fishyak, I'm confused. You seemed pretty pissed off about this, but your BIL's blog seems to not be any sort of angry about it. Anytime you piss off a performer that's attracting people to that casino, they're not going to want you there. I also think (according to your BILs account) that security handled the situation pretty well.

rotflmoa

I was advised that both the Excalibur's and official SB websites previously showed Slyvia Browne appearance dates available through August. Both websites have been changed on or before July 10. From Ms. Browne' website, she now has no major appearances booked until 8/23.

Maybe Louie Anderson could fill in for her at the Excal by doing a Slyvia Browne impersonation? Louie Anderson in drag as Slyvia Browne would be something I would pay to see!

She was scheduled to make appearances at the Excal into late August and her appearance schedule at the Excal was shortened to a time at or near this incident. As I stated in an earlier post, no causal relationship is known or implied at this point between this incident and the cancellation. But it is intriguing. In a conversation I had with a low level Excal rep., that person told me that Slyvia Browne had cancelled her future performances and that no other reason was given to Excal reps, but that she had been previously scheduled to appear into August. Feel free to call Excal yourself TT if you feel that I am overstating anything.

You still don't explain why you and your BIL would get such a perverse joy in being a party to getting her cancelled.

1) I do believe that my BIL was mistreated and would like to get to the bottom of this. I have previously stated my two issues with security: a) not answering questions about the original "disturbance," and b) the lack of a clear safety line (as pointed out by Bav) about returning to Excal. I'm not as pissed off about those issues as much as I am persistent in getting the matter clarified.

2) What I am PO'ed about is the abuse both in my direction and in my BIL's direction in this thread. I've only snapped back at the cheap shot artists. To those with reasonable questions, and those that have tried to be helpful, I believe the record reflects that I've given reasonable, if persistent responses. And please re-read the BS I've had to sift through to get there. I've withheld a lot of what I'd like to say, but it would be like trying to teach a pig to sing. That wastes your time and it annoys the pig.

Oink!

And, franlky, you've suffered very little abuse in this thread. Don't expect everyone to come running to your aid or share your passionate point of view. You've chosen to involve yourself in a game in which you have no skin. Your brother was kicked out of a Casino and you're making it a cause celebre. I guess since you have refused to respond to my comments, you just feel that I'm in the pig group. Nice. Easy way out.

Oink again.

Nobody is anymore.

That one's easy. ASSUME that Slyvia or her people had BIL booted. ASSUME Security follows through but is major league unhappy about being told a story about a non-existent "disturbance." ASSUME that incident negatively impacted the relationship between Excal and Ms. Browne. Now look up the term "poetic justice." If Ms. Browne abused her power and position that came to be part of her undoing, then there is some real, true karma for a psychic to consider.

Some people enjoy putting scammers out of business.

Yeah, I know, people are funny...

Sorry, but that timeline is a little limited. ASSUME that Your BIL had a hard on against this woman long before he saw her at the Excalibur.

This seems a little obsessive if you ask me. Guy wants to take down a "Psychic" because he thinks she is a "scammer"?

If she had wronged him directly, then OK. But to go out of your way to try and attack one stupid Psychic? Guy is somehow defining his own self image by the conflict which he is creating. There was no conflict before he created it.

If you're really interested in why the guy is making such a mission out of discrediting the pychic, you're extremely unlikely to get any realistic answer here.

The dude does have a blog of his own, however. If so inclined, you could go ask him directly. Heck, for all I know, there's a pretty detailed answer to the question already there. A "why I made this blog and why I believe it's important" kind of statement.

Pulheeze...

Sylvia must have known in advance tht her dates would be cancelled. Someone in the spirit world must have been able to "advise" her of this.

Good points. However now we have another "crusader" in the OP - he seems even more angry and invested in this than the BIL himself. He appears to have "caught" whatever it is that causes these guys to get passionate about things that don't even affect them directly.

Just seems like someone looking for a self-definition or an excuse for a fight.

Maybe the "disturbance" was just a disturbance in the force. Sylvia Browne clearly has Jedi tendencies with her supernatural powers.

Sylvia Browne and the OPs BIL did have a confrontation during the show. I'm not sure if I am allowed to post a link the BILs blog, but if you google the three words Stop, Sylvia and Browne, you should be able to find the blog fairly easily and the OP's BIL description of the incident.

It's real simple. I'd never go back. This particular casino is a hole anyway, it's not like there aren't 20 nicer ones that I could go to and why on earth would I ever give my business to someone that treated me this way. Furthermore, why would I want to be "reinstated" so that I can go back to a place that I have ZERO interest in ever going back to.

If a friend of mine was treated in this manner, I'd feel the same. I would not try to get any information. I might write a letter detailing to them why exactly i'll never go back, and further why I will tell all my friends, etc. to also not go back, but I wouldn't seek reinstatement. Why would I.

I know enough about the law to know they can kick me out, so who cares....just don't go back. They are in business to make money, the best way to get back at them is to hit them where it hurts...don't let them make any money off of you, and if you can reduce the number of people that walk through their door, then do so.

Oh yeah...and grow up.

