So you're not capable of telling me the magnitude of the price drops, but think I should be able to tell that info from the graphs.

You're actually right - I probably can and should have been more careful ...


You must not be watching your own investments if you need me to tell you the dates of drops and prices. Think we're all guilty of taking our eye off the ball, myself included - let that be a lesson to us all.

Will look over the bitcoin graphs tonight ...

https://www.buybitcoinworldwide.com/volatility-index/

https://bitcoincharts.com/charts/bit...1g10zm2g25zvzl

You can see the rate of increases/decreases have been much lower than pre 2015

Yep, he really took his eye off the ball. And you included. Let that be a lesson to us all. What are you even talking about?

To anyone lurking, do not follow this person's investment advice about anything. To any other posters, do not get further trolled.

Have never actually given advice on anything in 6 years of posting - because who in their right mind takes advice off the internet? So what would be the point.

That'd be perfect if you've gone and put me on ignore!! Yes!!

Who knows what to expect from you though - probably more insults, because what else would you be posting about in a thread about Bitcoin except Sam?


Sorry for the derail - will hopefully have something more bitcoiny to discuss next time

what i meant was, i am not really willing to go through every day and tell you the price change and why. a semilog plot should help you see the early days. But, if you had a specific example, like "wtf happened in 08-2012 when price dropped 50% in a day from $15->7?" i could say, the price had rallied from $2 off the bottom of a big downswing ($30->2). thats a big swing and lot of people had itchy fingers around then to get out. Then a big ponzi run by pirateat40 collapsed (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Trendon_Shavers). this gave speculators an excuse to panic sell. very similar to when silk road went down in 10-2013 and price dropped 30% in a few hrs ($125->85). for examples...

i watch very closely (too closely as some of us know), but i hear ya. lesson learned.

can anyone explain why the sell price is ALWAYS lower than the Buy price on Coinbase...not even including their 1% fee etc.

like I can log into coinbase, select my BTC wallet, and switch back and forth between buy and sell tabs and the price is significantly lower when trying to sell.

also, whenever I try to enter my BTC amount minus miner fees myself, it always says I dont have enough...i cant see how this is ALWAYS in their favor without being some sort of profit making tactic.

what gives? shady.

Well yeah - kinda like when you buy/sell any currency thru a broker... you think Coinbase make their $$$ thru transaction fees only?

i understand risk etc, they need a margin but I dont understand why this can't just be included in the fees and be transparent. its too arbitrary and also, you didnt answer the part about why I can never actually utilize the amount in my wallet minus miner fees etc...there is always some extra juice at any point in coinbase moves. every point in time you can enter BTC amount they skim a little more with no explanation.

I don't know what you want me to tell you. It's pretty common that a broker will sell at a higher price than they buy. The price you buy at is pretty clear.

use gdax if you want to avoid coinbase's brokerage fees. you can easily transfer between your coinbase and gdax accounts once they are linked.

Otherwise it would be pretty easy to exploit it. They need to make a profit that is how they do it. It is the same on all exchanges, sell price is always lower than buy price.

Stop using coinbase for anything other than loading USD. Use gdax to convert to bitcoin. I could be wrong here so someone correct me if I am but, if you create a new buy order for the amount you want to purchase there is no fees when it's filled.

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Correct (for "limit" orders to buy/sell).

Even if you insta-buy/sell with a "market" order, the fee is only 0.25%, which is a lot lower than paying coinbase brokerage fees.

Anyone else get in on that 20% off sale thanks to the Chinese Gov?

Hey guys. Im planning to trade on bittrex. Thus i found out you need to use bitcoin to trade for altcoins. I had thought you could use usd but they dont seem to allow that.


Someone posted in a forum who is an accountant and knows about btc and he mentions even if you do trade on bittrex and do day trading with these coins, you do not pay any tax unless you turn those bitcoin or altcoins into fiat. Can many people here confirm this statement is true or false?


At first i had thought if you do trading on bittrex, well say you want to buy a coin like lisk. Say you buy 1000 shares of it for 5 dollars. Then you sell it when it hits 6 dollars so you make 1000 dollar profit minus fees etc. But the thing is you are using btc so your profit will be in btc. However if you dont cash your btc into fiat, does that mean you dont have to pay any taxes?


Thus you only pay taxes once you cash out your btc or altcoins?


Because if this is true wouldnt it mean someone could turn their few btc into a lot of btc before they pay taxes when they turn it into fiat?

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/com...ampaign=Buffer

What if I had bitcoins that gained value but then I lost them gambling?

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Pay taxes on every single transaction is my understanding. I just keep a spreadsheet with every time I change a coin into something else for now. I haven't cashed out and don't plan to for some time so not sure how ill approach paying taxes at this point.

Want to double check I'm interpreting correctly. Until there is a way to buy an alt with cash you have to pay taxes on the xfer from main coin to alt coin, but only the gains (if any) that my bitcoin made during the transition over. Over the course of a year I can also subtract out any losses I made doing the same BTC-alt transfer to arrive at a "net gain". Is that a true statement?

That's correct

Any thoughts or links to good info on Bitcoin Cash? I'm very unsure if I want to sell or hold.

