I am glad you didn't end up in several pieces buried out in the desert after threatening some of these big shots! Looks like you played it smart! Yes the apathy is total and will remain that way. They may not skate on the ML charges, however, it looks like they will keep the dividends unless the PS deal is done, and that is only a maybe

The biggest slow roll of all time may be this thread.

We are talking about the no.1 poker player of the world. Not a professional football player with half a brain. This is someone who works with VPIP, PFR, standard deviatons. He makes complex propbets. He puts a lot of energy in making a couple of $100,000 at the tables or in inventing a propbet for that amount. At the same time, some people here think, he didn't pay any attention to his share in FTP worth tens of millions. If you are that naive, you better find another hobby, because you probably suck at poker too.
This last part is not directed at you, bizzle, but at everybody who thinks Ivey didn't have any clue what was going on.

Seriously? I mean, SERIOUSLY?

[ ] start room=popular room
[ ] owners disappeared
[ ] LasVegas = island
[ ] WSOP = secluded
[ ] op would win bet

This is the guy (Ivey) who didn't know who Jonathan duhamel was a few months ago, who didnt know what EV is, and who doesn't know what swapping is.

By all accounts, he is willfully oblivious to most things in the poker world.

I'm not saying what he did or did not know , though. I'm simply saying that we don't know what anyone knew, and I won't assume anyone knew anything, besides bitar, until I hear so based on fact, not speculation

You don't have a clue what Ivy knew or knows. Nor do I! You just like to rave on here on 2+2 for fun. Nothing wrong with that on NVG BTW, very normal, but your post is silly! Maybe you are right about him, it is possible, but your own description of him shows him to be one of the most sucessful degen gamblers and certainly not someone with day to day intrest in business details. He was mostly interested in getting his money and gambling.

Knew online poker was rigged.

any news the past few days?

If you are playing poker do you also think that way? "I have no clue what he is holding, I believe it when I see it". Or do you use your ability to think logical and take a calculated guess what your opponent has.
Now I paint you a picture.
Ivey, extremely smart, extremely money hungry (took loans while making tens of millions), has a few percent in a billion dollar company and in all those years he didn't have any interest what went on inside FTP.
Now, what does your gut feeling say?

Compared with him we all are morans. His brain is one giant pokertracker. Nothing escapes his attention, at a pokertable or on other things concerning money.

I say I don't know and neither do you, is that clear enough yet?? People who play poker with their " gut feelings" are total amateurs! You have decided what the answer is without really knowing any of the facts, so if you want to continue the poker anology your play here is basically all in based on no serious knowledge of your opponents situation, just your feelings. Well maybe you are right, you could be. But I think you are a young Dutch boy looking for entertainment on the site, trolling a little, but mostly serious. I grow weary of this, end of debate from my end. GL to you sir, I hope you recover your FTP funds

For those of you who think the pros you see on tv are better at poker than everyone else, let me assure you that they're not. At least not in the sense of knowing when to bet, hold, fold etc.

What they are better at usually, is the business aspect of the game. They get endorsement deals and contracts and book deals which in turn allows them to play in more tournaments (often for free) which then allows them to make more tv appearances to keep the ball rolling. Most of the really famous players were around before moneymaker's win and just grandparented into success with money being thrown at them.

The other thing that famous pros are better at is finding big games with ultra wealthy people who don't care about losing a few million here and there. This is where Ivey has shone in the past, playing poker with Celine dions husband and now playing in Macau with rich Asian businessmen who are willing to gamble that they will catch a flush on the river.

Finally, the online pros like dwan and isuldur have made a name for themselves simply for how reckless they play. The huge bankroll swings they were taking was simply great publicity for them and their sites. Not sure I would call it great poker.

Have people like Phil hellmuth won a lot of bracelets..?. Yes.. he has done very well over the years but he's also played in a ton of world series events and won many of them when there were a hundred players in the field and not a thousand.

