I agree - There are still many people playing high stakes at UB. It has been 3 weeks since the initial news came out, and UB has done nothing to show it's customers that they even care about what is going on. If someone has connections at one of the major magazines, I think an article about the situation would put a lot of pressure on them to come out and do the right thing.[/QUOTE]

As an affiliate don't expect Cardplayer to speak out against Ub - they ran an article on Friday which began "UltimateBet gave poker players yet another reason to reload their poker accounts today......" referring to a deposit bonus.

Hey guys,

If there were sessions where all of the players minus the alleged superuser were 2p2ers- and we got all of us to submit our hand histories from those sessions- would there be a way to compile them into a video player? I mean it wont be the same as that ap video, but it might give some very strong evidence if these guys are always going nuts when both of his opponents got nothing, but c/fs when one of them does, etc.

I think we need a bit more to have a smoking gun. I dont care if my opponents learn more about my play because well 1) i've changed my game a bit and 2) knowing how i played some fish hu, or 3 handed etc is something i'd gladly give away for the 15-20k i'm potentially owed.

i've played a hu session vs monizzle and a bit of 3 handed vs twenty 1 with mad00house. i've already pm'd mad00house to see if he'd be willing to do this.

Do you remember their coverage of the cheating on AP?

This I could see happening. But I wonder if the likely audience would be any bigger than the readership of this thread.

I agree 100% that this needs to get published in a major poker magazine, or on a poker radio show or something. That would at least let the general poker population know about this, and maybe put pressure on UB.

They made a judgment call and decided that their expected profits outweigh the risk of getting superusered and whatever guilt they feel in supporting a corrupt company. I doubt they even care that they’re also sending a message to the rest of the industry that running a clean game and treating players with honesty and respect are optional.

is twenty 1 really on this list of possible superusers? this is the first ive seen his name mentioned, but i chk'd my PT and he is down 26k in 206 hands. he was super bad and im 98% not a superuser.

hey fsu,

i 100% felt the same way about twenty 1 - huge fish until i saw his stats. a lot of the hands that went to showdown make him look bad, but he also seemed to call a bunch of 3bets cold out of the blinds in my 3 handed match with mad00house and then donk pot into both of us mult. times.

he's up 180k over 6k hands running at 25ptbb/100. his account also "does not exist" anymore.

that being said- yeah he might not a be a super user and just ran really hot. but i'd like to have people who played sessions with the alleged cheaters and other 2p2ers so that we can reconstruct sessions to see how likely cheating took place.

Twenty 1 was not on the alleged super user list he was just on the list of the highest ptb winners. His ptb and session won % is significantly lower than any of the suspected accounts but i have hardly any hands on him to see how he played.

Are there any threads in BBV, BBV4l, or OOT? HSNL gets very little traffic in comparison. This would be an easy way to get the word out.

yeah, sorry thats my mistake to name someone who isn't alleged as alleged. the last thing we want/need is a witch hunt for everyone who runs hot on ub.

I def want to see hand histories that he's played as the factors (large ptbb/100 despite playing a style that was very fishy, account doesn't exist anymore etc).

But to clarify no, he's not currently on the alleged super user list- i'd just consider his play to be suspicious and def. warranting further investigation.

stealthcow-

Well it couldnt hurt, all the major threads for the AP scandal seemed to be in BBV if i remember correctly

hey guys,

I am no where near your limits, or your anger of the alleged cheater & UBs silence.

no matter what you do take into consideration that another worldwide online poker scandal might be devastating.
this may lead to significant decrease in the new players variety and sevre hit the poker food chain for the long run.
I dont say keep it in silence, but making smart actions. "revenging" UB or making dramtic moves will affect our long run income.

I don't know if there's cross posting in "BBV" (Whatever that is, this my first post on 2 +2) or other threads , but, speaking of the AP Scandal: One thing that made everyone believe in that case were extensive hand historys. Unforunately the most damning evidence that really got the ball rolling you will probably not be able to obtain, that's the all-complete hand history with observers and personal information that was sent to the man who finished second to potripper in the big Tourney.

So far I see several posters saying "that hand history doesn't look like a superuser to me" and most of the guys trying to prove this new scandal, ignoring that and talking about bb/100 and many other aspects that us mere mortals may not be totally aware of... btw, I'm a little confused about exactly what the bb/100 is, it started out looking like about 70-75 and now is considerably lower perhaps???

