awesome children. My wife and I are both avid poker players. Some time ago, we decided to play poker as a way to support our family. This provides us both an opportunity to spend time together playing poker, and gives us more time to spend with the kids.
For the past three years, my wife and I have both played poker on Full Tilt. We have maintained separate accounts. We have also always been very upfront with Full Tilt about the fact that we both have an account on Full Tilt poker and that we both live in the same household. Both of us have rakeback accounts—that is not the issue. We have also both given Full Tilt our ID information, and have both made multiple cashouts and deposits.
Over the years, either I or my wife has reminded Full Tilt that our spouse also had an account. For example, two or three years ago my wife and I qualified for the same free Iron Man tournament. My wife borrowed a laptop from a friend so that we could both play. However, several days before starting the tournament, we sent Full Tilt an email stating that we were married, that we both had qualified for the same free Iron Man tournament, and asked if that would be a problem. Full Tilt told us it would not, and simply advised us that if we ended up on the same table to not share any hole cards or other collusive information. Of course we agreed and we would never do that anyhow. We never ended up on the same table and both got knocked out before making the money. Since that time, we both decided it would be better to never play in the same tournament, nor on the same table just to avoid any suggestion of impropriety. As a result of our decision, that is the only tournament that we both played in together. We have never played in the same tournament since. And, we have not played a single hand together on the same table (since we never played a hand together even in that tournament). And, we never play together at the same cash table.
So, for three years, Full Tilt has known we were married, that we each had separate poker accounts, and that we both played regularly on their site. Full Tilt never had a problem with that before. So, what has changed?
Full Tilt Targets Me and My Wife
On March 11, 2010, I wrote a thread calling Full Tilt’s email privacy policy into question. Here is the link to that thread:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...-lists-732365/
FTPSean PM’d me shortly after I started the thread. He requested the following from me:
Quote:
Hi there,
I can initially say that we definitely do not give out our players email addresses to anyone.
We are definitely interested in helping to find out how this happened. Please send along the following information so I can have it reviewed:
• Player ID
• Spam Source (including all email headers)
Please send the above to me via PM, or to sean@fulltiltpoker.com if it is too much.
Sean
I can initially say that we definitely do not give out our players email addresses to anyone.
We are definitely interested in helping to find out how this happened. Please send along the following information so I can have it reviewed:
• Player ID
• Spam Source (including all email headers)
Please send the above to me via PM, or to sean@fulltiltpoker.com if it is too much.
Sean
The timing of the closures is beyond coincidental. For three years, both my wife and I have played on Full Tilt. Full Tilt never had a problem with us having accounts before, yet all of sudden they did now. Apparently my wife and I both having an account at their site was okay so long as neither of us ever called them out on one of their policies. Once one of us called them out on something, Full Tilt suddenly had a problem with my wife and I both having accounts. Is this just coincidental, or is it just me?
The Inquisition Begins:
At first, Full Tilt did not even say why the accounts were closed—simply that the accounts were being investigated. I immediately asked them and Sean what was going on. Several hours later, Full Tilt Security finally sent me an email accusing my wife and I of multi accounting. I quickly responded and also requested help from FTPSean. However, Full Tilt already seems to have made up its mind. I don't think they care what either me or my wife has to say.
The emails from Full Tilt state basically that Full Tilt is already convinced that me and my wife are guilty and that our innocence is not at issue. It claims to have already "garnered significant technical" data against us, and asks us if we have any response to their significant technical data. But Full Tilt doesn't even give us the actual data to respond to. How are either of us suppose to respond to something we don't even have? All we have is a vague reference to chat histories, login histories, transaction details & gameplay.
I believe the only issue Full Tilt currently has is whether we admit something Full Tilt has already found us guilty of. Full Tilt insinuates that if we confess to whatever Full Tilt has found us guilty of, we will receive less punishment. But, if we don't, Full Tilt we punish us more severely. I don't believe Full Tilt is conducting a fair investigation at all. Their last email to us states:
Quote:
From: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com> Add contact
To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.com
Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 09:45:44 -0600
Hello XXXXXXX,
Thank you for your response
We are in the process of concluding our investigation into this matter.
Contrary to what you have explained, we have garnered significant technical data (including, but not limited to: analyzing chat histories, login histories, transaction details & gameplay,) which leads us to believe that it is the same person playing on both accounts.
We place great emphasis on the integrity of our site , we cannot allow players to play on any account other than their own. Violations of our terms and conditions pertaining to this matter is considered one of the worst offences a player can commit.
Having said that, we value when a player is forthright and cooperates with our investigations. We take a players cooperation into consideration when we come reach our final decision on the matter.
Prior to the conclusion of the investigation we would like to offer you a final opportunity to provide any additional information related to the questions we have raised previously.
We thank you for your continued cooperation and await your reply.
Regards,
Security
Full Tilt Poker
To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.com
Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 09:45:44 -0600
Hello XXXXXXX,
Thank you for your response
We are in the process of concluding our investigation into this matter.
Contrary to what you have explained, we have garnered significant technical data (including, but not limited to: analyzing chat histories, login histories, transaction details & gameplay,) which leads us to believe that it is the same person playing on both accounts.
We place great emphasis on the integrity of our site , we cannot allow players to play on any account other than their own. Violations of our terms and conditions pertaining to this matter is considered one of the worst offences a player can commit.
Having said that, we value when a player is forthright and cooperates with our investigations. We take a players cooperation into consideration when we come reach our final decision on the matter.
Prior to the conclusion of the investigation we would like to offer you a final opportunity to provide any additional information related to the questions we have raised previously.
We thank you for your continued cooperation and await your reply.
