You don't pay back the 2k, you pay back the income tax each year when you file.

Good to see Trudeau contributing 850M to the global COVID-19 fight, money well spent!

Not sure if your being sarcastic ?
Dictator Trudeau hoping parliament never gets back together so he can keep pushing things through

How about good ole Trudeau capitalizing on Nova Scotia with his Assault Rifle ban.
I do not own a gun but I think Canada's gun laws are just fine. The Nova Scotia shooting was done with illegal weapons. Most gun violence is with illegal weapons

I thoguht the proposal was you had to repay by 2023 to avoid tax penalities. Kinda like when you use it to buy a first home.

I didn't get Shifty's post either. Obviously we want countries to come together to fight this, seems completely reasonable.

I have zero problems with banning military style assault weapons. It was a campaign promise, they've been working on it for a while, and if the US is any indication the only time movement on guns has any shot of happening in democratic states seems to be when galvanized by tragedy so having such a horrific event in canada prompt this action all seems entirely reasonable.

It’s far too costly and won’t stop most gun violence, but whatever: compared to some of the spending we’re in for, its small potatoes. There are better ways to stop people getting shot than a country-wide buy back, but let’s assume that it’s not an either-or choice.

Ps: I’ve reread this thread since being stuck at home and l don’t think you should spend too much time attempting to understand the viewpoints of certain posters (that’s me being a polite Canadian). Some people have a viewpoint they’ll trumpet regardless of facts or evidence to the contrary.

Not penalities, you just have to pay the taxes on it. One thing I'm not sure people are aware of and I don't know if CERB is the same. But if you make over I think 49k/yr you have to pay back 30% of your EI.

What was democratic about the gun ban? How would this gun ban have prevented the most recent tragedy?

Democratic as in states controlled by Democrats. Although obviously it is lower case democratic as a campaign promises in a democratically elected government. I didn't say anything about whether it would prevent the most recent tragedy, just that it is a good policy in general. There is zero need for military style assault weapons in Canada, and that fact is just as true if someone illegally brings them from the US.

My goodness, did you just get mad at me saying "tax penalty" for....uh....having to pay a tax.....when you don't pay it back....but that tax is definitely not a tax penalty amirite.

Are you sure you aren't a card carrying socialist? You just admitted that pushing through campaign promises during a tradegy that wouldn't have prevented the said tradegy is a good idea.

Why is there zero need for "military style assault weapons"for law abiding citizens?

Unless you think all taxes are penalties then no it isn't. You get tax breaks when you contribute to an RRSP. Allowing people to defer those taxes for a couple years to withdraw RRSPs to cover bills until they get back to work would be a reasonable thing to do IMO.

The Conservatives plan allows you to remove from your RRSP tax free and without penalty in 2020. You are required to put that money back by the year 2023 or you will be taxed on it in the year 2024

I wonder if that 49K thing applies to CERB?

Im always up for a good debate with an open mind. I think most of us that post here are fine. NOt like the Trump thread

In 4 years hopefully those people will be back to work and start contributing back into their RRSP. If not their income will be so low the taxes on the RRSP would be small anyway. I remember during the Fort McMurray wild fires people were allowed to withdraw from their pensions that are usually locked in until 60. I haven't heard of that being the case right now, atleast not yet.

CERB might fall in with parental leave where you dont have to pay a % back, im not sure.

See Irving oil is now receiving Alberta oil via tanker through the Panama Canal. Seems much safer than a pipeline.

The pattern in the US is very clear: during the (very regular) occurrence of a mass shooting, the gun nuts claim you can't politicize a tragedy. And then of course absolutely nothing ever occurs in between. The history of advances in gun legistlaion in the US (And in canada, think l'ecole politechnique) is advances that happen because of political will that builds following a major tragedy. In this case, it twas a campaign promise they've been working on for a while and I have absolutely zero issue with using the political momentum that comes from a tragedy like this.

What "need" have you come up with? They are designed for mass murder, you don't "need" them to shoot a bear on your farm.

Stop trying to be a ridiculous nit. It is entirely reasonable to say you have a tax penalty for early withdrawl from RRSPs. Save your nonsense for your letter to global:

https://globalnews.ca/news/6352374/r...-changes-2020/


To actual substance instead of your incessant desire to make up things you think I'm doing wrong, I don't dislike the policy that much, except I feel it is shifting the burden of costs to individuals as opposed to collectively to the government for this society wide problem.