If you would stop ignoring the fact that the casino is lawfully able to trespass anyone (in a non-protected class) for any reason you might be able to obsess about something else. You nor your bil have no recourse so why the crusade?

Jimbo

I can answer this one!

I was fired from a casino in 2005 (unjustly, imo), and told that I was to never return.

I take my reputation seriously, and I felt that being barred was a blemish on my good name.

After a while, I asked to be reinstated, and they granted that request.

I walked into the casino, just to show the world (and myself) that I could. Then I walked out without spending a penny. I was still sore about being fired, I wasn't going to give them any business.

In OP's case, BIL was pretty much barred and reinstated in the same swoop ("Let's just say, until the next time I see you."). Since he's obviously a bright guy, I'm surprised that he suggests this sentence is "unclear". Maybe it's because I've worked in the casino business for a while, but I took the security man's meaning immediately, clear as day.

I agree; however, it's worth noting that OP's choice of windmill is the casino's process regarding the barring, not whether SB is a sham or legit. That is, you're arguing a different point than the OP is, and thus neither you nor he are likely to get much out of it. *shrug*

"Only the names have been changed, to protect the innocent."

Thanks Fishyak, for asking this here. It hadnt occured to me to go to a gambling site to ask around.

Hello all, I'm Robert Lancaster, Fishyak's brother in law.

I don't play poker, but I joined 2+2 to participate in this thread for a bit.

First, thanks to everyone for their opinions and insights on the whole thing.

I d intend at some point contact them and ask.

Fair questions. I am not devoting my life to it, but yes, a substantial amount of my "free time," and a small amount of cash. I do so because I think that what Browne does is despicable, and I figured I could do something to have an impact on that. As for whether or not I am crazy, the voices in my head assure me that I am not.

Nope, not me. That is James Randi, someone whose work I greatly admire.

Where was smeone being a prig?

I can only speak fo myself, but I'm ding just fine. Then again, I am a newlywed...

You are correct. However, I can't fault Fishyak for erring on the side of caution.

I haev no problem with the way security acted. They were very polite, and frankly, seemed a bit uncomfortable, if not embarrassed by it all.

As for the supervisor saying that I was banned "until the next time I see you", I later was told by someone who has worked as security in some nightclubs, that it basically means for the day. Not sure if that is true, but whether it was or not, I proposed a more tangible time frame (until Browne no longer works there), which, as Fishyak mentioned has already happene.

If you mean that I should let go of finding out exactly what Browne said that I did, it belongs for me in the "Nice to Know" category. If I find a way of finding out, I'll try it. If not, no matter.

"Forget it Jake. It's the Excalibur."

Excellent suggestion, thanks.

As the Palimax said, there's a world of difference between what they do and what Browne does. Not only are they up-front about the fact that it is all an illusion, they also do not take money from very wulnerable and needy people by promising them something they cannot deliver.

Coincidentally, Penn interviewed me about the Stop Sylvia Browne site on his now-defunct radio show back in 2007. Interesting guy.

Interesting point!

Not sure why the dig, but I'm doing fine.

Perhaps to you, but not to the people she has emotionally abused, and whose money she has taken, giving nothing in return.

She was, at that point, booked one week or so out of every month, and had been since at least January. I doubt they had any idea that the JRED would be there.

What was pretty funny (to me anyway) was the fact that the JREF convention was held at the Flamingo, where "psychic" John Edward performs every month. He was not there when the JREF was there, or who knows what sort of psychic/skeptical drama may have ensued...

He's had a steady gig at the Excalibur for a few years now. Prior to that, he hosted some poker show on TV I believe, and prior to that, was hosting The Family Feud for a few years.

While I can understand thinking of these people as "morons," I assure you that many of them are simply people who, after some great calamity in their life (a missing or murdered son/daughter, death of a beloved one - especially when there was unresolved anger in the relationship at the time of death - terminal ilness - their's or a loved one's, etc.) , reach out in desperation for help. Unfortunately, their desperation makes them very easy targets for charlatans and con-artist of all stripes, especially charlatans like Browne.

Not everyone is fortunate enough to realize it.

I have no plans of returning. I had only been there once before this, and would not have gone there this time were Browne not there. But I will definitely get it clarified in case I ever want to go back for some reason.

Sounds like you might fit right in!

There are certainly many other ways I could spend my time, which you may think are more worthwhile. However, I receive emails nearly every day from people thanking me for diong what I am doing with the site. People who were thinking about spending $850 on a 20-minute phone "reading" with Browne, found my site while searching for hers, read some of the articles on the site, and decided against it. People who who had been totally dissatisfied with their phone reading with Browne, but thought they were alone in that until they read some of the accounts from others on my site, and decided to file for a refund. Emails from people whose mother/sister/wife/uncle was a dyed-in-the-wool fan of Browne's until the email writer showed them my site. And much more.

That's enough to show me that my site is making a difference, and that some people are being helped. If I can do that, and prevent some money from giong into Browne's coffers, I'm happy.