Regards,
Security
Full Tilt Poker
My wife and I feel like Full Tilt has put us in a similar Catch-22. On the one hand, we know we have done nothing wrong. Yet, on the other, we feel like Full Tilt has already made up its mind that we are guilty. To Full Tilt, it's just a matter of us confessing (to something we know we didn't do), or face the consequences of being dealt with in a heavier manner by Full Tilt Poker. What are we supposed to do?
Full Tilt's whole process begs for due process. I mean Full Tilt wants us to confess to something without even showing their supposed evidence against us or giving us the opportunity to answer or explain it after seeing the evidence. Once again, Full Tilt is judge, jury, and executioner. Neither of us feel like we even have a fair chance to explain ourselves. This is an absolutely horrible situation that I hope none of you are ever put in.
I understand the community will want to see all correspondence we've had with Full Tilt. So the remainder of this post contains the emails and PMs sent between us and Full Tilt since this accusation started.
Correspondence (emails and PMs):
1. On March 11, 2010, 3:32 a.m EST. I write the thread that calls Full Tilt’s email privacy policy into question.
2. FTP Sean sends me the following PM:
Quote:
03-11-2010, 07:27 AM
FTPSean
FullTilt Support Representative
Hi there,
I can initially say that we definitely do not give out our players email addresses to anyone.
We are definitely interested in helping to find out how this happened. Please send along the following information so I can have it reviewed:
• Player ID
• Spam Source (including all email headers)
Please send the above to me via PM, or to sean@fulltiltpoker.com if it is too much.
Sean
FTPSean
FullTilt Support Representative
Hi there,
I can initially say that we definitely do not give out our players email addresses to anyone.
We are definitely interested in helping to find out how this happened. Please send along the following information so I can have it reviewed:
• Player ID
• Spam Source (including all email headers)
Please send the above to me via PM, or to sean@fulltiltpoker.com if it is too much.
Sean
Quote:
From: Andronicus
Hi Sean,
Thanks for sending me a PM. It sounds like you are as puzzled as I am about how I got this spam email. Just to be on the safe side, I changed my email account associated with my Full Tilt account after receiving the spam email.
Anyhow, here's the information you requested (I ask you keep confidential).
My Player ID: xxxxxxxx
Spam Source: Rakeback Mania <support@cake-poker-rakeback-mania.com
Some 2p2 posters believe this could have come from my rakeback affiliate. If this is the case, I would like to know. Does my affiliate know my email associated with my Full Tilt account even though I've changed it more than once since I first signed up with my affiliate?
**Here's a full copy of the spam email. Images in the email were automatically removed by my browser and email server (and thus are not included below). Notice also that I also got a warning from my email provider:
From: Rakeback Mania <support@cake-poker-rakeback-mania.com> Add contact
To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.com
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 15:39:17 -0700
Warning: This message may be forged. The return path (v-cbbfoem_banlgljeo_ebjcmpm_ebjcmpm_a@bounce.mkt2803 .com) does not match the from address.
We respect your privacy. You can remove yourself from Cake-Poker-Rakeback-Mania's mail at anytime, see below.
If you cannot view this email in its entirety, view it online here
[Rakeback Mania Exclusive]
GET 33% of your Rake BACK at Cake Poker today!
We're pleased to extend an exclusive offer to Cake Poker Rakeback Mania visitors - get 33% Rakeback as well as a 110% signup bonus and a ticket to a $500 depositors freeroll with Cake Poker.
[Download Now]
All Cake Poker players receive loads of cash, prizes and free tournament play in addition to a rich rewards program that includes Gold Stacks, Gold Chips and Gold Cards. Click here for more details.
GETTING STARTED IS FAST AND EASY:
1. Visit the Cake website and download the software
2. Create an account using code: 33RAKENOW
3. Login in to your account and click on 'Cashier'
4. Make your first deposit
If you need any assistance with registering your account, Cake's support staff are available 24/7 at support@cakepoker.com to answer your questions.
Your email address, xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.com, was used to subscríbe to Cake-Poker-Rakeback-Mania.com's marketing email list.To remove your email address from this mailing list please click here
Hi Sean,
Thanks for sending me a PM. It sounds like you are as puzzled as I am about how I got this spam email. Just to be on the safe side, I changed my email account associated with my Full Tilt account after receiving the spam email.
Anyhow, here's the information you requested (I ask you keep confidential).
My Player ID: xxxxxxxx
Spam Source: Rakeback Mania <support@cake-poker-rakeback-mania.com
Some 2p2 posters believe this could have come from my rakeback affiliate. If this is the case, I would like to know. Does my affiliate know my email associated with my Full Tilt account even though I've changed it more than once since I first signed up with my affiliate?
**Here's a full copy of the spam email. Images in the email were automatically removed by my browser and email server (and thus are not included below). Notice also that I also got a warning from my email provider:
From: Rakeback Mania <support@cake-poker-rakeback-mania.com> Add contact
To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.com
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 15:39:17 -0700
Warning: This message may be forged. The return path (v-cbbfoem_banlgljeo_ebjcmpm_ebjcmpm_a@bounce.mkt2803 .com) does not match the from address.
We respect your privacy. You can remove yourself from Cake-Poker-Rakeback-Mania's mail at anytime, see below.
If you cannot view this email in its entirety, view it online here
[Rakeback Mania Exclusive]
GET 33% of your Rake BACK at Cake Poker today!
We're pleased to extend an exclusive offer to Cake Poker Rakeback Mania visitors - get 33% Rakeback as well as a 110% signup bonus and a ticket to a $500 depositors freeroll with Cake Poker.
[Download Now]
All Cake Poker players receive loads of cash, prizes and free tournament play in addition to a rich rewards program that includes Gold Stacks, Gold Chips and Gold Cards. Click here for more details.
GETTING STARTED IS FAST AND EASY:
1. Visit the Cake website and download the software
2. Create an account using code: 33RAKENOW
3. Login in to your account and click on 'Cashier'
4. Make your first deposit
If you need any assistance with registering your account, Cake's support staff are available 24/7 at support@cakepoker.com to answer your questions.
