Tokyo is a lock clear villager in case that wasn’t obvious to someone.

btw, if JDalla's stuff rings true and shorty flips wolf, a ton people posting recently to analyze this claim are quite likely villagers - dmk, kupra, books in particular. This is the exact sort of thing that would completely upend a wolf plan so I expect the other wolves to mostly be shying away from this thread before coming up with a plan to address it.

The review of the final roleset took place right before the pms were sent to everyone.

Some of the pms were pre-written, and because the wolf team was a bit strongly powered, VR's original intent was to make the JOAT action random. The final reviewer of 4 was the only one who strongly objected to that feature and after some discussion it was removed.

HOWEVER at at that point, many of the pms were pre-written. Shortline99 received this:

And nobody realized it as it didn't come up in the very very short wolfchat. However, VR DID revise the role for the opening post.

Thus, this whole scenario is on VR.

HOWEVER, in this game, there should be consistency.

Please refer to the public roleset and assume that any public actions are not randomized. This may or may not apply to characters with actions that are not publicly specified.

This is not confirmed. The role reads that the SK is "immune from wolf night kills." It makes no distinction between regular wolf NKs, wolf vig NKs, wolf JOAT NKs, or other wolf NKs they might gather. In fact, reading it from a textualist position supports the theory that my scenario is a possible outcome. All of the possibilities I enumerated are low %, but guess what, something happened (unless you're making it up randomly).

Which is why if any person got second and got an angel power and used it on shorty, or used a roleblock power on JDalla, NEEDS TO SPEAK UP ASAP.

I would like to add...

every single pm was rewritten for the rerun game. EVERY ONE.

VR rewrote 30 pms for the second game.

So there should be no further inconsistencies, public or private.

might be an angleshooty read but I'm not sure shortline who refer to an outdated JOAT description to clear himself if he was in wolfchat in this game.

Also if for some reason we can't/won't resolve the JDalla/Shortline thing ASAP, and the wagon isnt on either of them, I almost certainly won't be voting for anyone who actively posting right now to help the village if somehow those are the wagons (that's a parlay too far)

Thank you KM and VR for all your hard work in this game.

And now i'm really closing the laptop for a bit.

I did not enter, which is embarrassing because I exhorted other people to enter, but I had a tough role to roleplay. Obviously I won nothing.

Crossnerd obviously entered and is moderately evil so I would like her to confirm if she got anything.

Once could argue that, in WW, "night kill" is a term of art referring to the team kill and doesn't refer to any kill at night. I thought I saw a mod post talking about something similar, so I'll try to find it.

Found it. From the first game:

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/5...cters-1772760/


"The wolf kill is a team kill and is not blockable, watchable, or trackable, as no single player is performing it."

I'm going full shortline white knight:

The spat I had with him this morning never happens if he is a wolf. It's absolutely consistent with him being a villager expecting to be NKed. A wolf would have advertised that super villagery reasoning instead of hammering me for other stuff and letting me figure out the underlying reason.

He wouldnt think that JOAT description would clear him if he knew it was outdated and he is the only one who saw it.

There are other explanations for JDalla's kill failing, the more likely being "this villager makes a good Dobby impression, he's going to get a power, roleblock his ass".

I read it the way gus mentions, but Tokyo's possible other interpretation didn't even occur to me.... because I'm team mother****ing village obviously

Day 2: Automated Votals from #1545 to #1588

shortline99 (4): JDalla (14), dmk (39), Tokyo!! (34), wdcbooks (13)
crackedquads (1): shortline99 (38)
Crossnerd (1): Luckbox Inc (33)
gusmahler (1): Kukraprout (37)
dmk (1): coordi (3)
jonnyd (1): gusmahler (10)
Not voting (15): aaronk56 (7), atakdog (0), biggerboat (0), crackedquads (0), Crossnerd (0), Felix The Cat (0), jonnyd (0), KruZe (0), mrs. jonnyd (0), Nicholasp27 (0), riverfish1 (0), sixfour (0), Sun Tzu (0), YouKnowWho (11), UNVOTE (0)

Phase ends in 8h58m. Hammer at 13.