Anyway, even without the amazing complete tourney history that became available in the AP Scandal I'm sure you could put something together for us other more "agnostics" and "atheists" in this case, as it were. I think of course, following the thread, that there is a delay right now getting everybodies input of HH's and stuff together, yet, I hope you can soon get some more convincing Hand historys examples that everybody, or almost everybody can understand as a superuser. And finally , thank you for your efforts in tracking down internet poker fraud.

I think there long silence on this makes it likely they are going to do something. If they were going to blow it off they would of just made some bs statement and been done with it.

This poster has a point. With >600 posts in this thread to date, we need some kind of summary edited into the first/second post.

Next time you talk the Phil, you should ask him a couple of questions...

1) Will Phil help to spread the word about this issue with the major publications like CardPlayer, Bluff and ESPN. Will he help get the word out on the major poker podcasts like the P5's, 2+2, PokerRoad, ESPN radio, etc, etc

2) When will he stop his active advertising for UB? Surely he has some control over his image and likeness...

I realize this isnt high stakes but there is a disease effecting the food chain in which is abundantly obvious and UB has got to know all about already and that is the bots running the penny tbls. (Ubers bear with me a sec)

TOTALRADE, sealluv, Lostincards, Soccerdad4, Cloxser, cardskizz, azflamejob,
EXstarsplayer, Clovisdale, Blindsteel, (please someone tell me im somehow dead wrong) and a bunch more have been at it for at least 3-4 weeks straight just about that Ive seen and I just got this pc so who knows how long its been going on for... They always buy in for exactly 10 cents and always have 2 moves open shove and fold. I used to see each of those names on exactly 8 tbls, it would appear theyve gotten smarter and do exactly 2 tbls per name now to be less obvious. The bots only type in chat after theyve been busted out and this happens once in a blue moon theyll say "nh or g1" no matter how terrible the beat was, but no other chat is uttered ever from these players/programs. These things are so obvious the Chimpanzee that almost entered WSOP would know in 2 days or less of playing with these things without any poker tracker info. One night I discovered I was in 10 handed game and was the only human...

If UB allows these guys to just carry on in the fashion they do, pillaging the noobiest players (in some cases before the player ever gets to feel the excitment and adrenaline rush of poker in general) why should they treat a shark/vet/pro any better? Especially if in fact the information isnt as concrete and obvious as these baby botters?!

UB = biggest joke ever.

How can anyone play on there???

.

I never even deposited and Im about done with playing for any cash. I started there 2-3 years ago on play$ and later turned pocket change into $250 on my friends account. PC died and was gone for over a year, I come back and everything is different. Less players, less fish, tons of bots, software security issues reported, odd and wordy responses from support regarding use of 3rd party programs, the likes of which only a lawyer could could sort out. Bankroll drifting down small bit at time but my game is stronger, my plays positive EV plays, reads sharper, live results better, freerolls better, results at UB ...not better... Im going to take what i scraped from UB and run to a prospect of greener pastures while I have something to run with. I love you UB but ...we cant see each other anymore...giving me an ulcer.

Why dont put the HH's up here to proof? Superman? rofl

is antonio still part of the UB team? im supposed to see him this week, maybe i can harass the **** out of him

I wish i had HH records for my play with Twenty1, i have never seen anything like it. Myself, Care2tango, SeniorJota all winning players were absolutely slaughtered by him. If anyone else has suspicions please add to this and PM me.


mad00house

received the following email this morning:



On Saturday, January 12, 2008, UltimateBet was notified by customers
that a player with the online handle 'NioNio', demonstrated an unusually
high winning percentage. Upon receiving this notification, UltimateBet
immediately launched an internal investigation.

We have also engaged the services of an expert third-party to help us
determine whether or not this allegation of suspicious play is accurate
and we are in open discussions with our regulatory body, the Kahnawake
Gaming
Commission (KGC), regarding this investigation.

We want to make it clear that UltimateBet takes all allegations of
unfair play very seriously, and we want to extend our strongest possible
assurances that we will do our utmost to protect our players and our
company from every and any form of cheating. We also recognize the
importance of communicating timely and accurate information regarding this
incident to our customers as we learn the facts.

Do not hesitate to contact us if you require further assistance or
additional information.

Best regards,

Sebastian
UltimateBet ~ Customer Support
'The Ultimate Poker Experience'
Support@UltimateBet.Com

There has been a ridiculous amount of action at UB headsup, 10/25 and 25/50, strange as there typically hasn't been this much action until starting in january when the scandal broke. I would've expected the opposite reaction from the high limit HU players on UB.