Your email address, xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.com, was used to subscríbe to Cake-Poker-Rakeback-Mania.com's marketing email list.To remove your email address from this mailing list please click here
Quote:
From: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com> Add contact
To: xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxl.com
Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 09:06:10 -0600
Hello xxxxxx,
We are writing to inform you that we have temporarily suspended your Full Tilt Poker account pending a review.
Because the review is in progress, we are unable to provide specific information. An investigator may contact you during the course of this review for additional information.
We appreciate your patience, and will contact you with further details when our review is complete.
Regards,
Peter
Security
Full Tilt Poker
To: xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxl.com
Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 09:06:10 -0600
Hello xxxxxx,
We are writing to inform you that we have temporarily suspended your Full Tilt Poker account pending a review.
Because the review is in progress, we are unable to provide specific information. An investigator may contact you during the course of this review for additional information.
We appreciate your patience, and will contact you with further details when our review is complete.
Regards,
Peter
Security
Full Tilt Poker
Quote:
From: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.com Add contact
To: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 01:41:10 -0600
Peter,
What is going on? I've been a long-time loyal customer of Full
Tilt, and all of a sudden my account is suspended? FTPSean
contacted me on Two Plus Two because of a thread I wrote on that
website. It involved a scam email I got in my Full Tilt email
account. I provided him with my User ID and all of a sudden both me
and my wife's account are suspended!
I am pretty upset and ask that you get back with me as quickly as
possible. I am refraining from overreacting by posting my
frustration on any of the poker boards. I am hoping this is a
simple misunderstanding by you and that my account will be
reinstated immediately.
Please get back with me at your earliest convenience.
Sincerly,
XXXXXXXX
To: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 01:41:10 -0600
Peter,
What is going on? I've been a long-time loyal customer of Full
Tilt, and all of a sudden my account is suspended? FTPSean
contacted me on Two Plus Two because of a thread I wrote on that
website. It involved a scam email I got in my Full Tilt email
account. I provided him with my User ID and all of a sudden both me
and my wife's account are suspended!
I am pretty upset and ask that you get back with me as quickly as
possible. I am refraining from overreacting by posting my
frustration on any of the poker boards. I am hoping this is a
simple misunderstanding by you and that my account will be
reinstated immediately.
Please get back with me at your earliest convenience.
Sincerly,
XXXXXXXX
Quote:
From: yyyyyyy@yyyyyyy.com Add contact
To: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 02:53:37 -0600
Dear Peter,
Why is my account suspended? Is this because me and my husband
changed our emails and passwords? Please know that we did this
because my husband got a email that was not from you and so we both
decided it would be safe to change our emails and passwords. After
I changed my email and password, I could not log in at first
because my log in had reset to my user ID. I did not know it reset
like this so I was still trying to log in using my new email as a
log in. That wouldn't let me log in, so I also thought maybe I had
put in the wrong password when I changed it, so I asked for a new
one be sent to my email, but nothing was sent to my new email
address. Finally instead of using my email as a log in, I tried to
log in with my user id and that worked.
I hope this is why our accounts got suspended and that you will
reinstate our accounts immediately. My husband and I have both
enjoyed playing at your site for the past three years. We have
tried to be loyal customers. Both of us wanted to play a poker
session today, but we couldn't. Please help us as quickly as you
can.
If you need my phone number or anything else to verify us, we would
be happy to give that to you. Just let us know what you need.
Very truly yours,
yyyyyyy
To: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 02:53:37 -0600
Dear Peter,
Why is my account suspended? Is this because me and my husband
changed our emails and passwords? Please know that we did this
because my husband got a email that was not from you and so we both
decided it would be safe to change our emails and passwords. After
I changed my email and password, I could not log in at first
because my log in had reset to my user ID. I did not know it reset
like this so I was still trying to log in using my new email as a
log in. That wouldn't let me log in, so I also thought maybe I had
put in the wrong password when I changed it, so I asked for a new
one be sent to my email, but nothing was sent to my new email
address. Finally instead of using my email as a log in, I tried to
log in with my user id and that worked.
I hope this is why our accounts got suspended and that you will
reinstate our accounts immediately. My husband and I have both
enjoyed playing at your site for the past three years. We have
tried to be loyal customers. Both of us wanted to play a poker
session today, but we couldn't. Please help us as quickly as you
can.
If you need my phone number or anything else to verify us, we would
be happy to give that to you. Just let us know what you need.
Very truly yours,
yyyyyyy
Quote:
03-13-2010, 02:19 AM
Andronicus
Sean,
So I provide you with my Full Tilt screen name and now my Full Tilt account is suspended! Further, my wife says her account is locked too! What is going on?!?!?
To be extra cautious, as a result of this weird spam email, both me and my wife changed our emails and our passwords at Full Tilt. Now suddenly we are both locked out. Is this how you thank someone who tries to help you? It really feels like I am being punished because I notified 2p2 of the weird spam and because when you asked for my screen name, I gave it to you freely. And how do I get repaid? You suspend my account. To say that I am beyond frustrated would be a big understatement. Please contact me back immediately.
Sincerely,
Andronicus
Andronicus
Sean,
So I provide you with my Full Tilt screen name and now my Full Tilt account is suspended! Further, my wife says her account is locked too! What is going on?!?!?
To be extra cautious, as a result of this weird spam email, both me and my wife changed our emails and our passwords at Full Tilt. Now suddenly we are both locked out. Is this how you thank someone who tries to help you? It really feels like I am being punished because I notified 2p2 of the weird spam and because when you asked for my screen name, I gave it to you freely. And how do I get repaid? You suspend my account. To say that I am beyond frustrated would be a big understatement. Please contact me back immediately.
