Uh oh, Syrians North Koreans better head to their bomb shelters.

You know how al Qaeda and ISIS like to blow up old religious monuments? The dopes referring to ISIS consider removing these statues the same thing. This is the left "attacking history".

I doubt his plaint is even that sophisticated. Bad thing happened means that it was caused by the league of bad people (ISIS, al-Qaeda, Kim Jong-un, Hamas, the Black Panthers, and Democrats joined together against the GOP).

and obama too. cant forget to include him in that league.

anyway, I was listened to npr a bit ago and they mentioned that the city was scared to announce exactly when they would take it down bc they feared for the safety of the contractors.

thats also why they did it in the wee hours this morning and some of the workers were wearing bullet proof vests.

What the ****?

I think there is a significant difference between monuments erected in the past in order to commemorate events in the even more distant past and hateful artifacts in the present with no tie to significant historical events. Just because a monument was once erected in support of something awful doesn't mean it shouldn't exist as a piece of history in the present.

IMO there is value in preserving history, even history centered around atrocities.

I forgot the illegal immigrants aka MS-13, too.

Yes well if GOP voters understood macro concepts and weren't dumb and cowardly they'd be liberals.

I generally agree with this, except when it is promulgating hate. Put it in a museum instead of a public space in the open.

Putting things in a museum to preserve them (and allow for accompanying explanation) is generally the better choice, regardless.

That's true. However, many of these Confederate Monuments were put up specifically to demean and intimidate the black populations of these areas. They were put up during the period after Reconstruction and they were often put around buildings like courthouses, federal buildings, post offices, and so forth so that black citizens were forced to see them on a regular basis. They were emblems of intimidation and a reminder that black citizens could be lynched at a minute's notice, as well as a constant reminder that those black citizens wouldn't be treated even close to equal by the state of Louisiana even though they were ordered to do so by the feds.

Basically, these monuments were a form of political propaganda and even terrorism. They were a very important part of "The Lost Cause" which I highly recommend everyone to read more about.

This is still up at Harper's Ferry as far as I know.

Racism trumps all. Not really that complicated.

The Lost Cause
http://civil-war-journeys.org/the_lost_cause.htm

The author of that article calls the Reconstruction period "oppressive," but what came after was the Reign of Terror. White southerners unleashed the full out force of violence against the black residents of the South after federal troops left the south in 1877 under the Compromise of 1877. This was the true goal of The Lost Cause--a new age of political terrorism where White Supremacy was enforced through violence and fear. And to this day we have trouble teaching this period in the classroom. Why? Perhaps because it's an example of terrorism that was incredibly successful at accomplishing its goals. It's not something we like to talk about.

A lot of these monuments were installed by the Daughters of the Confederacy well into the 20th century, esp during the rise of the clan in the 20s and the civil rights movement in the 60s. As you can imagine, they're often riddled with inaccuracies, racist trolling, and Lost Cause historical retconning.

When the Confederate flag outside the SC was taken down, a lot of news sources casually mentioned that the flag had been flying for 50 years. Now hold up, 50 years? That's a century after the Confederacy ended; why did SC decide to start flying rebel flags in the 1960s? These are questions that really shouldn't have been overlooked.

Edit: a timeline of Confederate memorials

Definitely, but it is certainly an example of the pushback during the civil rights movement and should be documented as such along with accompanying signage indicating the racism behind it.

fixed.

Yea, this is just another way to erase the bad history of the South and be like "C'mon guys, we were never racist!" It's like Texas removing slaves from History books or whatever the **** they did.

Ah, I see you guys are now privy to the long nightmare that has been the New Orleans monument debate. People outside the city get really frothy when this comes up. Here's what the city has:

Liberty Place Monument - Literally celebrates a white uprising that killed 9 police officers during reconstruction. There's no reason whatsoever it should still be around and has been a flash point for demonstrations for years.

Statue of Robert E. Lee - Prominently located in Lee Circle (formerly Tivoli Circle). Celebrates a man who led a revolt and has absolutely nothing to with New Orleans, a city that capitulated extremely early in the Civil War without much push back.

Statue of Jefferson Davis - At least he died in New Orleans and came in and out of the city a decent amount? Anyway, they have a big plaque at the house where he died calling him a great American. That's on private property at least.

PGT Beauregard - The only one with even a passing argument. Yeah, he was a Confederate general. He also hated Jefferson Davis and was instrumental in convincing him to end the war. Post-war he had a deep history in New Orleans where he actually formed a party in favor of many civil rights, including voting for freed slaves, and was pretty instrumental in building up the infrastructure of the city. A statue of him could be possibly justified in the proper context, but then they went and dressed him up in a Confederate uniform on top of a war horse so we all know what that was about. Adios muchaco.

I may have missed this in the beginning of this thread, but Alabama and Mississippi state offices are closed today for Confederate Memorial Day.

didnt they revoke the citizenship of high ranking confederates after the war anyway? like, technically, lee and davis werent even americans right?

It's like Trump learned a new word and uses it every chance he gets.

Wait, they celebrate Confederate Memorial Day? WTF?

Maybe just take a picture and tear down the monument? I have little respect for a monument that's historically inaccurate and plainly designed to push back against civil rights.

dont they celebrate something different on MLK day too?

yup, Biloxi called it "Great Americans Day" and celebrated Robert E Lee's birthday on the same day.

racism totally not dead tho.