Read some of the articles on my site and perhaps you'll see. Here's some to start with:

http://www.stopsylviabrowne.com/arti...tel_opal.shtml
http://www.stopsylviabrowne.com/arti...nkatcher.shtml
http://www.stopsylviabrowne.com/arti...911widow.shtml

Thanks for the advice, but I disagree.

I totally agree.

I intentionally asked the least disruptive question I could come up with. I was not trying to disrupt. And after she answered it, I was quietly walking back to my seat when she escalated things.

Definitely.

Jerk? Maybe. Passive aggressive? I don't think so, but I can see why you might think so.

Actually, I was surprised that they didn't just ask me to leave. I would have, with no problem. But I didn't walk away because I was interested to see where it went. I thouht that the worst that could happen was my getting banned from the Excalibur for life, something which I could live with. I wanted to know what they had been told happened.

I have. And part of that life is running a site where the evidence about Browne can be examined.

There are others on the horizon, and I am strapping on the rusty armor.

I'm not. I think Fishyak found a way he might be able to help me with what I'm diong, and gave it a shot. This doesn't surprise me, as he's a good guy and an excellent husband to my sister.

I think they did pretty well.

As I said above, read some of the articles on the site, and see what she does to people, all in the name of maknig a buck.

I cannot tell you how disturbing it is to find me, Browne and "hard on" used in a sentece.

Others tell me that the fact that I had NOT been "directly wronged" by Browne makes the site seem like an examination of truth rather than a personal vendetta.

Also, I think the world would be in even worse shape than it is if people only spoke up against people who had directly harmed them. "As long as that pick-pocket stays away from me, I won't mention the fact that he is stealing from others..."

There is a FAQ page on the site which addresses this:

http://www.stopsylviabrowne.com/faq

Because some day an act or a convention which interests me may be there.

I asked DOZENS of people what that meant, and nobody had a clue. I think it likely that you learrned it during your time in the industry. As Fishyal said, this was the first time I was ever thrown out of ANYPLACE. It sounded to me as though he was trying to sound ominous.

Sorry for the length of the post, but I was catching up on twelve pages of thread.

The casinos have the right to refuse service, just like any other business. BUT....they do not have the right to slander and lible someone. I think security screwed up on this one. They should have simply told alleged offender "we don't want your business." ---not giving any reason covers their asses 100%. But they told him he created a distrubance and I think that opens up a can of worms for them.

One move Dude could make is applying for reinstatment at ExCal and see what they say. All he has to do is call their security department and handle it over the phone. Of course, it wouldn't hurt if he pumped them for information on why he was 86'd.

I don't know if a lawsuit would be worth it. Maybe giving the phony psych soome bad press might be the way to go.

I posted the definition of disturbance earlier:

1.
a. The act of disturbing.
b. The condition of being disturbed: "The forest . . . is in various stages of disturbance. Only the biggest trees . . . have been left standing" Alex Shoumatoff.
2. Something that disturbs, as a commotion, scuffle, or public tumult.
3. Mental or emotional unbalance or disorder.

Now for slander:

slan·der (slndr)
n.
1. Law Oral communication of false statements injurious to a person's reputation.
2. A false and malicious statement or report about someone.

In no manner can the casino be sued for slander (libel is written) since all they did is relay information provided to them. To believe the psychic was not disturbed flies in the face of the evidence since she allegedly reported the incident to security, proving she was disturbed.

In short as I wrote earlier any private business can ask anyone, not in a protected class, to leave their premises for any reason, period.

Jimbo

Well, judging from his lengthy response, it certainly looks like by starting this thread, I unintentionally provided my BIL with an evening's entertainment! I hope his answers have cleared up any misconceptions that I might have accidentally created by posting about this incident.

While others are free to disagree, I support his efforts and applaud the courage it takes to make a public stand with the intention of helping people, and with little or no chance of personal reward in return. If you knew there was a burglar in your neighborhood, would you just lock your doors and windows or would you warn your neighbors?

I've worked in insurance and financial services to the point that I am often retained as a expert witness. And that always means something has gone wrong. Sometimes that means an outright fraud has occured. One of the most common and most successful types of financial theft is called "affinity fraud." In this type of fraud, the perpetrator abuses an assumed commonality of interests between the thief and their victim to make the scam work. Where the potential for this kind of relationship abuse exists, warning signs are not just appropriate, they are needed to help protect the vunerable in matters big and small. I fully support my BIL's efforts to put that warning sign on the internet road that people are free to see, review, and agree or disagree with. Such is the power of free speech. And if, along with way, some "bad" free speech occurs, according to case law the solution is.........more free speech!

So I hope my BIL found some things of value in reviewing this thread as well as having a chuckle or two. My personal favorite was his quip: "I cannot tell you how disturbing it is to find me, Browne and 'hard on' used in a sentence." I will not bring this thread back to life unless some real development occurs like pickup in the local press, or I do manage to backdoor that incdent report somehow. Fishyak, out.

I hear what he's saying...but I would excpect a "clear thinker" to utilize his free time in more productive way than trying to stop Sylvia Browne.
How about the homeless? Or the Third World Countries with starving children? But you have chosen to set up shop to stop Browne? Clear thinking....debatable?