Sincerely,
Andronicus
Quote:
03-13-2010, 02:30 AM
Andronicus
Dear Doug,
I started the following thread:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...-lists-732365/
FTPSean contacted me almost immediately after I started the thread and asked me for my Full Tilt User ID. So, I provided it to him. Shortly afterward, my account becomes suspended by Full Tilt!! I guess that's the thanks I get for cooperating with Sean and trying to get to the bottom of the spam email.
Please note that I changed my email and password on my Full Tilt account after the spam email incident. I did this just to be safe. My wife did the same. Now all of a sudden both of our accounts are suspended! What in the world is going on? We have both been long-time loyal customers of Full Tilt, yet now we are being punished--apparently because I called 2p2's attention to a possible email leak at Full Tilt. I am beyond upset!
I am trying to not overreact in all of this and am waiting for some kind of explanation from you, Sean, or someone else at Full Tilt. Part of me wants to write a very upset thread on two plus two, but I am refraining from doing so until you or Sean have a chance to respond.
Please get back with me as quickly as possible.
Sincerely,
Andronicus
Andronicus
Dear Doug,
I started the following thread:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...-lists-732365/
FTPSean contacted me almost immediately after I started the thread and asked me for my Full Tilt User ID. So, I provided it to him. Shortly afterward, my account becomes suspended by Full Tilt!! I guess that's the thanks I get for cooperating with Sean and trying to get to the bottom of the spam email.
Please note that I changed my email and password on my Full Tilt account after the spam email incident. I did this just to be safe. My wife did the same. Now all of a sudden both of our accounts are suspended! What in the world is going on? We have both been long-time loyal customers of Full Tilt, yet now we are being punished--apparently because I called 2p2's attention to a possible email leak at Full Tilt. I am beyond upset!
I am trying to not overreact in all of this and am waiting for some kind of explanation from you, Sean, or someone else at Full Tilt. Part of me wants to write a very upset thread on two plus two, but I am refraining from doing so until you or Sean have a chance to respond.
Please get back with me as quickly as possible.
Sincerely,
Andronicus
Quote:
From: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com> Add contact
To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.com
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 05:47:19 -0600
Hello,
Thank you for your reply.
To help us with our investigation can you please answer the following questions:
1) Can you please confirm that whoever is controlling "xxxxxxxxxxx" is also controlling the account "yyyyyyyyyy"?
2) Can you please confirm how long this has gone on for?
Thank you for your cooperation.
Regards,
Peter
Security
Full Tilt Poker
To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.com
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 05:47:19 -0600
Hello,
Thank you for your reply.
To help us with our investigation can you please answer the following questions:
1) Can you please confirm that whoever is controlling "xxxxxxxxxxx" is also controlling the account "yyyyyyyyyy"?
2) Can you please confirm how long this has gone on for?
Thank you for your cooperation.
Regards,
Peter
Security
Full Tilt Poker
Quote:
From: xxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.com Add contact
To: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 08:21:03 -0600
Dear Peter,
I'm not exactly sure what you mean by control, but I can assure you
that only I play xxxxxxxx and only my wife XXXXX plays yyyyyyy. That said, we do save all our family login information and
passwords in a secure user ID and password program. We both have
access to that program and so we both can access each other's
account (in addition to poker accounts, this also includes other
non poker accounts like bank accounts, email accounts, etc.). But
neither of us EVER plays poker on the other person's account.
Sometimes, when our family needs money, one of us will login to
both of our poker accounts and cash out money from both for our
family. Or, recently (in just the last couple of days), I got a
cake spam email in my Full Tilt poker only email account. That was
suspicious since I don't use that account for anything but Full
Tilt. So, I started the following thread at the Two Plus Two
website:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...oes-full-tilt-
sell-share-account-email-lists-732365/
FTPSean contacted me and asked me for my Full Tilt user ID. I
promptly gave it to him to try to help uncover what was going on. I
also told my wife that I thought we should both change our emails
and passwords at Full Tilt just to be on the safe side. She asked
me to make the change on her account as well as my own. So that's
what I did. So, I guess in a sense both us have access to each
other accounts, and we both sometimes access each other's account
(for cashout or whatever other reason), but I assure you that
neither of us ever plays on the other person's account.
My wife and I have both played poker at Full Tilt for approximately
3 years. We help and coach each other a lot. We have continuously
made Full Tilt aware that we both play on Full Tilt and we have
been extremely open and honest about the fact that we both play and
have our own accounts. We have both sent in our ID to Full Tilt
poker and have always told Full Tilt that we live together and play
poker from the same household. For example, two to three years ago
we both qualified for a free Iron Man tournament. My wife borrowed
a laptop from a friend so that we could both play. However, several
days before starting the tournament, we sent Full Tilt an email
stating that we were married, that we both had qualified for the
same free Iron Man tournament, and asked if that would be a
problem. Full Tilt told us it would not, and simply advised us that
if we ended up on the same table to not share any hole card
information or other collaboration. Of course we agreed and we
would never do that anyhow. Anyhow, we never ended up on the same
table and both got knocked out before making the money. Since that
time, we both decided it would be better to never play in the same
tournament, nor on the same table just to avoid any possibility of
suspicion. As a result, that is the only tournament that we were
both signed up together for. We have never signed up for the same
tournament since. And, we have not played a single hand together on
the same table (since we never played a hand together even in that
tournament). And, we never play together at the same cash together.
My wife and I do pretty much everything together. We try to spend
as much time together as possible. We have found doing stuff
together makes our relationship stronger. This includes poker. We
study poker together; we develop poker strategy together; we try to
think of correct and optimal ways of playing poker; and we are
constantly trying to help both of us become better poker players.
