this is sort of a derail. but i'll take that challenge. let's talk more via pm.

I added to the post, maybe that helps a bit. I see you have already got some nice advice

give me a concrete example.

I'm a bit overwhelmed by the endless list.

So much to choose from just from trump but it's hard to top preventable climate change which will harm (including kill) a phenomenal number of people mostly from poorer countries. Yes we should try to help the victims when it happens and we should help them with protective measure, but changing attitudes towards climate change so that we prevent more will help them far more.

The attitudes don't help directly, but attitudes do shape behavior to some extent. I am pretty sure that Habitat for Humanity actually exists in the real world and is mostly due to people whose attitudes at least partially motivate them.

It is possible that the monetary benefactors just like lighting money on fire and that the builders just like slinging hammers around, but it seems more likely that the vast majority of them are just trying to do some good.

i was just about to check out into sleepy land, but i can't yet. that was almost a good example. but then i realized it wasn't.

yes, the earth has developed a fever to eradicate the human virus. and the silly virus has made that a political issue.

but i'm interested in the problems humans create for one another. i'm interested in those problems as simple as black and white. mano y mano. i don't claim to have an answer; simply a shift in perspective.

But what I hear from those who are supposedly doing something, is that they feel trying to change the attitude of the bigot (or other word of choice) is a waste of time. you feel differently? batair linked some articles that might back your claim, but i'd like to hear your examples.

Sorry, it's not something I would expect to have useful examples of. The significant change in attitudes to LGBTQ over the last few decades generated very few example of the type you want - it's the wrong thing to be looking at. Many people change their attitudes but few concede they were ever wrong. It's common for people not to even realise they have changed their attitudes.

It's much harder on these particular forums because people insist on tying posters to beliefs they would forget they ever had. It's cognitively much easier to forget as views change than to do it while contradicting previously beliefs. Forgetting, at least partially, is part of how brains learn.

Examples of racism that aren't fear-based?

Mat, how about joining Amnesty International?

Pre-election I thought 50-60% trolls. Post election it's 0%.


p.s. grunching like a sonofabitch

Yeah they were all bigots, but some (SoShyt, Morondog) enjoyed trolling too.

Truth.

lol racist LSD - I missed your quoted post the first time around.

Hats off to the Zep reference. I never tire of telling people how I saw them live once (though they do).

lol, no.

LOL nothing better than when these guys self own

Also guys if you're going to have a SMP-style "gibberish agreeing with each other" contest maybe you could go back to SMP?

Any chance you have become an extremist?

Feels you are disturbing the discussion. I already had to report one personal attack. It must be years since last time.

Mat, only a very small percentage of bigots are willing to commit violence in real life. I'm not sure why you use this as a modifier for whether someone is a "real bigot."

LOL

The endless gallop towards defining only the most extreme bigotry as bigotry, and normalizing "benign" bigotry, has now moved to "only people currently driving their car towards protestors are real racists" lol

The alternative is having to write off many, many people they already know and like. The mental gymnastics are not surprising.

Or just not writing off all the people who have some aspects to their views/character that you don't like or agree with. If they're extremists then that's not really possible but most people with some racists views are not extremists.

i was just making that obvious distinction in trying to determine how to define an internet troll. but the answer from people seems to be it doesn't matter very much and that makes enough sense for me.

Basic equality and dignity for all humans is not really a subject matter where it's possible to have a polite disagreement. For example, see the derposphere's response to reports that ICE is going to arrest undocumented persons seeking refuge from the hurricane in Texas. Their response is more or less, "LOL, tough ****, bro." It's repugnant.

To be clear: anyone capable of expressing joy, or even ambivalence, at the idea of people literally drowning to death during a flood is a POS.

Name names. You dodged my question about if any posters in your previous forum could be accurately described racist because heavens to betsy that's making stuff up to be mean, NOBODY is a racist.

But now you say there are people with racist views who are not extremists. Can you provide an example of a 2p2 poster?