Vote history:

<Beta v0.1.8>

dude wtf are you on about? how on earth is a villager expecting to be NKed last night? He was insanely suspicious d1. He had no defense for his slip ups and peaced out. He was not remotely cleared as villager and there are plenty of good players in this game. (like traz, who acted like a villager and got smartly killed by the wolves imo). The idea that he would be genuinely surprised to be a living villager is nonsense. And you trying to clear him on that basis is nonsense too. His whole d1 was wolf city. His defense to my claim is wolf city. His prior role PM stuff is neutral/irrelevant.

<3 VR and KM

please vote crackedquads today
please shoot dmk when you get the chance

this game is slipping away

If you assume jdalla is telling the truth, 1 is unlikely. 2nd place got choice of angel or roleblock. For a villager who came in 2nd, it's safer to roleblock the likely winner than angel a random. If a wolf got 2nd, they had 2 roleblocks.

4 doesn't work because it's not an NK. 7 doesn't work because we're assuming jdalla isn't lying. That leaves:

6 is actually >10 entries. I don't think there were 15 entries. There may have been 11, but it didn't seem like it.

5 means shorty is a wolf. But 2 and 3 are neutral wrt shorty. Either a villager 2nd place or a wolf 2nd place could have guessed that jdalla was going to win and decided to roleblock him.

2 or 3 seems more likely than 5, so I don't think Shorty surviving proves that he is a wolf.

Read the exchange: shortline is being weird, like "you were quick to account for the kills" and "now you notice I'm not on the list" and it perfectly makes sense from the perspective of a villager thinking I slipped and had him dead. A wolf would not come up with something so convoluted.

I get when you come from. If I win a kill and my wolf read survives I'm never letting him go. And the whole thing does make him more likely to be wolf. But from where I stand he's solidly a villager.

Also I think you're underestimating how much wolves are aware of your posts. If shortline is a wolf and is in the chat when they make the call, he probably picked up that you are after him and mentions it. But otherwise they're probably finding out today who you wanted to kill.

I don't know why you are obsessing over this one interaction when he his entire d1 is a wolf parade

Day 2: Automated Votals from #1589 to #1595

shortline99 (4): JDalla (16), dmk (39), Tokyo!! (34), wdcbooks (13)
crackedquads (1): shortline99 (39)
Crossnerd (1): Luckbox Inc (33)
gusmahler (1): Kukraprout (39)
dmk (1): coordi (3)
jonnyd (1): gusmahler (11)
Not voting (15): aaronk56 (7), atakdog (0), biggerboat (0), crackedquads (0), Crossnerd (0), Felix The Cat (0), jonnyd (0), KruZe (0), mrs. jonnyd (0), Nicholasp27 (0), riverfish1 (0), sixfour (0), Sun Tzu (0), YouKnowWho (11), UNVOTE (0)

Phase ends in 7h58m. Hammer at 13.

<Beta v0.1.8>

there's a crap ton of people not voting or posting and my situation is a massive distraction

please get these other nerds to vote and post or you will just have a dead villager and no info

DADW

oh hey I'm awake during the day today, sorry about being absent yesterday

I did not enter the minigame (duh).

Probably voting shortline unless compelling reasons not to emerge (which seems unlikely). Since it's a mechanics-driven vote I want to pretend it doesn't exist and figure out who to vote/not to vote besides him.

------------

coordi, I have questions for you:

* Today you said you're "still on the gus wagon". You hopped on the gus wagon earlyish yesterday, with your first post, after gusmahler had made what I assume you thought was a wolfy two-sentence entrance. Has your reason for being on the gus wagon changed since then?

* I see from your near-end day posting that you didn't share any thoughts on aao before calling for a CFD onto JDalla; you'd also said earlier in the day that you didn't anticipate being able to read the thread until today. So I'm curious where the aversion to voting aao/desire to vote JDalla instead came from.

hi thread

thursday's not a great day for me, i've read the deaths, not the greatest but it is what it is - have i missed anything significant since day?