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Brains vs. AI poker rematch coming to Rivers Casino Brains vs. AI poker rematch coming to Rivers Casino

01-23-2017 , 02:12 PM
ppl cant google for ****, thats why, there have been investigative thread(s?) about midstakes bots beating 5/10(one that was like 5 years ago comes to mind). And since then talk about other bots and networks etc... But since its really hard for the other regs to prove anything it mostly becomes circumstancial. But make no mistake, in the world of regs playing 6max at 5/10+ it is very clear who is a bot at networks with bot infestation like ipoker. The word gets spread on skype real quick and everyone "knows" who is real and who is not but there is really no point taking it to NVG for your pleasure. It wont change anything. Some people here and there makes some crying outbursts every now and then when they are fed up, but it quickly drowns in all the noise.




Now, since the bot is crushing them so hard, I want to know if its in nsd or sd. Or both? Guys like doug polk is a massive nsd winner vs his lifetime opponents hu, i wounder if the threat to humanity here is just making better threshhold estimations and call down better or just protects his equity better as a poster above said and just crush nsd.
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01-23-2017 , 02:20 PM
iPoker bot screennames???
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01-23-2017 , 04:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchOfEVil
ppl cant google for ****, thats why, there have been investigative thread(s?) about midstakes bots beating 5/10(one that was like 5 years ago comes to mind). And since then talk about other bots and networks etc... But since its really hard for the other regs to prove anything it mostly becomes circumstancial. But make no mistake, in the world of regs playing 6max at 5/10+ it is very clear who is a bot at networks with bot infestation like ipoker. The word gets spread on skype real quick and everyone "knows" who is real and who is not but there is really no point taking it to NVG for your pleasure. It wont change anything. Some people here and there makes some crying outbursts every now and then when they are fed up, but it quickly drowns in all the noise.




Now, since the bot is crushing them so hard, I want to know if its in nsd or sd. Or both? Guys like doug polk is a massive nsd winner vs his lifetime opponents hu, i wounder if the threat to humanity here is just making better threshhold estimations and call down better or just protects his equity better as a poster above said and just crush nsd.
I htink the bot is winning in showdown actually. It assesses hand values on the river ridiculously well.
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01-23-2017 , 10:56 PM
Looks like brains are having a good day thus far, and dong is overall positive!

-701k through 71.5k hands
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01-23-2017 , 11:38 PM
BDDK>LIBBY!
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01-24-2017 , 12:43 AM
Where can I find recordings of the gameplay?

Thanks
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01-24-2017 , 04:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by samooth
From the 538 article above:



First of all, the "more atoms than.." line is getting old very quickly, Second, and more importantly, HUNL isn't that complicated of a game as those researchers are trying to sell it (and it's not even close). That ~10^160-170 number that you read in articles and academic papers was artificially created by the ACPC, explained in detail here.

No sane person would describe 200bb HUNL as that big -- adding tons of sizes to the betting abstraction that are strategically indifferent to a LOT of other sizes and don't add EV doesn't make a game more complex. In the format played in this competition, a player has 19800 potential 3bet sizes after a button minraise, for instance...
Are we sure they are strategically indifferent? i was of the idea that the optimal preflop strategy could converge to a mixed strategy of combo-weighted bet sizes (depending on position at 6max), like opening (for ex) 30%) 2.3x , 25% 2.6x etc, with most combos in most opening sizes.

It's wierd to dismiss that automatically and calling that strategically indifferent.

It could very well be that GTO HUNL strat is opening 32 different sizes, and betting many many kind of different sizes to for small but significant on the long run gains.

