Perhaps i am wrong about non-sd winnings. Saying that they play better post-flop was way too vague. At least in that i've generalised it way too much. I should have been specific on what i think they do better post-flop. So yes i am wrong .

why do you always come across like a massive big ol fat douche whenever you post anything? does it make you feel better to berate others? surely u must have better things to do if u re so awesome no? get over yourself

Sorry if this question has been asked before but what HUD stats do you use? great thread btw congrats on moving up so quickly, hope you do well in the future.

^i dont think he was berating, just disagreeing.



define what playing bad postflop is. is it being too unbalanced?

raper has a good sample size, and his redline just soars up. i dont know how well or bad his postflop game is, but im sure he's very good at looking at an opponents hud, and playing the player in certain spots. isn't that what the redline is? getting folds before showdown, thin vbets, and a ton of stealing/re-stealing.

I think that some players are bad enough even at 50nl+ that it's possible to get a ridiculous redline without even playing that exploitably postflop. Good players like UGNNAGTRKD know the correct frequencies in which his opponent is supposed to have an actual hand in certain spots, and he uses it to his advantage.

more value in keeping players in the hands at micros, rather than making them fold.

especially at 25nl and below, lots of the players are gonna have such weak calling ranges that you can just exploit them by value betting.
When you get above 25nl, people will start to notice the aggression a lot more and will know how to deal with it a bit better, calling down lighter, flatting with big hands etc etc

Also its a bit vague to say that "Redline winner" are better postflop then "Showdown winners" .. maybe the showdown player is better, because hes knowing to just call more? or his bet sizes are better to keep the villain in the hand?

Just my opinion, but if OP's styles working for him an hes making the $... then he definitely shouldn't change his style until it stops working.... there isn't really any right or wrong in poker, just because someone plays one way, doesnt mean another player can just copy that and make a profit.

No doubt. No wonder there are so many profitable styles.

+1 don't think it's GTO to berate him in this thread though. Or is it? Don't know, I should ask him.

Here you go, this HUD is really nice, color coded and available directly from HEM forums. The popups are great, all I had to add was cold call 4b for some reason.



Is raper me? At the very least it's raker. I'm constantly checking the hud, preflop, on the flop turn whenever I can to figure out my gameplan in a hand. I will try to spot unbalanced stats and use them to dictate my action. If i don't have much of a sample I will go with the flow of the hand and stake tendencies and versus regs I am pretty good at metagame with history.

50NL is a joke now to be honest, I'm getting better but they are really bad I can't believe I was stressed about it at first. 100NL is a bigger jump and these days I seem to be overthinking things sometimes which I'm not doing at 50NL anymore since I'm really confident there which leads to amazing results. You are correct about frequencies, I don't overdo it (most of the time) and people keep on folding since everything seems pretty legit and they believe they are making correct folds.

I think there's value in a lot of things, more value to value betting at the micros, maybe for most people yes that's the best thing you can do but I've played a ton of micros and people there can be pushed around also and they do fold , often in more ******ed ways, c/c two streets with a very strong draw to give up the river to a small bet instead of getting in money when their equity is good.

Here's my micros graph up to 10NL since the start of this challenge, 16.52bb/100




I don't think debating red vs blue gets you anywhere, the best players in the world find every edge they can get. My edge comes taking all the small to medium pots by fighting for them harder than most and when moving up too 200NL+ I'm sure people will want to fight harder for them as well. Until then I'm working on fixing my showdown as much as possible so that when (if) my redline stops going up like crazy, I'll have better showdown skills to compensate and keep on winning. I think if I can mix the 2 together my playing style will be annoying to a majority of players and that's what I want.

yeah i was going by ur PS avatar lol

This.

The green line is the important one. The way in which you make that green line go up doesn't matter, in the grand scheme of things.

Yeah well it's a 2 in 1 pun so can't blame you.

Don't be disheartened Ugnna, I hear John Nash himself often consulted PlasticElephant before releasing his papers on game theory.

GL!

No money in poker, everyone is gto expert on 50nl+

ugnnagtrkd keep crushing, fish

bit of an over reaction itt. especially when what he said was right.

also lol at him berating by saying its wrong. dafuq? that post was sillyyy

Yeah, really don't see how he comes across douchey there.

lollllllll

You don't understand poker.
And yeah I'm just going to post like a douche now, done trying to help people on this forum, pointless anyway.

@Ugnna, sometimes you've just got to accept you're wrong (and you're, quite obviously, wrong). Think about it this way, if a guy literally never folded, at all, he would have the sickest of sick red lines, half of Scandinavia would take a pilgrimage to visit this red line, however, would he be playing well? Would he ****.

Having said that,

@Plastic, you're obviously a good player, I just think some people take issue with the way you call people out about really quite obvious stuff in a bit of a douchey way. I'm not going to pretend that I've put much work into understanding or applying GTO, but, to me, the actual concept really isn't that hard to understand (although Durr and others make is seem pretty hard), and you're not in some exclusive club with Sauce and Ike as the only beings enlightened enough to see through those plebs worshiping at the altar of 'feel'.

GL to everyone.

You take absolute positions like your words are written in stone. You're like a close minded christian extremist thinking he's got all the answers and you're not even trying to be humble about the little bit you do know. That's why you sound like a douche, don't worry about your douche forum posting game, it's solid. I'll watch you play at 5k NL and be amazed.




I'm not quite obviously wrong, I might be wrong about some things but I wasn't the one arguing that redline players are amazing postflop. I was defining my style of play. If a guy never folded he would lose way more at showdown than he could ever win at non showdown. Think about this though, what if a guy literally folded every hand preflop? About as good as your example on demonstrating absolutely nothing. I don't pretend to know what's best.

I'm pretty sure the bolded part is incorrect.

I'm not the one who wrote that. The part I was agreeing on is that I find it mentally exhausting to play this style for long periods. In my next post I say that I admire players who can play long sessions.

Edit : also that's it's a lot easier to spew while playing non showdown, I agree with that too.

oooops, sorry

Think I'm going to stop, before I dig this hole of mine any deeper.

GL!

Thank you and good luck with your challenge as well.

someone who says "i play non-showdown" is not good at poker

Cue downswing..

All my profit comes from non-showdown winnings. My style favors non-showdown winnings. I play non-showdown. I'm not good at poker.

Haha.. no doubt about it sadly.