Since they are making this payout pursuant to a DGE ruling it seems unlikely that they could add a string like "oh and you have to sign this waiver saying you can't sue us."

Borgata is sending them out.

People really should read this statement and not the legal lingo NJDGE statement:

http://www.theborgata.com/assets/pdf...resolution.pdf

Three minor points in light of the awful ruling:

1. Lusardi's $2000 chip leader bonus was not added back into the prize pool or given to Woods.
2. I thought Lusardi min~cashed, DFE should have required a forfeiture and reimbursement by the Borgata of any payments to him.
3. As the Borgata is refunding the rake, i think anyone who paid a entry fee should get back $60.00 per entry, even the paid winners and the non eligible bustouts.

Surely a court case would be futile.

ICM, players equity, stack sizes, who busted when etc would all be irrelevant in the eyes of a judge who would view the whole tournament as tainted.

You've lost me on this one. Maybe I'm just tired - but since the amount being given to each of the final 27 is more than 10th place money, how can the top 23 be losing out here??

As for the top positions, since there is no way of knowing who would have ended up where, in terms of final results, if the tournament hadn't been compromised and had finished as scheduled, who can say what those results would have been? Who would have actually made the final table?

Sure, this ruling isn't perfect, but I for one can't see how unfair it truly is. I would like to hear from Matt Savage as to what his suggested ruling was.

Lee

Its obvious what they did. Figure out the refunds we have to give and take whats left and divide by 27. What a way to ruin your credibility. Plenty of business bite the bullet to preserve their reputation but we are talking about a casino.

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Tired probably. Chip EV ≠ Payouts based on current chip position.

Totally how do they know you didn't play at his table then be moved to another
Such a phony decision no punishment
Those chips were in play whose to say where they went
What about the guy who busted lusardi he gets paid hi phony chips and still cashes

Sure, Borgata have screwed up royally here and they should really be taking a monetary hit here for goodwill purposes.
It's the NJDGE who are the real problem though. A group in a position of authority have shown that they are not fit for purpose and are not prioritizing the people they should be, the players.

Ok, David Bach says boycott the Borgata. Fine.
Getting the NJDGE replaced by a body that has the right priorities would make far more of a long term impact.

10th place money is 1.2% of the remaining prizepool. 23 players had more than 1.2% of the chips in play. Tournament payouts are top-heavy. If you paid out based on chip position, Broedelet gets 27% of the money with 11% of the chips. If you pay out based on chip percentage, Broedelet gets 140k while 13th place Thu Le gets over $50k.

It's not a perfect way of calculating things, and ICM (which I don't know how to calc) would give us a better insight, but the bottom line is that 63% of their money was taken away. If you think that's perfectly fair, perhaps some rest would do you some good.

The ruling was awful for the players but great for Borgata. They did no wrong except wait until day three to investigate the complaints of players about fake chips. If counting down stacks and verifying was not necessary then why all the new measures?

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Where is the boycott Borgata thread?

Yes 2/3 of the final 27 would have been paid less if it was played out, but they stole 2/3 of the remaining players prize pool to pay the bust outs. When they determine the pay outs it is all done by a percentage of the prize pool. 450 - 28 all have received the original payout as a percentage of the total prize pool. Why? Why does the burden fall on the 27?

DGE absolves Borgata of wrong doing to try to help the avoid lawsuits not the they did not do anything wrong. If they didn't, they would not have made all the changes that they have. If they were not using three different chip set in the tournament, don't you think it would have made very easy to spot the fakes as soon they were introduced. Lusardi committed the crime but the Borgata made easy for him.

The Borgata did not find the problem. Harrahs found the chips and called the Borgata. Even though numerous players pointed out chips that didn't look right it was chalked up to the fact they were using three different chip sets in the same tourney.

Please stop fisting the 27 and telling us we should be happy.

For players wondering if they are getting a refund

Call the number on the borgata page and ask. They look it up and directly tell you.

I got more than I thought

You mean Borgata

yes that too

For those stating that the Borgata should take a hit, they did with all the expense money being refunded. They are out of pocket on the actual tournament/dealer/ expense.

We know that. They should be taking a bigger one though, by paying the top 27 more.

they didnt refund hotel costs and cash game rake/time so they still made a considerable amount off of people who showed up to play this rigament

Borgata lost 288k
One of the 27 has lost 350k

Which one?

Not true the 3% for dealer was removed from the prize pool...$71,000.

Based on the ruling all players already paid get to keep their winnings...did not see where they exclude Lusardi... he gets to keep it according to the specifications in their ruling. That is fair

What is Borgata profit margin on a tourney? 25-30%. So of the 288,000 they may have actual loss of 200,000

Interesting to note:

From the NJGDE statement:
"Disburse the total amount of $1,721.805"

From the Borgata statement:
"The division has ordered that all of the remaining prize money - totaling $1,433,145 be returned to certain eligible entrants, as determined in the Divisions order. Borgata is also refunding all revenue it collected from eligible entrants ($60 per entry) for a total of $288,720."


Notice the difference? The Borgata are trying to make out that they are refunding the rake out of the kindness of their hearts. They are not. NJGDE ordered them to.

Not content with screwing up a tournament, they then lie about the resolution.

The Borgata uses crappy cards with defects and sues the player that uses that to his advantage(Phil Ivey). Borgata used crappy tourney chips, guy brings in fakes, let's make players pay for it. Start to see a pattern. They screw up and players are supposed to pay. It is BS.