NFL Old and Ongoing Bicker about Manning vs. Brady Thread. AKA The Biggest Loser - Page 108 - Sporting Events and Fantasy Sports

I love how Manning is the genius "coach on the field" except for when bad stuff happens, then the coach is one of the 4 horseman WOAT super dumb moran guys.

Put Brady in the cushy dome with Jim Mora, Tony Dungy, Jim Caldwell, and John Fox leading his teams. How good do you think he does?

Brady is not the sharpest knife in the drawer. He's the ideal stormtrooper though. And with mastermind BB at the helm, well, you get 5 Super Bowl appearances.

Brady is very good. But come on, think of how ridiculous it is to combine the #1 coach of all-time with a top-3 QB of all-time. The odds of that happening are ridiculously low. And they've been paired together for like 14 years now. Ridiculous.

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11-04-2014 , 07:23 PM

#2677

Kneel B4 Zod

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what happens is you get the "Montana/Young + Walsh 49ers" and the "Brady + BB Pats" - the only 2 franchise runs that can compare to one another.

Brady has been a starter for 12 years and has reached the AFCCG in 8 of those 12!

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11-04-2014 , 07:31 PM

#2678

Larry Legend

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Rsig just crushed this thread worse than Brady is gonna crush Manning in the playoffs this year.

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11-04-2014 , 07:48 PM

#2679

Salva135

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Quote:

Originally Posted by A-Rod's Cousin

Put Brady in the cushy dome with Jim Mora, Tony Dungy, Jim Caldwell, and John Fox leading his teams. How good do you think he does?

Brady is not the sharpest knife in the drawer. He's the ideal stormtrooper though. And with mastermind BB at the helm, well, you get 5 Super Bowl appearances.

Brady is very good. But come on, think of how ridiculous it is to combine the #1 coach of all-time with a top-3 QB of all-time. The odds of that happening are ridiculously low. And they've been paired together for like 14 years now. Ridiculous.

C'mon, man. It's one thing to call Peyton the most cerebral QB (I agree) but it's another thing to say Brady is not intelligent on the field. The only thing he basically does these days is read a defense, identify mismatches pre-snap, and exploit those mismatches over and over. That's Brady's entire game. Can't believe we're back to the point when BB is getting 100% of the credit. LOL ARC.

What an absurd circular argument this is. BB, Peyton, Brady. Round and round we go.

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11-04-2014 , 08:02 PM

#2680

GeoffRas22

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The most absurd part is how people attempt to degrade the other QB or in an effort to make their (mostly ill-conceived) points. They're both tremendous QBs and it's amazing we've gotten to watch both battle during the same period of time. One just happens to be better than the other. In the grand scheme of things, does it really matter that much?

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11-04-2014 , 09:58 PM

#2681

Salva135

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Quote:

Originally Posted by GeoffRas22

The most absurd part is how people attempt to degrade the other QB or in an effort to make their (mostly ill-conceived) points. They're both tremendous QBs and it's amazing we've gotten to watch both battle during the same period of time. One just happens to be better than the other. In the grand scheme of things, does it really matter that much?

Another passive-aggressive post. Totally condescending, and coming from you it's obvious what your point is. You aren't fooling anyone.

Yeah, it really does matter to SE. A LOT. We wouldn't have 108 pages otherwise. And it's not just LOLPatsFans driving this thread.

Just say what you really want to say: "Brady doesn't belong on the same field as Peyton and I will defend Peyton no matter the outcome, he convinced me he was superior a decade ago."

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11-04-2014 , 10:04 PM

#2682

heh

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Someone invite Scott Kacsmar to SE. Shouldn't take long to get this thing to 3-400 pages then.

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11-04-2014 , 10:13 PM

#2683

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Lol 108 pages

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11-04-2014 , 10:17 PM

#2684

Salva135

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Quote:

Originally Posted by RT

Lol 108 pages

OK, using my browser settings. This thread is absurdly long for two guys SE has figured out as better. 11-19-2007.

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11-04-2014 , 10:19 PM

#2685

Salva135

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Quote:

Originally Posted by RT

Lol 108 pages

Still want to figure out what's going on, because this is not a post "Richard Tanner" writes.

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11-04-2014 , 10:39 PM

#2686

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Salva135

Still want to figure out what's going on, because this is not a post "Richard Tanner" writes.

Not really sure how to take this tbh

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11-04-2014 , 10:43 PM

#2687

gs3737

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Quote:

Originally Posted by A-Rod's Cousin

Bill B has a 51-62 record as a head coach in games started by a QB other than Brady.

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11-04-2014 , 11:41 PM

#2688

CallMeIshmael

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Quote:

Originally Posted by MrWookie

CMI,

The term you are looking for is "Poe's Law"

Yeah, that is it. I suppose its too obvious an observation for someone not to have coined a term for it by now.