Canada and US and 2 very different countries when it comes to how they are governed and the culture so why compare them. How have they been working on it?

How are they designed for mass murder? The need is a lot of law abiding citizens who put a lot of time, effort and money into a hobby are punished for no reason other than it was a "campaign promise" or it's not a "need".

Not being a nit, you are obviously trying to make something sound a lot worse than it really is. I guess because it's not coming from the Liberals.

My goodness you are a terrible debater. Let's go to the record. I bring up "tax penalties" here:

You don't disagree with the substance, you instead only don't like the term "tax penalties":

Of course I am completely correct to use "tax penalties" in this case as we can see
Thus conclusively proving that you a) tried to be a nit and b) still managed to be wrong.

And yet your deflection is some inane drivel presuming partisanship. Just embarrassing.

Correct, Canada has MUCH stricter gun laws, which is excellent, and presumably contributes to a much lower rate of gun violence. Good job. However, that doesn't mean Canadian gun laws are perfect or can't be strengthened. But sure, we can stay with completely canadian examples. Politicians strengthened canadian gun laws substantially following l'ecole polytechnique. Were they wrong to do so, as this, in your mind, politicizes the tragedy?



[/QUOTE]How are they designed for mass murder? [/QUOTE]What exactly do you think the functional design is for? Deer hunting?

All guns are designed to kill. Currently a AR 15 is limited to a 5 clip magazine while a pistol holds up to 9 .
If I lived on a acreage I would have a shotgun and a AR 15 for protection. I have no guns but have shot an AR 15 and it would be a great weapon to defend my property from coyotes and intruders.
Rural crime is through the roof in Western Canada

This from a Firearms Instructor


Let me lay this out for you and anyone else who also likely isn’t as informed as they would like to be.
Firstly, let me say this. I’ve been a firearms instructor for 14 years, a police officer and supervisor for 8. A correctional officer for 6 and an RCMP firearms verification expert since 2013. Part of being a firearms verification expert means it’s my job to be able to testify to court what classification different firearms are, and their points of origin and import.
With that being said I will start with this. Nothing on that list, or in a Canada is an “assault weapon” or a “military grade firearm”. All military firearms have been outright banned in Canada since 1979. Automatic firearms are prohibited in Canada. The rifles on that list are hunting and sporting rifles.
Trudeau is blatantly lying and misleading Canadians by using their lack of knowledge on the subject. Firstly, he bypassed our democratic process with is outrageous and every Canadian should be appalled. Secondly he is dancing on the graves of all those victims in NS. The shooter used a rifle obtained in the US and a pistol stolen from a Cst killed in cold blood. The victims and their families deserve better. Nothing he did was legal, he wasn’t even a firearms license holder and had previously been banned from owning firearms after a common assault (disclaimer - those conditions had expired).
Canadians are ridiculously strict with gun laws. Nothing in this act will help public safety in the slightest. All centre fire rifles in Canada are limited to 5 rounds. They cannot be converted to be automatic.
This will cost Canadians a half billion dollars and have zero effect on public safety. It will hurt public safety as it distracts money and attention from real issues.
The borders are weak as hell. I would say I handled more American firearms then Canadian ones. Personally I have seized more firearms then most people have ever seen in real life. The border is the biggest problem.
Secondly, the liberals banned carding and severely limited police powers to be proactive against gangs. The result was a 48% increase in shootings and a 98% increase in the number of people shot in the GTA.
Thirdly, the liberal government passed bill C75 which lowered sentences on violent crime and terrorism. It reduced bail considerations. Increased bail and promoted early release of offenders.
The liberals have hurt community safety far worse then we can likely repair.
Chris Lewis OPP commissioner (Ret) does not support this.
The association of chiefs of police do not support this.
Every police officer is screaming at this waste of money that will not help anything.
My AR 15 holds 5 .223 rounds. My deer rifle holds 5 30-06 rounds. It’s the most commonly used deer rifle in North America. Use common sense and tell me what’s more dangerous.
I think it’s also important that people understand how licensing works.
When you first decide you want your Possession and acquisition license (PAL) you find a licensed firearm instructor and tester. You will learn about different types of firearms, ammunition, safe handling, storage and transportation. The hunter safety course required for hunting is another course and exam on top of this. For the firearms portion only you will spend about $200 and an 8 hr training day. Followed by a lengthy exam requiring a 80% pass mark.
You then submit your application with proof of your testing. A picture, and roughly the same information you submit on your passport. Two guarantors etc. But, if you have a former spouse or partner...hope you’re in good standing. You will need their consent and the Chief Firearms Office (CFO) will contact them. You will wait about 6-12 months while they do background checks and local police records checks as well as calling the two character references you provided.
Then eventually your card will come in the mail at a cost of $80. Now, you legally can purchase ammunition and a firearm. But, only Non-Restricted firearms such as shotguns and hunting rifles. They must be stored separate from ammunition, out of site and locked. Either with a disabling lock, or in a locked container that is hard to break into. They can only be loaded in a place where they can be legally discharged. Ie the woods far away from people and houses.
Now, if you want a pistol or sporting rifle you need a restricted possession and acquisition license (RPAL). Back to the classroom, another 16hrs and $200. Another exam another $80 and an application the same as the first. You will wait 6-12 months again. Now, you have your license? Great! You can’t purchase a restricted firearms yet though.
Before you can do that you’ll need to be a member of a licensed range. Licensed ranges are over seen by the CFO to make sure they meet very stringent safety measures. So here in kingston we have one club, with a 2-3 year waiting list. So you apply and wait. Eventually luckily you get a spot. You pay your $300 annual fee, but you’re not shooting yet. First, another 8 hour safety course and then 4 probationary visits with a range officer.
Finally, you’re a member. Now you can purchase a pistol or sporting rifle. So you go to the store and chose one. You pay, now you wait. If you’re lucky 2-3 weeks maybe, sometimes 6-10 while the CFO approves it.
Oh, did I mention all firearms owners are checked on The Canadian Police Information Centre (CPIC) daily?.
So finally the day comes. You pick up your pistol or rifle. You’re ready to go! Nope, sorry. You’ll need two locks. A disabling lock and a hard container that locks. Restricted firearms are always locked twice. So we’re on our way right? No, not yet. Now you will need to contact the CFO wait on hold for 35-45 mins and request an Authorization to Transport (ATT). This is a piece of paper they will email you with your current address and your home address permitting you to transport your new firearm. You’re not allowed to stray. That would result in a ten year sentence and lifetime ban.
Once your home your pistol or rifle is stored separate from ammo and locked twice. It may only be transported to and from your licensed range with your ATT. It may only be discharged at your range.
At anytime the police on behalf of CFO or CFO may conduct a warrantless search of your home if there is a concern for safety or to verify proper compliance if you’re a collector.
At any time any person can phone the CFO or local police with a safety concern about you and you will lose your firearms. It is now up to you, to pay to defend yourself.
That is the just of the firearms licensing requirements in Canada.
Believe me, gun owners are afraid of sneezing as we can lose them so easily after going through so many hurdles to have them.

