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06-21-2011 , 12:33 PM
Goodbye Waffe. It's been swell.

(Seriously though, the main reason I dont have a kid yet, is because I have yet to find a woman stupid enough to think I would make a good dad and at the same time isnt incredibly annoying and/or ugly. I dont think I have ever made a decision for "the good of the planet". Me me me all the way.)
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06-21-2011 , 01:44 PM
if i were female id marry Ren
06-21-2011 , 01:59 PM
Bromance ITT
06-21-2011 , 02:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jah Onion
meh, i realize some/many ppl don't care about this, so I'm gonna go ahead and put it in a spoiler for y'all.

Spoiler:


We've thought about it and we think that beyond the animal instinct of reproduction to keep the species going(which is moot for humans at this point), the one good reason to have kids is to feel unconditional love. But we also feel that only being able to feel unconditional love towards a child that is your own flesh and blood is not really in the spirit of unconditional love. We would much rather adopt down the line and at least try to love that child like our own, thereby sort of steering clear of the 'easy way out' of just loving your own child.


i think you are really underestimating how hard it is to get over those ingrained animal/evolutionary instincts. if you and your girl can truly do it then good for you, but its gonna get harder the older you get.

you change when you get older. im only a couple years older than you but im different than when i was 23. ill be different when im 28 than i am now. you're definetly not the first person your age to decide they never want to have kids. though to your credit you've thought it out a hell of alot more than the typical "no thanks they poop alot and i still want to have a social life and i will never own a minivan"

Quote:
Originally Posted by coordi
adopting a child is like assuming randos arent completely ****ing worthless ******s, which is pretty bold imo
jah, i may have misunderstood the post you made after this but i think you were listing reasons this doesnt matter to you? if so you're really underestimating genetics. nature AND nurture, not vs.



Quote:
Originally Posted by waffe23
Yeah one thing I hate about the Africa situation is the Catholic church basically says condoms are bad which is not helping anything.
so did priest get in more trouble if they used one on alter boys? like relocated to a crappier parish instead of an equivalent one or something?

seriously though, do africans really care about catholic doctrine? like are all those mission trips actually convincing them not to use condoms or is it just that all those mission trips could be bringing them condoms and they arent?

Last edited by H0NEY BADGER; 06-21-2011 at 02:11 PM.
06-21-2011 , 02:09 PM
I know the Bush administration made a lot of their aid to Africa conditional on that none of the money could be spent on birth control of any kind, be it condoms or pills. Of course it is their money, and I am sure the Africans were happy for any help at all, but jesus ****ing christ how ****ing ignorant can people with that much wealth and power be?

"Here is foodstamps for all! You will never starve again!! Only one condition: you can ONLY spend it on double chocolate brownies. Yum! Let's see how grateful you are!!! Weeeee!!!!"

Last edited by TheRenaissance; 06-21-2011 at 02:14 PM.
06-21-2011 , 02:13 PM
I have a couple posts before I hit 5000, and this seems like a waste, but dear god don't be stupid Jah. have your wife get an IUD. they are as effective as birth control, don't use hormones, only have to be replaced every few years, and take 5 minutes for her Gyn to insert.

seriously my wife is an MD. when I told her your plan she thought it was stupid. not only is it a waste of your time and money (or insurance money) but could seriously impact your life down the line should your current view point change. And BTW in case you've forgotten you're 23 and your opinions and view points will change. I'm 28 and every year I learn that I was dumber than I thought last year, and that I still have a lot to learn.

getting a vasectomy at your age is just silly considering all other reasonable birth control options. if you research IUDs and your conclusion is still to get a vasectomy I'll have to conclude that you're just a masochist.
06-21-2011 , 02:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by H0NEY BADGER
i think you are really underestimating how hard it is to get over those ingrained animal/evolutionary instincts. if you and your girl can truly do it then good for you, but its gonna get harder the older you get.

so did priest get in more trouble if they used one on alter boys? like sent to a crappier parish instead of an equivalent one or something?

seriously though, do africans really care about catholic doctrine? like are all those mission trips actually convincing them not to use condoms or is it just that all those mission trips could be bringing them condoms and they arent?
The animal/evolutionary instinct is to have sex, not to have kids. So if Jah is having sex, then he's not "getting over" any instincts imo. Our genes drive us to have sex, not to think "I want to have a kid". I mean how many guys are thinking "I want a kid". Probably not many, especially young ones. But how many are thinking "I want to have sex with that person". Everyone.

