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"Grammar" and "Punctuation" nit's unite! You're "head" will literally explode!

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12-19-2018 , 08:02 PM

#5876

John Cole

Lounge Nighthawk

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 19,204

Quote:

Originally Posted by Louis Cyphre

There is no ablative in English, is there?

No. If I remember any Latin, the ablative case is for the objects of prepositions.

Quote

12-19-2018 , 08:22 PM

#5877

W0X0F

sit back, relax, and enjoy the flight

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 5,853

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Cole

This is amusing:

https://www.chronicle.com/blogs/ling...-say-had-went/

Thanks for that link!

Quote

12-20-2018 , 07:47 AM

#5878

JayTeeMe

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 29,419

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garick

I teach my students "just use whatever pronoun you would use if the other person weren't in the sentence," and they always look at me like it's a trick. "It can't be that simple," they seem to be thinking. "At any moment he's going to tell us about the exceptions."

How is it possible that they made it past 5th grade English without learning that? Is our education system that terrible now?? You'd think they'd have more time to teach this stuff now that they don't need to spend all the time we devoted to cursive and card catalogs.

How are our 19 year-olds all dunces when all of our 4 year-olds are all geniuses that can add, subtract, and read?

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12-20-2018 , 10:41 AM

#5879

Garick

Oberbiergenießer

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 27,347

They are STEM geniuses and humanities dunces.

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12-20-2018 , 10:57 AM

#5880

John Cole

Lounge Nighthawk

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 19,204

I'm not sure it's a huge problem. We sometimes focus on these rather small mistakes as examples of the education system failing.

Quote

12-20-2018 , 03:52 PM

#5881

Dominic

Tripod

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 75,380

lol I didn't know ablative from my ass until I started teaching it. And I'm a writer. the vast majority of people write like crap, college students included. My job is to make them better.

And to the guy who said it must be a horrible job, no. It's a wonderful job. Grading papers can be frustrating, yes...but in the class room? I have a blast. The kids are amazing, whether or not they are good at writing.

Quote

12-20-2018 , 04:35 PM

#5882

John Cole

Lounge Nighthawk

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 19,204

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominic

Dom, that's the spirit. I always had a blast too. And I always had some fine writers, much better than I.

Quote

12-20-2018 , 11:24 PM

#5883

RussellinToronto

veteran

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,243

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Cole

Dom, that's the spirit. I always had a blast too. And I always had some fine writers, much better than I.

Yeah, I missed it so much after I retired that I now teach 2 6-week terms in the summer. (Given that I'm in Toronto, that's much better than being tied down in the winter.) And post-retirement, I have no administrative duties--which I regarded as much more a pain in the ass than marking essays.

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12-20-2018 , 11:35 PM

#5884

John Cole

Lounge Nighthawk

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 19,204

Quote:

Originally Posted by RussellinToronto

I'm looking forward to that day myself. The past seven years spent as department chair and dean have been, I realize now, exhausting. I hope I can retire by next year and teach part time.

Quote

12-21-2018 , 12:14 AM

#5885

txdome

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 18,294

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominic

l It's a wonderful job. Grading papers can be frustrating, yes...but in the class room? I have a blast. The kids are amazing, whether or not they are good at writing.

Nice. I only ran into a handful of dick professors and I butted heads with them. Neither side won.

One thing I noticed in undergrad was people rushing through the paper and not proofreading it at all before turning it in. Hopefully if you are giving them a second chance, they can prove they aren't full on ******s.

Quote

12-21-2018 , 02:04 AM

#5886

John Cole

Lounge Nighthawk

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 19,204

Quote:

Originally Posted by txdome

You wouldn't fare well with me. Your last sentence is incoherent and contains offensive language. I would give you a second chance, though.

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12-21-2018 , 03:55 PM

#5887

RussellinToronto

veteran

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,243

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Cole

I'm looking forward to that day myself. The past seven years spent as department chair and dean have been, I realize now, exhausting. I hope I can retire by next year and teach part time.