Maybe this isn't true but until we have a "close-to-GTO-enough-bot" how can we tell? and that would require no bet astractions to try and search for those mixed-bet-sizes strategies preflop and on the flop.
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01-24-2017 , 05:52 AM
Cliffs on how it went down? I love reading about AI. Ex Machina is one of my fav films!
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01-24-2017 , 07:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by onemoretimes
The humans are probably brain fried and need a break. Have they taken any days off? Nice challenge. Computer vs human and computer is going to tank and make it take 10 hours to play 500 hands and we're going to do that for 3 weeks straight. If we're going to play like that, human should just smash computer, human wins. Also, please get some better knows HU cash game pros.
Yes, endurance not skill. No Huds either.
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01-24-2017 , 07:53 AM
What would happen if this bot would play against itself? Two identical bots and mirrored hands. Would the outcome be the same to the penny?
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01-24-2017 , 07:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by archii
What would happen if this bot would play against itself? Two identical bots and mirrored hands. Would the outcome be the same to the penny?
No there would be some variance as the bot picks an action in every spot based on a probability distribution (say 40% check, 60% bet with several possible sizings). In the long run though, it would converge to an equilibrium.
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01-24-2017 , 09:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
Are we sure they are strategically indifferent? i was of the idea that the optimal preflop strategy could converge to a mixed strategy of combo-weighted bet sizes (depending on position at 6max), like opening (for ex) 30%) 2.3x , 25% 2.6x etc, with most combos in most opening sizes.

It's wierd to dismiss that automatically and calling that strategically indifferent.

It could very well be that GTO HUNL strat is opening 32 different sizes, and betting many many kind of different sizes to for small but significant on the long run gains.

Maybe this isn't true but until we have a "close-to-GTO-enough-bot" how can we tell? and that would require no bet astractions to try and search for those mixed-bet-sizes strategies preflop and on the flop.
preflop no limt hold em nash equilibrium has as a maximun 169 different betsizes. the game studiez considers from 200 to 20.000 on 1 increments, so 19800 betsizes. most of them are not significant.
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01-24-2017 , 12:11 PM
Dong for humanity ! Go go
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01-24-2017 , 12:34 PM
Day 13 results:



9.81bb/100, brains up ~90k on the day, dong up two stacks on the robot now, everybody else hanging in there.
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01-24-2017 , 01:01 PM
Wasnt Jason les the big donator last bot challenge aswell ?
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01-24-2017 , 02:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchOfEVil
Wasnt Jason les the big donator last bot challenge aswell ?
Yes, the computers assimilated him. First clue was when he changed his online name to "Locutus"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ItHcsIHshhs
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01-24-2017 , 02:52 PM
Who had Dongs mirrored hands?
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01-24-2017 , 03:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by f0ld44
Who had Dongs mirrored hands?
Jason.
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01-24-2017 , 03:14 PM
jason sucks, confirmed. if it was doug, they'd be winning
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01-24-2017 , 04:10 PM
all that stands between humanity and annihilation is one last donger
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01-24-2017 , 04:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gregorio
His site was offering +400 on the AI or something like that before the match started.
Timex's Pokershares offered 3.3:1 for humans to win outright
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01-24-2017 , 08:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by restorativejustice
Yes, the computers assimilated him. First clue was when he changed his online name to "Locutus"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ItHcsIHshhs
learn how to embed youtube videos bro



Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGift&TheCurse
Timex's Pokershares offered 3.3:1 for humans to win outright
yeah its funny how one poster thought that Timex was going to somehow take a big hit since someone betting on the bot was gonna win 4:1 or whatever. A bookie balances his action and charges a vig so that means if Timex did it correctly then the money being bet on the humans to win would be about 4 times greater than the money bet on the bots and it shouldn't matter who wins the challenge Timex should come out on top.
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01-24-2017 , 09:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGift&TheCurse
Timex's Pokershares offered 3.3:1 for humans to win outright
They had humans favored before it started.
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01-24-2017 , 09:32 PM
anyone know what bot had vs dong just now? day14s3dong1 hand 43

dong had AKcc board ran out 357h Ah 5x

bot overbet turn then bombed river?

i woulda clicked call so fast, so many combo heart draws missed
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01-24-2017 , 10:36 PM
wow....BUT I'd also like to say that I do not play optimally when my opponent is tanking endlessly.
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