I'm not saying anything about what percentage of Africans care about Christianity, just that when you have an authority figure (the Pope) who many people follow blindly spouting BS like condoms can't be used because non-marital sex is a sin, etc., it certainly doesn't do anything to help overpopulation matters or AIDS problems. Handing out condoms might help but as a start just not having net negative impact would be nice.
06-21-2011 , 02:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thepizzlefosho
I have a couple posts before I hit 5000, and this seems like a waste, but dear god don't be stupid Jah. have your wife get an IUD. they are as effective as birth control, don't use hormones, only have to be replaced every few years, and take 5 minutes for her Gyn to insert.

seriously my wife is an MD. when I told her your plan she thought it was stupid. not only is it a waste of your time and money (or insurance money) but could seriously impact your life down the line should your current view point change. And BTW in case you've forgotten you're 23 and your opinions and view points will change. I'm 28 and every year I learn that I was dumber than I thought last year, and that I still have a lot to learn.

getting a vasectomy at your age is just silly considering all other reasonable birth control options. if you research IUDs and your conclusion is still to get a vasectomy I'll have to conclude that you're just a masochist.
I was going to avoid this discussion as I couldn't think of a good way to voice my opinion without repeating what others have already said but this post needs more love. Spot on in my opinion. At our age jah we should be leaving doors open, not closing them.
06-21-2011 , 02:36 PM
On a personal, selfish level that might be true, but you cant deny that what Jah is doing is great for the rest of us.
06-21-2011 , 02:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by waffe23
The animal/evolutionary instinct is to have sex, not to have kids. So if Jah is having sex, then he's not "getting over" any instincts imo. Our genes drive us to have sex, not to think "I want to have a kid". I mean how many guys are thinking "I want a kid". Probably not many, especially young ones. But how many are thinking "I want to have sex with that person". Everyone.

I'm not saying anything about what percentage of Africans care about Christianity, just that when you have an authority figure (the Pope) who many people follow blindly spouting BS like condoms can't be used because non-marital sex is a sin, etc., it certainly doesn't do anything to help overpopulation matters or AIDS problems. Handing out condoms might help but as a start just not having net negative impact would be nice.
i was referring to the unconditional love part when i mentioned instinct. we are wired to provide for/protect (love) our genetic offspring because we have a desire for our genes to live on. whether its the ego thinking ours are better than most other peoples, or some way to live past our normal live spans, or something else entirely, its just how our species is.

intellectually a kid is a kid. if you're responsible for it you should love it. but those unconscious feelings are pretty hard to completely get around. not saying you cant love an adopted kid a ton, but id be shocked if for most people it was exactly the same as loving their own.

as far as the aids, i get what you're saying. its pretty stupid. i was just curious if you knew about how the missions and stuff worked over there cuz i pretty much have no clue but if they are directly affecting condom usage that goes from stupid to im not even sure what but i prolly shouldnt type it anyway cuz its storming here and id get struck by lightning.
06-21-2011 , 02:50 PM
A lot of parents dont love their genetic offspring. And yes the Catholics and other religious organisations actively work against any kind of birth control.

Every sperm is sacred.
06-21-2011 , 02:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jah Onion
you see that doesn't really help me b/c IMO most people nowadays are:

1. having kids without putting anywhere near the amount of thought needed into it
2. in relationships where both parents work, which leads to them
3. not actually raising their kids anywhere near close to properly which leads to
4. society in general being a worse of place but also
5. just more ****ing mouths to feed and more waste and pollution which in turn
6. is gradually making the whole world a worse place to live

And no one seems to ****ing realize it.


I swear I look at all the parents on the street, not one of them is in control of their child. Not even when they're actually around the little buggers. they just let them do whatever the **** they please and just seem to ignore them and carry on talking to their friend/on their cell. And I've been to quite a few places in europe in the past couple of years...not even touching the states with a 30 foot pole.