Having lived in both the US and Canada, the US is way more fun when it comes to buying guns. Walk into a store, show your ID, and walk out with a Ruger 9mm about 20m later. (Or just buy one at a gun show without showing anyone anything except cash.) Then go out in the country and shoot pop bottles to your heart's content, then buy more ammo at a local bait supply company or Walmart and then do it all again. It's pretty cool.

Downside is 30,000+ people die each year from gun use, which is a little less fun. All of life is trade offs I suppose.

$ years ago in Vegas I drove to a place 45-60 minutes outside Vegas were you got to shoot 5 guns of your choice and got a burger and beverage.
Range was outside
the 50 calibre was wild but the gun that impressed me was the AR 15 so easy to shoot with so little recoil.

I forgot the pistol I shot but it was a little awkward as if you didnt have your hands right the action could rip your hand open

Instructor was a veteran really good and the burger was damn good as well

COVID-19 really helps to highlight priorities. Our society has managed to make tremendous collective sacrifice, with basically everybody on board, to combat this. Amazing, but can you imagine a tenth the effort being put into climate change?

Instead we have team trudeau shoveling billions out the door to support the oil and gas industry, not that this is going to give him an ounce of political credit from team #wexit.

Trudeau's climate strategy is weak at best. He has a plan to get us there by 2050 . But nothing for the next 4 years other than a carbon tax which I am fine with but baffled how that improves the climate.

He bought a pipeline while closing off most of the options to get oil to market. Never should have bought it end of story.

Canada could end all its oil exploration & production tomorrow and the world's climate issue is still grimm.

Like to see Trudeau call out Quebec for opening up to early in the Covid 19 situation. Hard to believe the two premiers doing the best job are Rob Ford & Kenney.

Oh Yeah Thank You Thank You Justin for buying a pipeline.