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FTP Discussion Thread (Everything but big new news goes here. Cliffs in OP) FTP Discussion Thread (Everything but big new news goes here. Cliffs in OP)
View Poll Results: Do you want the AGCC to regulate the new FTP?
Yes
1,156 56.58%
No
887 43.42%

05-24-2012 , 11:26 AM
CM needs another FTP server down to distract everyone for the rest of the day. LET THE SPECULATION CONTINUE!
05-24-2012 , 11:26 AM
This will pass, it's already irrevelent, some new item will pop up and grab the spotlight!
05-24-2012 , 11:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by banseizurefrogs
One significant piece of new information is that two sites have chosen to pay up on back taxes. That means they don't think, and that their lawyers don't think, Spain's claims to back taxes are meritless. If they thought they could fight these in court and win they would. That means the likelihood that PS will be paying something substantial is very high. Failure to pay could jeopardize PS ability to do business anywhere in the EU (which is most their market). This is an important fact in the global solution of PS problems.
05-24-2012 , 11:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gioco
One significant piece of new information is that two sites have chosen to pay up on back taxes. That means they don't think, and that their lawyers don't think, Spain's claims to back taxes are meritless. If they thought they could fight these in court and win they would. That means the likelihood that PS will be paying something substantial is very high. Failure to pay could jeopardize PS ability to do business anywhere in the EU (which is most their market). This is an important fact in the global solution of PS problems.
another fly in the ointment? Pretty soon, no more ointment
05-24-2012 , 11:39 AM
Any article that uses G Poker as a source should be excluded from this thread, they are completely worthless.
05-24-2012 , 11:40 AM
The "Spain backtaxes jeopardize the Stars/FTP deal" would make sense if, say, PokerStars was an eight-yearold child who had been saving up all his pocket money to buy this really cool LEGO set but then his Tricycle broke at the last minute so now he can't afford the lego this week.

The main issue is PokerStars is not an eight-yearold child but huge international company with billions in their coffers. That is not to say both aren't significant deals but the idea that one would then affect the other because "well we only have so much cash we have to pick one!" is laughable. It was laughable the first time someone 'analyzed' this in that stupid G-poker.ca PR article last week, it's even more laughable now it's been regurgitated this week
05-24-2012 , 11:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bene Gesserit
another fly in the ointment? Pretty soon, no more ointment
Absolutely, it would be interesting to know if they have settled with France, Belgium and Italy or if they are waiting for those shoes to drop.
05-24-2012 , 12:03 PM
joey plz stfu u tilt the **** out of most ppl here. At least Chinadude is giving " info" of what he thinks is correct
05-24-2012 , 12:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hood
The "Spain backtaxes jeopardize the Stars/FTP deal" would make sense if, say, PokerStars was an eight-yearold child who had been saving up all his pocket money to buy this really cool LEGO set but then his Tricycle broke at the last minute so now he can't afford the lego this week.

The main issue is PokerStars is not an eight-yearold child but huge international company with billions in their coffers. That is not to say both aren't significant deals but the idea that one would then affect the other because "well we only have so much cash we have to pick one!" is laughable. It was laughable the first time someone 'analyzed' this in that stupid G-poker.ca PR article last week, it's even more laughable now it's been regurgitated this week
Some good points, and the profitability and management of the corporation are important, but to be fair and view the whole picture, most of PS's accounts and funds remain frozen by the US government, the US government has a claim for over $3 billion against it and its owner faces the possibility of a very long prison term.
05-24-2012 , 12:15 PM
If the DOJ/FTP deal is a good deal (+EV if we must), it's a good deal. If paying the demands of the Spanish tax man is a good deal, it's a good deal. Of course they have limited funds but it's just crazy to me one would jeopardize the other. The original article was just a content-free spam piece and a regurgitating of that--now the Spanish tax story has progressed, is just hilariously bad poker "journalism."

(p.s. the claims against PS are for $1.5bn not over 3, the majority of PS funds are not frozen by the US government.. and Scheinberg+Tate aren't exactly facing prison terms in the near future)

Last edited by Hood; 05-24-2012 at 12:27 PM.
05-24-2012 , 12:22 PM
if the deal with FTP goes thru, will this help stars' chances at coming to USA again :-)?
05-24-2012 , 12:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hood
If the DOJ/FTP deal is a good deal (+EV if we must), it's a good deal. If paying the demands of the Spanish tax man is a good deal, it's a good deal. Of course they have limited funds but it's just crazy to me one would jeopardize the other. The original article was just a content-free spam piece and a regurgitating of that--now the Spanish tax story has progressed, is just hilariously bad poker "journalism."
Your comments make sense enough, but my simple point was that this is just "one more thing" and eventully too many "one more things" could be a negative tipping point for FTP player recovery. Hopes it ends well soon for USA and ROW
05-24-2012 , 12:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chinamaniac
I have been told that the DOJ has mentioned that they intend on attatching 1099s if they handle the payouts but there is one thing screwing that up. For larger amounts like let's say Joe Blow has 39 k in his account. They don't want to get in a huge mess of 1099s going to a guy with 39k but he deposited 40k etc... and there are other factors as well