My wife is my poker coach, and I am her poker coach. We study poker
together and come up with strategies together. For example, she and
I have both worked on preflop ranges and strategy we thought would
work best. We have both worked on shove and fold strategies in
short stack games. Also, while one of us is playing, we are
generally getting coached by the other. We try to help each other
as much as we can. What we do is we set time together where we
will both get our session in for the day. We have one computer in
our home, so we can only normally play one at a time (we'd have to
borrow someone else's laptop or computer if we both wanted to play
at the same time). Anyhow, when we play, one of us will play
first: sometimes her, sometimes me. We usually switch off who gets
to play first. Then, while one of us is playing, we try to have
the other person sweat the one that is playing (by sweat I mean
watch the other play, give strategy, pointers, advice, etc.). Then
when that person is done, the other person plays while the other
sweats. We have found that when we do that we both get better at
our game, and we get to spend more time together as a couple. We
have found this improves our poker game as well as our
relationship. Working together like this helps us both think about
and come to conclusions about the best ways to play in similar
situations. As a result, our game has evolved together.
Please understand that poker is enjoyable for us and we enjoy doing
it together as a couple. As far as I know, sweating each other
while the other plays is completely allowed. Cardrunner coaches and
other coaches from other poker training sites do this all the time.
The poker players on the TV show 2 months, 2 million also do this.
So, as far as I know, it is okay to sweat and help each other
during play. During these sweat sessions, I never actually played
the cards for my wife. She played them herself, and she never
played them for me. But, we did tend to listen to each other quite
a bit. These days, we find that we mostly end up coming to the same
conclusion on hands. That makes us feel like we are playing the
hands right.
Another reason we sweat each other is because it helps both of us
from going on tilt. Please know that we do not sweat every session
the other plays, but we try to as often as we can. I had one
session last November or December where my wife wasn't sweating me
and where I did particularly bad. I played some HU high limit cap
and some other high limit poker. I wish she were sweating me at the
time because I went on tilt and spewed a lot of chips. If she were
sweating me that session, I think she could have prevented me from
going on tilt. Anyhow, that's another reason we like to sweat each
other. It keeps our game more constant and helps prevent us from
going on tilt.
We also have a playful competition with each other to see who can
do better at poker. Lately my wife has been doing a lot better than
me, and she reminds me of that fact all the time
. In fact, I
have been losing lately, while she is still winning. She watches me
play, and agrees with the way I am playing, but she still likes to
tease me that she is doing better than me.
I hope that answers all your questions. My wife and I would like to
continue to play poker at Full Tilt. Please get back with me as
soon as you can.
Kind regards,
xxxxxx
To: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 08:21:03 -0600
Dear Peter,
I'm not exactly sure what you mean by control, but I can assure you
that only I play xxxxxxxx and only my wife XXXXX plays yyyyyyy. That said, we do save all our family login information and
passwords in a secure user ID and password program. We both have
access to that program and so we both can access each other's
account (in addition to poker accounts, this also includes other
non poker accounts like bank accounts, email accounts, etc.). But
neither of us EVER plays poker on the other person's account.
Sometimes, when our family needs money, one of us will login to
both of our poker accounts and cash out money from both for our
family. Or, recently (in just the last couple of days), I got a
cake spam email in my Full Tilt poker only email account. That was
suspicious since I don't use that account for anything but Full
Tilt. So, I started the following thread at the Two Plus Two
website:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...oes-full-tilt-
sell-share-account-email-lists-732365/
FTPSean contacted me and asked me for my Full Tilt user ID. I
promptly gave it to him to try to help uncover what was going on. I
also told my wife that I thought we should both change our emails
and passwords at Full Tilt just to be on the safe side. She asked
me to make the change on her account as well as my own. So that's
what I did. So, I guess in a sense both us have access to each
other accounts, and we both sometimes access each other's account
(for cashout or whatever other reason), but I assure you that
neither of us ever plays on the other person's account.
My wife and I have both played poker at Full Tilt for approximately
3 years. We help and coach each other a lot. We have continuously
made Full Tilt aware that we both play on Full Tilt and we have
been extremely open and honest about the fact that we both play and
have our own accounts. We have both sent in our ID to Full Tilt
poker and have always told Full Tilt that we live together and play
poker from the same household. For example, two to three years ago
we both qualified for a free Iron Man tournament. My wife borrowed
a laptop from a friend so that we could both play. However, several
days before starting the tournament, we sent Full Tilt an email
stating that we were married, that we both had qualified for the
same free Iron Man tournament, and asked if that would be a
problem. Full Tilt told us it would not, and simply advised us that
if we ended up on the same table to not share any hole card
information or other collaboration. Of course we agreed and we
would never do that anyhow. Anyhow, we never ended up on the same
table and both got knocked out before making the money. Since that
time, we both decided it would be better to never play in the same
tournament, nor on the same table just to avoid any possibility of
suspicion. As a result, that is the only tournament that we were
both signed up together for. We have never signed up for the same
tournament since. And, we have not played a single hand together on
the same table (since we never played a hand together even in that
tournament). And, we never play together at the same cash together.
My wife and I do pretty much everything together. We try to spend
as much time together as possible. We have found doing stuff
together makes our relationship stronger. This includes poker. We
study poker together; we develop poker strategy together; we try to
think of correct and optimal ways of playing poker; and we are
constantly trying to help both of us become better poker players.
My wife is my poker coach, and I am her poker coach. We study poker
together and come up with strategies together. For example, she and
I have both worked on preflop ranges and strategy we thought would
work best. We have both worked on shove and fold strategies in
short stack games. Also, while one of us is playing, we are
generally getting coached by the other. We try to help each other
as much as we can. What we do is we set time together where we
will both get our session in for the day. We have one computer in
our home, so we can only normally play one at a time (we'd have to
borrow someone else's laptop or computer if we both wanted to play
at the same time). Anyhow, when we play, one of us will play
first: sometimes her, sometimes me. We usually switch off who gets
to play first. Then, while one of us is playing, we try to have
the other person sweat the one that is playing (by sweat I mean
watch the other play, give strategy, pointers, advice, etc.). Then
when that person is done, the other person plays while the other
sweats. We have found that when we do that we both get better at
our game, and we get to spend more time together as a couple. We
have found this improves our poker game as well as our
relationship. Working together like this helps us both think about
and come to conclusions about the best ways to play in similar
situations. As a result, our game has evolved together.