And as much love as I have for the plights of the African people, they need them some ****ing common sense there more than they need AIDS medication. Yeah, rape pregnancies must be quite high but jesus i shudder to think how many kids they just have...when they can barely feed themselves and I can't understand the thought process .... is it like "yeah so i'll have a kid cuz i want him to suffer of hunger and dysentery and probably die before he's 20 after struggling to live every single day of his life"?

idk maybe i'm seeing this all wrong (doubt it) but if someone has any conflicting views please don't shy away.
If these are your arguments, shouldn't you want to have kids, teach them not to be like this and thus, making our society better?
06-21-2011 , 03:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRenaissance
A lot of parents dont love their genetic offspring. And yes the Catholics and other religious organisations actively work against any kind of birth control.

Every sperm is sacred.

you're right, but jah seems like a good person and doesnt strike me as the "im such a bastard i dont even love my own kid" type. but by that same token he loves bunnies instead of eating them so he prolly wouldnt have a problem unconditionally loving an aids baby either.

every sperm is wasted reminds me of an old joke:

So my grandmaw walked in on me jerking off. She's super catholic and started lecturing me about how its a sin and in the bible it says it is better for your seed to fall in the belly of a whore than on to the ground.

I said grandmaw, thats fine, but you're paying for the whore.
06-21-2011 , 03:15 PM
lol i bet that one gets the disco seal of approval
06-21-2011 , 03:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thejuggernaut
Jah, probably not my place to comment, but Im bored and feel like this has to be a pretty big mistake.

You're 23?

Even if it feels like your gf/wife is perfect, nothing will ever come between you, and that you will never change your mind, there are for sure some other possibilities to consider:


-As she gets older, she changes her mind and decides she wants to have a child of her own, which could cause a major problem in your relationship, as opposed to a minor hastle for you right now.

-Something happens and you two dont work out. (anything from death to drifting apart really, 10 years, or even 20 years is a long time.)

-Its extremely unlikely that 10 years from now your oppinions and outlook on life will remain constant, this decision might.

-You adopt several children, really enjoy being a father, and are very good at it. This leads you to decide that you want a biological child.

Also the drawbacks of waiting until you are, at the very least, in your mid-30's really arent that large. (Esp when compared to the potential downside of not waiting imo.)


Edit: That more rambly than I wanted, and doesnt resond directly to your post. Pretty tired, so it will have to do though.
these are valid points

id also add that people are all very different but at the same time we're wired very similar and have a bunch in common (generally speaking). theres a difference between things that bring us joy and things that make us happy. young people especially, dont realize this or dont understand the difference. things like "balling", jerking off, smoking weed, and poker bring you joy (poker can make people happy i guess but it depends imo). things that will make you happy are a good spouse, good friends, good relationship with family, rewarding career (like being a school teacher), and making babies with said spouse. generally speaking we're wired that way so why fight it?

as pointed out youre going to change a lot after 23 and so is your old lady. even the most level headed women on earth could change her mind in 10 minutes nevermind 10 years. you got any clue on how much people change 23-33? in addition to that i can tell you that i personally have witnessed a ton of relationships that seemed rock solid (no fighting, solid careers, socially competent) have ended in divorce? do you understand how many older, more mature people regret not having prenuptial agreements? things change

the whole adoption thing is sketchy imo. i grew up in an affluent community and there were a bunch of adopted kids. i'd say at least 75% of them had some serious problems (usually started by drugs). one of my best friends from highschool was adopted and knocked up his old lady at about 21. he now has a crack problem and isnt really apart of his kids life much. his sister was also adopted but from a different mother. she had an abortion at 16, married a "party guy" who developed a drug problem and is now divorced with kids. the cycle of growing up without a father repeats itself ( http://lmgtfy.com/?q=fatherless+drug+abuse ). an adopted kid in my class from grade 3-8 ended up doing drugs and running away from home to LA. he ended up in the bloods or crips gang and got locked up a bunch of years for armed robbery. in an affluent community what % of kids are going off the tracks like this? what % are adopted? def something to look in to or think about if you consider that an option. in my case i think i'd be doing the world a disservice by adopting. if my old lady held up her end of the bargain my kid would be a genetic masterpiece
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jah Onion
you see that doesn't really help me b/c IMO most people nowadays are:

1. having kids without putting anywhere near the amount of thought needed into it
2. in relationships where both parents work, which leads to them
3. not actually raising their kids anywhere near close to properly which leads to
4. society in general being a worse of place but also
5. just more ****ing mouths to feed and more waste and pollution which in turn
6. is gradually making the whole world a worse place to live

And no one seems to ****ing realize it.