You should sell. It has nothing going for it, and no future prospects of getting it.
Maybe if you want to speculate short to midterm, but that's like gambling on any altcoin, where you don't know what would have to happen for it to be valuable in the longterm.

I have checked many threads on it. It seems like people say accountants say you are suppose to report bitcoin to altcoin trades. But others say you do not if you go from one coin to another coin because these coins are similar etc.


So can others here confirm this? So make a quick example. You send 5k worth of btc to bittrex. Lets just say its worth 1.1 btc. You use that to buy lisk and let say price is 5 dollars. You buy 1000 of them roughly. Lisk goes up in price to 7.50. Now you sell the lisk for btc so in essence you made around 2500 dollars minus fees. Lets just say the fees are 50 dollars to make it simple. So 2450 profit. So you could get 2450 worth of btc in your wallet. So here you have a capital gain of 2450 right? If thats the only trade you do... but you never cashed all those btc, those btc stays in your wallet, you have capital gains on that? And if so, is it 2450 usd?


So when you file and that 2450 usd worth of btc is only worth 2200 usd now, then its still 2450? This makes no sense because you are claiming a 2450 gain but then you have a 250 usd loss later on etc if you know what i mean. And the other thing is you havent converted it into usd. And thus u never cash out to your bank account. I could understand it if you convert it to usd and not cash out to bank account. So let say you lose that 2450 trading the next year. So can you claim back your taxes on the small 2450 profit from previous year? Im just using a tiny amount here as an example so you could say its 50k profit etc. Like 50k profit one year but value is in btc but you never turned into usd or cashed out. Then let say that 50k worth of btc is only worth 42k when you file it. So you claim 50k even though the value of your btc is only worth 42k? What if bitcoin goes even lower and that 42k is now 25k etc? So even if you dont trade any money and cash that out, you are not gonig to be cashing out 50k. You could be cashing out only 25k. Then you get the money back by claiming a loss of 25k the next year?


Or let say u lose that money trading the next year. Would you get back all the taxes you paid on previous year if you made 50k trading the last year?


Everything would be very simple if these exchanges have a usd balance. Thus if you send bitcoin to bittrex. You convert it to usd. Then use that usd to buy other altcoins. Then you convert those altcoins back to usd. Thus that is very easy to calculate profits/losses because everything is in usd. Whose idea is it to have btc trade with altcoins? Im surprised why they would even do this. Because say you want to buy a coin like lisk at 3 dollars etc. Well its 5 dollars let say now. Well if you do a buy order, you arent even typing 3 dollars to auto buy. You are typing something like 0.00830 btc etc. So dont you guys need to calculate the usd to btc rate for each altcoin every time?


Someone in this thread who seemed to be knowledgeable mentioned earlier in the thread that bitcoin to altcoin or vice versa as long as there is no FIAT means no tax at all. However that to me would also seem weird because this would mean someone could trade for a very long time and not claim anything if they never convert it to usd until much later on. Like imagine someone makes 250k worth of btc but never cashed out. Then finally cash out. Then they claim capital gains when they cashout. Well that seems not right as well. However taxing capital gains from one coin to another makes no sense since the profit is in btc... and the btc if not cashed into usd... how is there even profit?

^ you could have said all that in about 1/10 of the words

I'm also curious about the answer if there are any tax professionals itt.

Another thing - i used shapeshift io a lot earlier in the year to convert between Btc/eth/Ltc before I realized the massive fees that they charge, I've stopped using them and mostly been using gdax to trade recently.

Since shapeshift is anonymous they can't really send you any tax records, how do I "prove" that I did these conversions between coins on my taxes? Just put them in an excel sheet and hope the IRS takes my word for it?

HI there yes i know what you mean. However the simple question is basically do you have capital gains if you go from btc to another coin like lisk if you buy lisk and then sell it back to lisk. Because the profit is in btc and because of that... that number isn't a flat number like okay profit is 1k here etc. And if you do have to claim as capital gain it gets confusing because if u dont cash it to usd, what happens if you lose the btc when trading etc.


I mainly use shapeshift to convert btc to other coins. However i mostly been holding them. Btw how much fees did you notice when converting from btc to other altcoins? I noticed that the fees ranged from 1 percent all the way to like 5 believe i believe. I had thought it was 0.5 percent. I checked the price on shapeshift and notice the price shown there was similar with regular exchanges so i thought it was good. Also have you or anyone else used changelly? It seems to be very similar to shapeshift however i believe they require an email i believe? But are the fees very similar to shapeshift? I had typed in btc for other coins and notice the rate they give is very slightly worst than shapeshift etc. But i never did a transaction on shapeshift though.


I checked other forums and there doesn't seem to be a clear answer on this. I even checked reddit. Lot of ppl say accountants say its a capital gain. But many others say u arent going to fiat so how is there a gain? And because of this, im not sure yet i want to trade on bittrex yet because i want to know exactly how this would all work etc. Because if everything was in usd ... such as coin to usd... then its pretty easy to calculate everything yourself. Yea i would like if any bitcoin traders here who has filed taxes on bitcoin but especially daytrading coin to coin can tell if you do have to report capital gains or not. Im assuming you do because most ppl on forums seem to say yes coin to coin count.