Has Phil Ivey done well at poker? Yes, but aside from the ability to find big games and continuing to cash in on his reputation if he were to sit down anonymously at a pokerstars 50$ dollar tournament he would just be one of the many players to keep an eye on.

You did a good job leaving out the part where I said he should be held accountable if indeed FTP fails to pay out in full in the near future.

He's a degenerate gambler who most likely does not have anywhere close to the 8 figures he received from FTP over the years. I have no idea how "hard" he tried to help during the crisis (judging by his selfish lawsuit prob not much). His initial quote when confronted in his first WSOP event was: "I tried everything man". Maybe you can comment on that.

I'm not saying he's right to show up at the WSOP and play. But I have to admit it's really smart move on his part to make public appearances while hope is still alive for a repayment. He's pretty much the only one that can pull it off and he's doing it right now with the whole community embracing his success (again, in the context that FTP could still pay players).

Why not? Some "rigtarding" theories actually make sense, and have been discussed/proposed by intelligent, well respected members of the community. That close-minded, dismissive attitude is exactly what let Full Tilt get away with everything in the first place.

Because there is already a dedicated rigtarding thread.

Same reason why intelligent discussions of FTP take place here or about politics takes place in Politards.

Do you think this topic in this thread really deserves another hundred page derail? As much fun as it would be to read long ranty posts accusing everyone from Annie Duke to Daniel Negraneau to the man in the moon for rigging FTP, followed by fifteen pages of pictures of people wearing tinfoil hats, the answer is.... not really.

If anyone had anything at all to substantiate claims of FTP being rigged, it would certainly be threadworthy in its own right and shouldn't be posted here anyway.

If you have proof: Start a new thread.
If you don't: Put it in the rigtard thread where it belongs.

I know getting people to post in the right spot in NVG is like herding coked out cats, but I'm glad the mods put forth the effort.

Checking this thread for news and....

don't waste your time doing that, just check the main page of nvg and a new thread will be started with any big news

My concern is that Full Tilt was clearly under serious financial pressure in the year leading up to Black Friday that led to drastic- no, absolutely insane- decisions like accepting phantom deposits to retain their consumer base. One of the best ways to keep players on the site would be to artificially offset the fishes' losses at the expense of winning players. A subtle enough alteration would be extremely difficult to prove as statistically relevant, but distributed across thousands of players would absolutely affect the site in a meaningful way.

My point is that for all the pressure being put on Full Tilt's accounting, the integrity of the software itself has flown completely under the radar despite the motive for sabotage being absolutely consistent with everything we know now about Full Tilt. This is very relevant to the topic at hand, labeling the possibility of Full Tilt being rigged prima facie as "******ed" is very inappropriate. The fact is that the sensitivity of this topic is extremely high. For the Full Tilt brand to resurface- which, to be sure, is the best result for everyone- it's vital that the whole debacle comes across as mere financial mismanagement. I think so too, and I wouldn't share that kind of information even if I had it. But don't dismiss that possibility as ******ed, because it isn't.

+1

I miss the softwere, sound and my money.

I hate "poker is rigged" threads and posts. But This man speaks truth =).


Dont forget that as far as i know of, biggest arguments against "poker is rigged" were

1. Its all regulated by someone who gives them license
2. Why would they do that, risking their reputation, considering they make tons of monies anyway.

Well i think given what we´v learned during last year, both of these arguments are pretty laughable =)

You could actually go into the software files on your computer and play the sounds. Though, I'd say that is hitting a new low.

way ahead of you. i modded the full tilt sounds on to pokerstars a loooooong time ago

I think you're reading too much into the use of the word rigtarding.

If a serious, viable thread with proof that FTP was rigged were to emerge, it would be allowed a stand alone thread. That isn't what was happening in this thread at this time, however.

This made me LOL.

cool, couldnt resist, hitting the new low then i guess

Is this hard to do ?