I swear I look at all the parents on the street, not one of them is in control of their child.
print this off and read it 10 years from now and see if you still feel this way


Spoiler:
starbucks is way stronger than the **** i make at home
06-21-2011 , 03:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by waffe23
The animal/evolutionary instinct is to have sex, not to have kids. So if Jah is having sex, then he's not "getting over" any instincts imo. Our genes drive us to have sex, not to think "I want to have a kid". I mean how many guys are thinking "I want a kid". Probably not many, especially young ones. But how many are thinking "I want to have sex with that person". Everyone.
i think the interesting thing is that a few guys left on the evolution chart were having sex cause they just had this urge. then they realized sex = babies but they did it anyways cause they had the urge and getting laid felt great. then we came up with birth control so in theory sex doesn't = babies.... but then we realized that we are all going to die and that making babies in a way is the only way to cheat death
06-21-2011 , 03:29 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_theloo...l-care-in-jail

hope this doesnt derail the talk about jah's **** and balls but i foudn this story to be both really funny and really depressing at the same time
06-21-2011 , 04:19 PM
All this talk is depressing...nothing to do with balance in life nor quality of life...and is the primary reason why all of your winrates are so low...ok i said my piece, hows your moms?
06-21-2011 , 05:18 PM
You find it depressing because your mind is weak.
06-21-2011 , 06:05 PM
Juan,

I think you mentioned something about ss'ers having changed their strat recently. I have noticed the same, but could just be sample size. They seem to be 3b/calling a LOT wider than before. Also for the ones that like to blind down open/call range seems to be a lot wider as well. True or false? This is rush btw.
06-21-2011 , 06:16 PM
I luff getting freerolled with aces.

Full Tilt Poker $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players - View hand 1349900
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

SB: $127.20
Hero (BB): $220.70
UTG: $220.90
UTG+1: $214.40
MP1: $70.00
MP2: $222.50
CO: $314.20
BTN: $67.00

Pre Flop: ($3.00) Hero is BB with A A
UTG raises to $6, UTG+1 raises to $18, 5 folds, Hero raises to $42, UTG raises to $220.90 all in, UTG+1 calls $196.40 all in, Hero calls $178.70 all in

Flop: ($656.80) K 7 J (3 players - 3 are all in)

Turn: ($656.80) 4 (3 players - 3 are all in)

River: ($656.80) Q (3 players - 3 are all in)

UTG A A
UTG+1 K K
06-21-2011 , 07:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRenaissance
Jah,

Dont think I have ever agreed with you on anything as much as I agree about this. The pollution aspect of having kids is so very strong, and perfectly logical and easy to understand. Yet bring it up in polite company and watch people slowly back away from you.

Humans are the most destructive animal that has ever lived in terms of the effect on other species and use of resources. Yes we are creative and clever as well, but we dont even get close to making up for the damage, not by a long shot. Id quote some numbers but I am sure this is easy enough to understand.

If you have a child, you do 2x the damage and consume 2x the resources (assuming all things are equal, ie we dont get massive amounts of cheap, clean energy in the future. We might, but let us keep this simple). You drive a car, child drives a car. Logical. However it doesnt stop there, as there is a good chance the child will have kids of its own, which in turn will also have kids, etc etc.

So choosing to have one kid will have a massive negative impact. Those of us without kids can drive SUVs and use an entire roll after taking a dump and warm our houses with coal and kill endangered species as a weekend hobby - and STILL we wont get close to the havoc wreaked by a hippie, vegan, bike riding couple with one child.

This is probably my last post as now I am off to kill myself for the good of humanity.
First time I've agreed with Ren.
06-21-2011 , 07:31 PM
Well one thing all this talk about having/not having kids reinforces is that there is no hope for mankind given human overpopulation is the root cause of global warming and mass extinction of species. The average person is clearly incapable of altruistic action. That's OK. The sooner we get to mass extinction the better.
06-21-2011 , 07:44 PM
you think your vote matters too huh?
06-21-2011 , 07:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by H0NEY BADGER
you think your vote matters too huh?
I'm an anarchist which means freedom BTW. Voting is idiotic. Governments merely sustain the slavery of the masses.
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