Please understand that poker is enjoyable for us and we enjoy doing
it together as a couple. As far as I know, sweating each other
while the other plays is completely allowed. Cardrunner coaches and
other coaches from other poker training sites do this all the time.
The poker players on the TV show 2 months, 2 million also do this.
So, as far as I know, it is okay to sweat and help each other
during play. During these sweat sessions, I never actually played
the cards for my wife. She played them herself, and she never
played them for me. But, we did tend to listen to each other quite
a bit. These days, we find that we mostly end up coming to the same
conclusion on hands. That makes us feel like we are playing the
hands right.
Another reason we sweat each other is because it helps both of us
from going on tilt. Please know that we do not sweat every session
the other plays, but we try to as often as we can. I had one
session last November or December where my wife wasn't sweating me
and where I did particularly bad. I played some HU high limit cap
and some other high limit poker. I wish she were sweating me at the
time because I went on tilt and spewed a lot of chips. If she were
sweating me that session, I think she could have prevented me from
going on tilt. Anyhow, that's another reason we like to sweat each
other. It keeps our game more constant and helps prevent us from
going on tilt.
We also have a playful competition with each other to see who can
do better at poker. Lately my wife has been doing a lot better than
me, and she reminds me of that fact all the time
. In fact, Ihave been losing lately, while she is still winning. She watches me
play, and agrees with the way I am playing, but she still likes to
tease me that she is doing better than me.
I hope that answers all your questions. My wife and I would like to
continue to play poker at Full Tilt. Please get back with me as
soon as you can.
Kind regards,
xxxxxx
Quote:
03-13-2010, 10:41 AM
FTPSean
FullTilt Support Representative
HI Andronicus,
I asked the security team to look into your account, and all accounts that had this issue to see if there were any patterns to help us determine how your email addresses were obtained.
Are there any issues with your account that would lead the security team to need to suspend your account? If you have been acting outside of the rules of the site, it will need to be dealt with. While it was definitely not my intention to have your account suspended, any inappropriate action will have to be investigated and acted upon.
I will find out what is going on.
Sean
FTPSean
FullTilt Support Representative
HI Andronicus,
I asked the security team to look into your account, and all accounts that had this issue to see if there were any patterns to help us determine how your email addresses were obtained.
Are there any issues with your account that would lead the security team to need to suspend your account? If you have been acting outside of the rules of the site, it will need to be dealt with. While it was definitely not my intention to have your account suspended, any inappropriate action will have to be investigated and acted upon.
I will find out what is going on.
Sean
Quote:
From: yyyyyyyy@yyyyyy.com Add contact
To: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 10:59:29 -0600
Dear Peter-
xxxxxxxxx is my husband XXXXXXXX. I use the Screen Name yyyyyyyyy. I do not control his account and he doesn't control my
account. My husband sent you an email describing how we play poker
using one computer in our home. I agree fully with everything he
stated in his email.
Poker is the way my husband and I have chosen to provide income for
our family. We both enjoy playing very much. I would appreciate
your prompt attention to this matter so that we can resume playing.
If you have any further questions I will be happy to answer them.
Sincerely,
YYYYYYYYYY
yyyyyyyy
To: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 10:59:29 -0600
Dear Peter-
xxxxxxxxx is my husband XXXXXXXX. I use the Screen Name yyyyyyyyy. I do not control his account and he doesn't control my
account. My husband sent you an email describing how we play poker
using one computer in our home. I agree fully with everything he
stated in his email.
Poker is the way my husband and I have chosen to provide income for
our family. We both enjoy playing very much. I would appreciate
your prompt attention to this matter so that we can resume playing.
If you have any further questions I will be happy to answer them.
Sincerely,
YYYYYYYYYY
yyyyyyyy
Quote:
03-13-2010, 07:53 PM
Andronicus
Dear Sean:
Within just a few hours of giving you my screen name, Full Tilt suspended both my account as well as that of my wife's. However, both I and my wife have NOT acted outside the rules of FTP. We have tried to be completely honest, truthful, and above board with our play. After I sent you a PM asking you what in the world was going on, I got another email from your security department that said the following:
Sean, let me tell you a little about myself. I am married with three kids. My wife and I are both avid poker players and we try to support poker in any way that we can. We are both paid members of the Poker Player's Alliance (PPA), and we have both made calls, signed petitions, and written letters to our representatives to show support in our right to play poker. We also have tried to show support for Full Tilt. Through our shared affiliate, we have also gotten several friends and relatives to sign up at Full Tilt.
I am also an active and long-time member of the Two Plus Two community. When I observed a potential security threat (the spam email), I notified everyone at two plus two to bring to light something that could be a security risk at all of our accounts. Ironically, it seems as a result of my efforts to help improve security for all players of the game, I and my wife are now being attacked. This is so unfair, and how we are now being treated is extremely hurtful to me and my family.
My wife and I have both chosen to play poker as our primary source of income for our family. My wife and I play our poker together as a couple. This strengthens both our relationship as a couple as well as our poker game. Poker has turned out to be a good thing for our family.
Since we both played poker, we knew it would be against the rules for us to play on separate accounts, so we both signed up our own accounts. We have always been completely upfront about this fact with Full Tilt. (Please realize that both of our accounts are rakeback accounts. That had nothing to do with us both signing up an account.) When one of us has sent an email to Full Tilt, we have more than once mentioned or reminded Full Tilt that our spouse also had an account. Both my wife and I have been playing poker at Full Tilt for the past three years. Full Tilt has always been aware of this fact. Not once have we tried to hide this fact. We've always tried to be upfront with Full Tilt about the fact that we both played poker at Full Tilt and that we both had an account. And, we have also been very careful to not play on the same table as each other.