The great thing about retiring is that you can finally do the kind of reading you imagined you would doing as part of the profession!

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12-26-2018 , 12:36 AM

#5888

Dominic

Tripod

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 75,380

Okay, this sentence is driving me crazy:

Should it be:

"More than one QB from this class is allowed to be good."

OR

"More than one QB from this class are allowed to be good."

Even my PhD Professor/professional writer GF is confused.

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12-26-2018 , 12:43 AM

#5889

John Cole

Lounge Nighthawk

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 19,204

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominic

Should be the first since according to what I looked up "more than one" is followed by singular noun.

Quote

12-26-2018 , 12:55 AM

#5890

daveT

S.A.G.E. Master

Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 23,955

I'm going with the first, version. If you take away all the fluff:

One QB is allowed to be good.

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12-26-2018 , 01:15 AM

#5891

ChrisV

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 40,336

The initialism "QB" is making it sound less weird because it's somewhat concealing the singular nature of the noun. Try this: "More than one quarterback from this class are allowed to be good". If that sounds reasonable to you, then I'm sorry to tell you that your brain has been damaged from reading too many freshman essays. I'm sure the damage is reversible.

"More than one" can take singular or plural verbs, the rule is simply that the verb must always agree with the noun. So "More than one applicant is qualified" but "More than one of these applicants are qualified".

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12-26-2018 , 02:03 AM

#5892

Dominic

Tripod

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 75,380

lol that's what I thought!

Thanks. I was too lazy to look it up. Maybe those Freshman essays ARE getting to me.

Quote

12-26-2018 , 01:17 PM

#5893

Garick

Oberbiergenießer

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 27,347

Grunch:. It should be "one IS allowed." "More than" is an adjective modifying "one." ImO, the verb should therefore be conjugated in third-person singular to reflect that one is a singular noun.

Ok, off to read the other responses...

Post grunch edit:ChrisV is correct. The subject is QB, not one. More than one is an adjective modifying QB, which is singular.

Last edited by Garick; 12-26-2018 at 01:25 PM.

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12-26-2018 , 02:07 PM

#5894

GMan42

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 5,329

Further muddying things is the fact that "more" can be a subject by itself, as in something like "While only one QB is a guaranteed first-rounder, more are likely to succeed in the league."

So even using daveT's advice to take out the fluff, you can just as easily decide that means keeping "More are allowed to be good." This is definitely the kind of sentence I'd go back and forth with 5 times and hate whatever I finally decided on.

Quote

12-26-2018 , 02:36 PM

#5895

John Cole

Lounge Nighthawk

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 19,204

More than this there is nothing.

"Grammar" and "Punctuation" nit's unite! You're "head" will literally explode!

Quote

12-26-2018 , 05:51 PM

#5896

Dominic

Tripod

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 75,380

Best Roxy song.

Quote

12-26-2018 , 06:06 PM

#5897

NewOldGuy

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 5,935

Quote:

Originally Posted by GMan42

As originally written, "more" can't be the subject of the sentence. The only possible subject is quarterback (QB) - singular as already noted.

Quote

12-27-2018 , 12:30 AM

#5898

GMan42

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 5,329

As originally written in Dominic's post you mean (not mine)? Agreed, I'm just kind of expounding on where the confusion lies.

Quote

12-27-2018 , 11:13 AM

#5899

NewOldGuy

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 5,935

Quote:

Originally Posted by GMan42

As originally written in Dominic's post you mean (not mine)? Agreed, I'm just kind of expounding on where the confusion lies.

Understood.

Quote

12-29-2018 , 06:17 AM

#5900

Schlitz mmmm

banned

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 28,214

How should the following sentence be properly punctuated?

"When all of a sudden, I am unaware of these afflictions -- eclipsed by glory."

the awareness of afflictions having been eclipsed by glory

Last edited by Schlitz mmmm; 12-29-2018 at 06:22 AM. Reason: colon? literally no clue. maybe nothing goes there

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