Stars on the other hand wants their hands in the money as well. They want to handle the payouts for a couple of reasons. First is they would also reap the benefits of player money that goes unclaimed which could amount to a lot of money. Their stance with the DOJ is that they can do it faster and easier and the players can just be responsible for their taxes. They also want to do it this way because they desperately want to get to the world series so they can start to re-brand FTP and they will be able to market again in the U.S. as part of this deal and set up booths again at the RIO.
Assuming the 1099 thing is true, it's going to be so annoying. I've already paid taxes on the majority of what my FTP balance was/is, assuming the DOJ sends out 1099's with the full amount on it, it will be just another tax time pain to have to prove that one has paid what they are supposed to.

Also it would prolly take longer if the DOJ handles the payouts, so obv rooting for PS to do what they did with their players, and to pay out FTP's/iron man plz.
05-24-2012 , 12:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Go Get It
Assuming the 1099 thing is true, it's going to be so annoying. I've already paid taxes on the majority of what my FTP balance was/is, assuming the DOJ sends out 1099's with the full amount on it, it will be just another tax time pain to have to prove that one has paid what they are supposed to.

Also it would prolly take longer if the DOJ handles the payouts, so obv rooting for PS to do what they did with their players, and to pay out FTP's/iron man plz.
I was thinking this exact same thing too. I didnt actually play in 2011, and paid everything for 2010. So Im concerned about double taxing.
05-24-2012 , 12:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Go Get It
Assuming the 1099 thing is true, it's going to be so annoying. I've already paid taxes on the majority of what my FTP balance was/is, assuming the DOJ sends out 1099's with the full amount on it, it will be just another tax time pain to have to prove that one has paid what they are supposed to.

Also it would prolly take longer if the DOJ handles the payouts, so obv rooting for PS to do what they did with their players, and to pay out FTP's/iron man plz.
Would not the DOJ simply appoint a trustee to do this for a fee? The DOJ does not generally do this themselves right? Do they even have the legal right to do it? Looks like letting PS handle this would be a no brainer. I guess I just don't get this part of Chinamaniac's story, but anythings possible I suppose!
05-24-2012 , 12:44 PM
If China is right (that FT would be US facing) it would make sense for FT to handle the payouts. Would be a lot if interest by US players to keep there money on the site. That would reduce FTs obligation.
05-24-2012 , 12:54 PM
how can the spanish situation not be negative for usa players? i suppose you can debate how negative
05-24-2012 , 01:06 PM
DOJ has said US players would be repaid through its remission process. Of course, it could change but remission probably always meant "along with a 1099."
05-24-2012 , 01:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gioco
DOJ has said US players would be repaid through its remission process. Of course, it could change but remission probably always meant "along with a 1099."
Show me where the doj said any such thing.
05-24-2012 , 01:13 PM
Highly doubt DOJ would issue 1099 forms with refunds. They didn't do it for Partypoker when they withdrew from US market. They didn't do it for Pokerstars. They didn't do it for Neteller. Don't know why all sudden they began to do it for FTP.
05-24-2012 , 01:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tweelingen
joey plz stfu u tilt the **** out of most ppl here.
This site is like most tournaments. Most of the field are donkeys that have no idea what's going on. I would expect talking sense and facts would upset these donkeys. Same logic obviously applies here.
05-24-2012 , 01:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hood
If the DOJ/FTP deal is a good deal, it's a good deal.
you make a convincing argument and I can find no flaw in your logic. I agree completely that good things are good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by momo_the_kid
Highly doubt DOJ would issue 1099 forms with refunds. They didn't do it for Partypoker when they withdrew from US market. They didn't do it for Pokerstars. They didn't do it for Neteller. Don't know why all sudden they began to do it for FTP.
doj didn't handle payouts for partypoker or pokerstars. (not familiar with netteller)

Last edited by SGT RJ; 05-24-2012 at 01:48 PM.
05-24-2012 , 01:30 PM
The more someone says the Department of Justice will issue IRS Forms 1099, the more I'm convinced that someone doesn't know wtf they are talking about, in the first instance, because they've revealed how colossally ignorant that person is about both the Department of Justice, and the Internal Revenue Service, and thus have revealed they don't know the first thing about U.S. law and it's application to any prospective PS buyout of FTP.
05-24-2012 , 01:32 PM
Could someone fix the formatting in this thread?

Thanks,
Cro
05-24-2012 , 01:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CroMagnon
Could someone fix the formatting in this thread?

Thanks,
Cro
thanks

      
m