I hope you can see why it seems highly coincidental that my wife and I have both played at Full Tilt for three years and yet not once before now has Full Tilt ever called our play into question. The only time Full Tilt has called our play into question is after I made a thread bringing to light a possible security leak at Full Tilt. So, only after I expose a possible negative, and only after I give you my Screen Name do me and my wife get attacked.
Here's an example of how we've always tried to play above board: early when we started playing, we both qualified for an Iron Man tournament. Several days before playing, we contacted Full Tilt and let them know that we had qualified for the same tournament and asked if we could both play even though we were a married couple. Please note that Full Tilt did not contact us initially about the possible problem of us both playing in the same tournament. My wife and I could have played in the tournament and not said anything to Full Tilt. However, to play completely above board, my wife and I were the ones that contacted Full Tilt. We contacted Full Tilt because we felt it was the right thing to do.
Full Tilt said we could both play in that same Iron Man Tournament, but to not share any hole card information or otherwise collaborate if we ever ended up on the same table. We agreed and would not have done that anyhow. Again, we would have never shared our hole cards because we did not feel that would be the right thing to do. That is the only time we have ever played in the same tournament. We have never played in the same tournament since. We did not ever end up even playing on the same table in that one tournament. And, we have never played a cash game together.
I understand that my wife and I have a similar poker game. That does not surprise me at all. We are each other's poker coach and we work together to try to improve our game. My wife and I have developed our poker strategy together. I don't think there is anything wrong with that. In the end, however, it is always me that is clicking the mouse and making the final decisions on poker played my account and it is always my wife clicking the mouse and making the final decisions on poker played on her account.
Anyhow, I'll send you another PM with my email response to Peter. Please take a look at what I wrote to him. I would appreciate your help on this. My family and I need this resolved as quickly as possible. The mere suspension of our accounts is already hurting us.
Kind regards,
xxxxxxxx
Andronicus
Dear Sean:
Within just a few hours of giving you my screen name, Full Tilt suspended both my account as well as that of my wife's. However, both I and my wife have NOT acted outside the rules of FTP. We have tried to be completely honest, truthful, and above board with our play. After I sent you a PM asking you what in the world was going on, I got another email from your security department that said the following:
Quote:
1) Can you please confirm that whoever is controlling "xxxxxxxxxx" is also controlling the account "yyyyyyyyy"?
2) Can you please confirm how long this has gone on for?
2) Can you please confirm how long this has gone on for?
I am also an active and long-time member of the Two Plus Two community. When I observed a potential security threat (the spam email), I notified everyone at two plus two to bring to light something that could be a security risk at all of our accounts. Ironically, it seems as a result of my efforts to help improve security for all players of the game, I and my wife are now being attacked. This is so unfair, and how we are now being treated is extremely hurtful to me and my family.
My wife and I have both chosen to play poker as our primary source of income for our family. My wife and I play our poker together as a couple. This strengthens both our relationship as a couple as well as our poker game. Poker has turned out to be a good thing for our family.
Since we both played poker, we knew it would be against the rules for us to play on separate accounts, so we both signed up our own accounts. We have always been completely upfront about this fact with Full Tilt. (Please realize that both of our accounts are rakeback accounts. That had nothing to do with us both signing up an account.) When one of us has sent an email to Full Tilt, we have more than once mentioned or reminded Full Tilt that our spouse also had an account. Both my wife and I have been playing poker at Full Tilt for the past three years. Full Tilt has always been aware of this fact. Not once have we tried to hide this fact. We've always tried to be upfront with Full Tilt about the fact that we both played poker at Full Tilt and that we both had an account. And, we have also been very careful to not play on the same table as each other.
I hope you can see why it seems highly coincidental that my wife and I have both played at Full Tilt for three years and yet not once before now has Full Tilt ever called our play into question. The only time Full Tilt has called our play into question is after I made a thread bringing to light a possible security leak at Full Tilt. So, only after I expose a possible negative, and only after I give you my Screen Name do me and my wife get attacked.
Here's an example of how we've always tried to play above board: early when we started playing, we both qualified for an Iron Man tournament. Several days before playing, we contacted Full Tilt and let them know that we had qualified for the same tournament and asked if we could both play even though we were a married couple. Please note that Full Tilt did not contact us initially about the possible problem of us both playing in the same tournament. My wife and I could have played in the tournament and not said anything to Full Tilt. However, to play completely above board, my wife and I were the ones that contacted Full Tilt. We contacted Full Tilt because we felt it was the right thing to do.
Full Tilt said we could both play in that same Iron Man Tournament, but to not share any hole card information or otherwise collaborate if we ever ended up on the same table. We agreed and would not have done that anyhow. Again, we would have never shared our hole cards because we did not feel that would be the right thing to do. That is the only time we have ever played in the same tournament. We have never played in the same tournament since. We did not ever end up even playing on the same table in that one tournament. And, we have never played a cash game together.
I understand that my wife and I have a similar poker game. That does not surprise me at all. We are each other's poker coach and we work together to try to improve our game. My wife and I have developed our poker strategy together. I don't think there is anything wrong with that. In the end, however, it is always me that is clicking the mouse and making the final decisions on poker played my account and it is always my wife clicking the mouse and making the final decisions on poker played on her account.
Anyhow, I'll send you another PM with my email response to Peter. Please take a look at what I wrote to him. I would appreciate your help on this. My family and I need this resolved as quickly as possible. The mere suspension of our accounts is already hurting us.
