[QUOTE=The Palimax;26014841]
PMI was, obviously, scamming us. They lied about the status of your refund when you called, "Oh, we processed it yesterday..." and they billed us THREE TIMES for what was supposed to be on erroneous duplicate charge miss-sent to the wrong processor. ...but they were hard to get to on the telephone because it's likely just one person sitting in an office somewhere answering the phone from time to time because that's what her bosses told her to do for $8 an hour. [Did we all speak to the same professional sounding accent-neutral lady?]
/QUOTE]

When they say that they processed it yesterday, why not ask for proof that they actually did so?

Or would this be all for nothing, because they could just fake some authorization/paperwork and send that to you if you threw a big enough ****storm?

I tried counting to ten, but it didn't help.

I have been a proponent of FT for years, but the latest update is so fallable it leaves me questioning my judgement. I harbor no ill will towards Sean or Doug in this matter. It's clear to me that they have a job to do, and they must toe the company line.

As a player, I am the smallest of plankton that feed the fish. The sharks who feed on the fish need people like me to keep depositing and playing. As inconsequential as my total rake would seem, it roughly equates to the weekly salary of a top-level customer service employee. If I and fifty-one others like me stop playing, then FT will have to find another way to fund that person's yearly payroll, or do without their expertise.

I get no comfort in their assurances. Whether by glitch or design, it's abundantly clear that the banking information given to FT has not been kept secure. Because of that, it's prudent for me to sever all ties between my bank and FT. It will be a hassle to reset all my automatic banking, but well worth it considering how weak FT's response is up to now.

I'll keep a close eye on this as it develops. I'm hoping against all hope for full disclosure and resolution.

In the meantime...

This, I am unaffected by PMI but I sure as hell dont trust FTP with payment information after reading this thread and their responses

PLEASE EMAIL FULL TILT. Copy Dougs response in your email, and write to them asking for an explaination about why you received 2 $38 dollar charges even though you do not have a coresponding amount taken in July. Say that Doug and the "FT Legal Department" claim that these transactions match deposits made in july. Mine do not. Can you account for this...

POST THEIR RESPONSE HERE.

Thanks

When I called a few things were on my mind:

• Hory Sheet! I'm going to get my $600 back.
• The person I was talking to was clearly a low-level CSR and clearly on a script. I've talked to enough of them to know.
• Others reported trying to ask other questions and getting stonewalled.

I could have done better. I could have recorded the call, but if they're in California, it's a two-party state, and I'd be breaking the law. I could have asked more questions, but see my first point above. I had called them a dozen times, left multiple messages, I was pretty excited to get through to them.

We need to get as much information as possible. I am taking any information they supply and fact checking. It is a good practice and you should try it sometime. This way we can start to determine if they are being credible, or not, and thus whether or not we can start trusting them...

Rather than attack me, you should think of ways to be constructive.

How does it feel to be the most useless poster in the whole forum? Even more useless than spaceghost.

BBV is that'a'way, son.

There's an element of truth here, and I'm sure there's not a single US 2p2er who doesn't want politicians to get out of out wallets and stop trying to be our mommy. We should all be regularly on our reps tails to fix this. There are other threads and forums for that, so I won't say more. Certainly I want more US friendly sites as well, not fewer.

So yeah, some hassle is ok. Delays in getting withdrawals? I'm willing to deal. Cumbersome deposits? I'm willing to deal. Third parties making unauthorized withdrawals from player accounts? I'm sorry, I love poker and FT has been my favorite site for years, but I don't love doing business with ANY company in ANY industry enough for that.

One thing that would be nice is being able to block all electronic transfers without prior authorization. It's pretty insane that anybody with your bank info can siphon money out. I'm frankly amazed this doesn't happen more.

RF

I dont think i attacked you....i asked you a question.

I thought perhaps you hadnt thought of that scenerio and i would point it ut to you.

Are you always so defensive? Show me in my post where i attacked you...lol

You dont know what attacking is...lol

Totally understandable not to rock the boat while you're getting your "hory sheet" $600 back.

That's probably their reasoning with only picking up after you call 10+ times. You're much more likely not to give them a third degree with questions/threats and just acquiesce to receiving your money back b/c of their "mistake".

Go find a bridge to live under and leave the forums to adult humans.

Guys, guys, guys, don't feed the trolls. Ignore their remarks, hell report them if you feel so inclined. Let's keep this on topic.


Hopefully others are PM-ing FTP Doug and Sean expressing our complete dissatisfaction with their companies response, and request for a new one.

i owe them a small amount of money from uncleared deposits, around 150$. I'm going to close my bank account to insure this doesnt happens to me and simply email them telling them my actions and that I would be happy to pay them by any reasonable means they have avalible. I thinks that the action that I need to take to ensure my money is safe and still honor my debt

+1, an honest poker player who pays what he owes AND protects himself at the same time, good for you.

.

Just wondering how many of you upset people who got charged mistakenly have quit FTP this month? Are you mad enough to sacrifice the upcoming IM mid year bonus?

I DIDN'T get charged by PMI in this and I personally quit FT, requested (not received yet) a full withdrawal and am keeping all of my play at PS now (top notch CS and they handled the 'processor delay' issue properly by debiting poker accounts for the transactions and allowing players to re-deposit if necessary). Nope, FT will NEVER see another dime of my play. I'm sure that has them scared since I'm a little tiny fishy but I vote with my wallet.

Mean you jackass. Just leave this is a serious problem.

What I don't understand is how any bank could be giving people a hard time about reversing these. Anyone who sees the face of one of your checks has all the information they would need to make an unauthorized ACH transfer. Getting away with it is a different story, but at least there should be a way to reverse these, and without your bank having to eat it.

One big question unasked is where did the money go?

Presumably the company DBA "PMI" is a payment processing company. They take money from account (a) and put it in account (b) in exchange for taking a percentage of it.

To what account did the money go to? Did PMI keep it, or did the forward it along. If they were processing FTP transactions accidentally, did my $600 go on vacation over at FTP and did PMI just take their cut? If they were just completely rogue, did they keep them?

Inquiring minds...

Although one should be able to file a dispute in 60 days, some banks are better about reversing these transactions than others.

My bank, for example, was very difficult to dispute these with.
Others, however, had great success.

I'm assuming the money is at FTP covering the deposits that have not been taken out yet.

I personally will keep playing on FTP with money I have avalible on there, but I will never deposit another dime.

I imagine that should FTP provide a sufficient explanation of who, exactly, PMI was and how they're going to make sure this doesn't happen again (and, again, I get that anyone who ever got a check from you has your acct/rout), and the details of this story don't detail gross negligence by FTP -- then I assume that I'll continue to play there.

I get that they can't jeopardize ongoing legal action.
I get that they can't burn existing processors.
I know this might take time.

...but we need a little better from them.