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/ho...ation-penalty/

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11-04-2014 , 11:56 PM

#2689

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Quote:

Originally Posted by CallMeIshmael

Yeah, that is it. I suppose its too obvious an observation for someone not to have coined a term for it by now.

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/ho...ation-penalty/

Allow me to translate that article for anyone unwilling or unable to read it:

RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN NNNNNNNNNNNGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG GGGGGGZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

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11-04-2014 , 11:56 PM

#2690

Prawney

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Thats a terrible attempt at the worst sports column on earth.

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11-05-2014 , 03:35 AM

#2691

5kids2feed

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Quote:

Originally Posted by gs3737

Bill B has a 51-62 record as a head coach in games started by a QB other than Brady.

LOL W-L records. LOL Cleveland. Not like he ever had coaching success before being a HC.

Wanna compare Matt Cassel's career with and without BB to show a piece of what that's worth?

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11-05-2014 , 09:26 AM

#2692

Jbrochu

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 5kids2feed

LOL W-L records. LOL Cleveland. Not like he ever had coaching success before being a HC.

Wanna compare Matt Cassel's career with and without BB to show a piece of what that's worth?

Cassel stepped onto the field having been in the system for several years, playing against a very soft schedule, and with a team that went 18-1 the prior year playing against a tough schedule.

There are some advanced stats showing the drop from Brady to Cassel was nearly as bad as the drop from Manning to whatever that scrubs name was. Plus the Pats didn't actively try to tank the season to position themselves for the draft.

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11-05-2014 , 10:00 AM

#2693

Kneel B4 Zod

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Pats offensive DVOA

2007: 43.5%
2008: 12.5%

dropped 31%

Colts offensive DVOA

2010: 13.1%
2011: -17.2%

dropped 30.3%

Pats won so many games that year b/c they had a ridic team around Cassell and got a bit lucky. Colts were not a great team by 2011 and were unlucky to lose as many games as they did

....

New England Patriots - Total wins in the 2008 NFL Regular Season

Over 12 (-165)

Under 12 (+145)

Indianapolis Colts - Total wins in the 2011 NFL Regular Season

Over 9.5 (-135)

Under 9.5 (+105)

Last edited by Kneel B4 Zod; 11-05-2014 at 10:16 AM.

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11-05-2014 , 10:21 AM

#2694

Jbrochu

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This forum loves advanced stats, except when they don't support arguments in favor of their beautiful loser.

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11-05-2014 , 10:50 AM

#2695

gs3737

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 5kids2feed

LOL W-L records. LOL Cleveland. Not like he ever had coaching success before being a HC.

Wanna compare Matt Cassel's career with and without BB to show a piece of what that's worth?

Lol at 15 games of Matt Cassell.

I happen to think Bill B. is an incredible coach, one of the best of all-time. But those who think Brady wouldn't have been great without him are morons.

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11-05-2014 , 10:53 AM

#2696

gs3737

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Jbrochu

This forum loves advanced stats, except when they don't support arguments in favor of their beautiful loser.

Lol, this sums it up perfectly.

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11-05-2014 , 10:54 AM

#2697

Victor

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Quote:

Originally Posted by El Rata

eric decker is a monster weapon as evidenced by the great year he's having in new york

likewise emmanuel sanders by his numbers the previous 3 years with a hall of fame qb.

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11-05-2014 , 11:00 AM

#2698

Kneel B4 Zod

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Jbrochu

This forum loves advanced stats, except when they don't support arguments in favor of their beautiful loser.

for years I've said that the 2+2 acceptance of park factors for MLB while not really even considering this for NFL is a very bizarre contradiction.

granted it's because there aren't easy to find charts anywhere and the "answers" aren't as clear to this question for NFL but still - if I compared a Rockies hitter to a Padres hitter without considering park factors it would be lol'ed at.

and I'm not even arguing Brady > Manning, I'm just saying that with some simple assumptions re: context their career rate stats end up looking very similar.

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11-05-2014 , 11:23 AM

#2699

feedthabeast

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Kneel B4 Zod

for years I've said that the 2+2 acceptance of park factors for MLB while not really even considering this for NFL is a very bizarre contradiction.

granted it's because there aren't easy to find charts anywhere and the "answers" aren't as clear to this question for NFL but still - if I compared a Rockies hitter to a Padres hitter without considering park factors it would be lol'ed at.

and I'm not qe arguing Brady > Manning, I'm just saying that with some simple assumptions re: context their career rate stats end up looking very similar.

Cameras though!

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11-05-2014 , 12:34 PM

#2700

THAY3R

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KBZ,

Re: Park Factors,

It's much better to just look at Peyton's outside stats and compare it to Brady's outside stats and then consider the fact that a lot of the times Brady is at home and Peyton is always on the road. Regardless of that consideration Peyton comes out ahead by a lot.

You can't just compare/extrapolate dome stats because Peyton had to play all the teams in a dome but Brady has only played terrible defenses in a dome.

This was addressed years ago.

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