Kind regards,
xxxxxxxx
15. The next day, I send Sean another PM:
Quote:
March 14, 2010, 04:44 AM
Andronicus
Sean
Sean, our family is undergoing a lot of stress because of the suspension of our accounts. We are especially disturbed because the email your security department sent us sounded more like accusations than actual questions. For your reference here is the email your support department sent me:
These accusations are so upsetting because my wife and I know we have done nothing wrong. The more I read these requests, the more I realize that they are accusations rather than questions. It is also hurtful because all I was trying to do was help you uncover why spam emails got sent to mine and many of your customer's email accounts. So, I freely and immediately gave you my screen name. Yet, it was not more than a couple hours after I gave you my screen name that I and my wife were both being attacked by your security team. It is hard for me to put in words how betrayed I feel by Full Tilt Poker right now. We feel even more betrayed because we have remained true loyal customers of Full Tilt for the past three years. We have both always tried to play a true and honest game. We also try to keep the game enjoyable for others. I don't think either of us has ever made a disparaging remark to the other people at the table. I know I haven't and my wife says she hasn't either. My wife and I have also both gotten several other people to sign up at your site as well. How much more loyalty can you ask for in a customer?
Sean, please help us. My wife and I have always tried to play within the rules, so it makes us feel extremely attacked when your security team closes our accounts and makes accusations against us as they did in the email above. A huge part of me wants to post about all of this on 2p2 or wherever, but I am trying to remain calm, and want to wait on Full Tilt's decision before posting anything. But, please understand that the longer this drags on, the more hurtful this becomes to our family.
I believe Full Tilt will ultimately exonerate us of any wrongdoing in this investigation. At this time, we are giving Full Tilt every benefit of the doubt. Right now, we ask that this be resolved expeditiously. Please know that we have three kids to support. A large part of our family's funds are tied up in our Full Tilt accounts, and we'd like to be able to access them and we'd like to be able to play poker again. Please help us.
Please get back with me at your earliest convenience.
Kind regards,
Andronicus
Andronicus
Quote:
Originally Posted by FTPSean
I will find out what is going on.
I will find out what is going on.
Sean, our family is undergoing a lot of stress because of the suspension of our accounts. We are especially disturbed because the email your security department sent us sounded more like accusations than actual questions. For your reference here is the email your support department sent me:
Quote:
From: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com> Add contact
To: xxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.com
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 04:47:19 -0700
Hello,
Thank you for your reply.
To help us with our investigation can you please answer the following questions:
1) Can you please confirm that whoever is controlling "xxxxxxxxxx" is also controlling the account "yyyyyyyyy"?
2) Can you please confirm how long this has gone on for?
Thank you for your cooperation.
Regards,
Peter
Security
Full Tilt Poker
To: xxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.com
Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 04:47:19 -0700
Hello,
Thank you for your reply.
To help us with our investigation can you please answer the following questions:
1) Can you please confirm that whoever is controlling "xxxxxxxxxx" is also controlling the account "yyyyyyyyy"?
2) Can you please confirm how long this has gone on for?
Thank you for your cooperation.
Regards,
Peter
Security
Full Tilt Poker
Sean, please help us. My wife and I have always tried to play within the rules, so it makes us feel extremely attacked when your security team closes our accounts and makes accusations against us as they did in the email above. A huge part of me wants to post about all of this on 2p2 or wherever, but I am trying to remain calm, and want to wait on Full Tilt's decision before posting anything. But, please understand that the longer this drags on, the more hurtful this becomes to our family.
I believe Full Tilt will ultimately exonerate us of any wrongdoing in this investigation. At this time, we are giving Full Tilt every benefit of the doubt. Right now, we ask that this be resolved expeditiously. Please know that we have three kids to support. A large part of our family's funds are tied up in our Full Tilt accounts, and we'd like to be able to access them and we'd like to be able to play poker again. Please help us.
Please get back with me at your earliest convenience.
Kind regards,
Andronicus
Quote:
Yesterday, 07:28 AM
FTPSean
FullTilt Support Representative
I will be in contact with the security team as soon as possible.
Sean
FTPSean
FullTilt Support Representative
I will be in contact with the security team as soon as possible.
Sean
Quote:
From: Full Tilt Poker - Security <security@fulltiltpoker.com> Add contact
To: xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.com
Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 09:45:44 -0600
Hello XXXXXX,
Thank you for your response
We are in the process of concluding our investigation into this matter.
Contrary to what you have explained, we have garnered significant technical data (including, but not limited to: analyzing chat histories, login histories, transaction details & gameplay,) which leads us to believe that it is the same person playing on both accounts.
We place great emphasis on the integrity of our site , we cannot allow players to play on any account other than their own. Violations of our terms and conditions pertaining to this matter is considered one of the worst offences a player can commit.
Having said that, we value when a player is forthright and cooperates with our investigations. We take a players cooperation into consideration when we come reach our final decision on the matter.
Prior to the conclusion of the investigation we would like to offer you a final opportunity to provide any additional information related to the questions we have raised previously.
We thank you for your continued cooperation and await your reply.
Regards,
Security
Full Tilt Poker
To: xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.com
Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 09:45:44 -0600
Hello XXXXXX,
Thank you for your response
We are in the process of concluding our investigation into this matter.
Contrary to what you have explained, we have garnered significant technical data (including, but not limited to: analyzing chat histories, login histories, transaction details & gameplay,) which leads us to believe that it is the same person playing on both accounts.
We place great emphasis on the integrity of our site , we cannot allow players to play on any account other than their own. Violations of our terms and conditions pertaining to this matter is considered one of the worst offences a player can commit.
Having said that, we value when a player is forthright and cooperates with our investigations. We take a players cooperation into consideration when we come reach our final decision on the matter.
Prior to the conclusion of the investigation we would like to offer you a final opportunity to provide any additional information related to the questions we have raised previously.
We thank you for your continued cooperation and await your reply.
Regards,
Security
Full Tilt Poker
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