From all of your posts it seems like you are slightly ******ed. First of all none of you is playing 20BB NLHE. All shortstacks play 20BB CAP. Secondly you say that a lot of people like to play with 20BB. I doubt that. Most fish buy in for the Stars pre-determined amount. (40BB I think) I am not forced to play those tables and I don't but what goes on at those tables is simply not fair. Normal people usually would like things to be fair and care about other things besides their own well being. Right now your constant ratholing is giving you an unfair advantage. Since you don't listen to reason you will have to be forcefully made to stop. Regretfully the only one who can do that is Stars.

But the fish did not rathole. Buying in shallow wouldn't be that big of a problem if shortstacks wouldn't constantly rathole.

This.

FYP

Anyone who is bothered by this topic is already tilted, exploited and spurning massive leaks.

Play it or dont, but bitching here isnt going to change a thing.

I like letting you talk because it's just so clear that you have no idea what is going on at the 20BB tables. Maybe in your land of 100BB tables fish show up, buy in twice, and bust never to return, but on the tables I play, a lot of the fish come back again, and again, and again.

There are players in my HUD that I have played 3K+ hands with over a three month period, that run at an EV of -25BB/100. They keep coming back because they only lose it 20BB at a time, and can go on hot streaks and think they're winning at this game.


Yes, they do. It's clear that you're just using a wildly different definition of "fish" than everyone else.

Everyone else's definition: A bad or recreational player who consistently loses money in the game.

Your definition: A player who just logged on to online poker for the first time and has no idea what a big blind is.

Here's a novel idea: If you're so upset over the 20-50BB, let stars know the only way that works: stop giving them your business.

Nothing is worse than a customer that complains constantly but comes in everyday anyway.

You have no idea what the state of the game is at 20-50BB tables. You're just making assertions based on what you think the state of the game must be, and you're wrong.

Some people rathole (both fish and regs), many do not. You make it sound like you think 75% of the population or more is doing this, when the reality of it is that it's more like 25%. Both of us are estimating of course, but I'm basing my estimate on having played several hundred thousand hands at these tables. What are you basing yours on?

You also seem to feel that fish are getting abused by better regulars ratholing against them. Well, I have some good news for you! When there's a fish at the table, seeing someone rathole is very rare. DUCY?

I can ensure you that at least at NL100 and NL200 FR there are no bots at all and if there are they are no more than 1 or 2 and they suck :P So what's the point?

Based on this I say: Remember most fish choose intentionally 20-50 games and buy in deep because they like to have IT (the stack) bigger than the rest and they can do it only paying 50bb instead of 100bb. Fish psicology.


We are talking about ONLINE POKER. Don't forget that. And for online poker, it's actually more healthy that the fish go busto slowly than quickly at 100bb+ games right? And remember that fish like to see lots of flops and go all in, and nothing better than going all in and gamble "cheap", only 20bb risk = more fun + less money risked + more chances fish continues playing + more deposits + more rake + more hands + more poker

Your posts are so jaw droppingly dumb, I am beginning to think this is a level. If so, well played, sir.

If not, you say don't play the 20bb tables, but you are so consumed by what you consider going on there to be unfair that you waste oodles of time posting here about them, instead of improving your game. And since you need 150 hands against an opponent before your software tells you what what your "read" against him is, that is probably a better use of your time.

I certainly want these tables dropped. Before the changes I could reasonably pull off a 1 bb winrate while mass tabling. I was able to nit it up and avoid regs because there were enough fish with various stacks. The changes have killed us marginal full stacked winners. I cannot beat the 40-100bb tables. I struggle to BE at the 20-50 bb because the effective rake is very high and the most we can win from fish is 50 bb. I now have to rely on bonuses much more. I honestly think this may have turned many former full stacks into ratholers because we are no longer good enough to beat these games.

NOT ME

This is so true.

People who complain about the games having changed should simply cash out and send Stars an email that you moved to Full Tilt and won't come back until they drop the 20-50bb tables. When enough people do this maybe mr Scheinberg will think about it.

Poker players are the biggest bunch of hypocrites. That's why people still play at UB, why people still use hud's and other poker software, why we play in the games we think we can win.

I also have to laugh at everyone who thinks fish are half brain dead ******s who have no clue about what's good for them or what they want. The way some of you talk about fish it's amazing that they can function throughout a day without you being by their side guiding them through every action they make.

why dont shortstackers play tourneys instead cause most of the play is about 30bbs?
(unless its a deepstacked tourney, obv)

The easiest answer to this is time. Tourny's take several hours to play where cash (of any form) is as long as you want it to be.

nice sample

rofl

fullstacking makes sense if you can do more than 2bb/100, otherwise, play shortstack or quit


anyway, the true earnings stat is $$/hr, some making 6bb/100 but playing 300 hands an hour earns less than a 24 table player earning 1,5bb/100 playing 1300-1400 hands per hour...

+1

AMERICAAAA **** YEAH!

I meant ptbb/100 which most shorties do not attain. Hell most are losers before fpp. I don't play a shortstack because I don't want to and i learned poker full stacked. That is what I prefer. Seriously not everyone wants to leave a table every 2 minutes and spend half their time joining waiting lists and playing a mind-numbingly boring push/fold strategy.

You are 100% right. Not everyone wants to play 20-50BB.

Also, not everyone likes chocolate ice cream. Should we lobby to make it illegal?

+1000

Open your game up and stop being a NIT. Thats why sites are going to Contributed Method for computing rake.

I brought up this point as well and agree with it. It is ridiculous how some people assume fish don't even know what a blind is, or what table they are playing on.

One time for 35bb-100bb and contributed method for computing FPP's/VPP's(since players are too lazy to deal with Nits and Shorties). That will eliminate two problem player types. SMH

idk it just seems that they make so little playing short stacks and if they are good at it they could be making thousands if not hundreds of thousands in tourneys.