dont want this to turn into some politard discussion, but benji was famous - his death didnt need jesse to get attention

this, and the depaul coach had it right. it turned into a circus, even his family knew it.

if benji was some end of the bench scrub who had been killed, do you think jesse jackson would be there with his arm the the kids mother, and letting her live in his house to hide out, preaching at the ceremony, walking through the cemetary? #cmonson

he exploited the tragic situation. thats what he does.

the event in this case was a circus indeed.

but you called jackson a leech. that isn't true. he walked with Dr. King and has been an important activist for many years. same thing with al sharpton. so make no mistake, as much as you may not like seeing them talking loudly on tv all the time.

so you perceive activists like jackson to be exploiters. i couldn't disagree more.

didn't they said it took like 2 hours for him to get into surgery bc they brought him to a hospital that didn't have the necessary equipment nor staff? I don't really see how that's the hospital's fault. unless the hospital is supposed to be prepared for gunshot trauma and wasn't or said they were even though they weren't or something.

i believe that its possible they were dumb enough to be coerced into bogus confessions but if his version is true and the other kid was just standing there not involved at all then he's like the biggest douche in history for not taking the stand to try to reduce his friend's sentence. truth has to be somewhere in the middle. shouldn't there have been other witnesses besides the GF?

I would tend to side with what you're saying except that

a) they didnt leave the site to do the surgery (iirc) , doesn't that indicate they had the equipment and the staff?

b) the hospital didn't even go to trial when sued. Possible they just wanted to nip it in the bud, but they likely settled for a few million and back then legal fees probably wouldnt have come close to that (i could be wrong there) so it looks like them admitting possible wrongdoing (likely negligence).

that said, the ambulance policy really was the problem.

Lose Pippen, gain a guy who will actually check in for the final seconds of critical playoff games. Seems like a fair trade.

So it would seem absent additional information. However, that may not be the entire story. And if that were the only relevent issue, the hospital may have been willing to go to trial to present their case as they would have been able to deflect the responsibility.

Questions I would like to see answered are:
Were there any attempts to transport him to a more appropriate hospital? If not, why not?

Exactly how long was it before he was prepped for surgery? If not immediate, why not? [I think it's entirely possible that there were a lot of "It's not my job" or "He shouldn't be at this hospital" statements being made rather than action being taken.]

What care did he receive pre-op and post-op?

Benji is the reason why the ER exists in every hospital now to save lives. At least that's what we should all believe.

it's weird bc they both seem to make some sense. like the shooter's story about going to the school in the first place was to get $10 back from whoever, but by the time they got there it was already resolved sorta fits with the robbery storyline. but then this Benji kid being sort of a hothead fits with the whole stupid beef that got out of control quickly storyline.

tend to agree with this. but then again, not quite sure why the cops would concoct some bogus story about a robbery. i mean do they really care all that much about making this kid look like a saint. why wouldn't they just say it was a dumb fight over smudged Puma's, etc if that's what really happened?

yeah that was a pretty sad part for me. seemed like the grief a lot of people were feeling was that their meal ticket disappeared. would be interesting if these docs ever pursue that angle a little more to see what's there. especially interesting when juxtaposed with the reactions of the parents and people closest to him. they were very calm and measured in their grief with the situation, seems like people always completely lose their [censored] and/or feel some kind of obligation to grandstand and put on a show. (interesting parallel with Jackson imo, it's all one big circus)

not directly related to this, but i felt like the doc was intentionally holding back information, either bc they thought it'd make it better, or bc they think that's how it's supposed to go. like in their talking head bit with them they mentioned something about "blah blah blah, here's the story, you make up your own mind, etc". i'm sure they had to have more information about the shooting, what happened at the hospital, what kind of kid he was, and so on. just felt like a lot of stuff was left intentionally vague bc maybe it made for a better film or something.

edit: just read this review, like it, agree with pretty much all of it

Unless I'm missing something it really does seem like that Omar guy got totally screwed by the whole deal. Presumably they were coerced into a confession that was far from accurate and as a result he took the fall along with the shooter because people wanted retribution.

Agree with that linked review that the girlfriend did come off as vilified. It was presented as seemingly ominous that Benji was associating with her without elaborating as to why she was a bad influence.

Also agree with the review at that there were a lot of interesting sidebars that didn't get fully explored and that the main story itself was pretty one-note (and imo for that reason it could have been shorter).

Ya, it seemed like the directors basically said "Oh you're gonna refuse to be interviewed for our documentary? OK, you're the bad guy."

Not trying to argue or bust chops here, but alternate hypothetical is that Benji became like any one of a number of other huge NBA/NFL hot prospects and ended up being a bust.

Yes, Pippen was a total zero as a player because of one incident you read about as a kid in a game they won anyway.

lol @ some incident I read about as a kid. I had just turned 21 and watched that game at a Vegas sports book. I was also a huge NBA fan, certainly bigger than I am now.

and double lol @ "they won anyway", like that somehow makes it OK. If Kukoc doesn't win the game Pippen would have been rightfully excoriated in the Chicago media, the MVP candidate who bitched out when his team needed him the most. Totally ridiculous.

Other than that your post was spot on though.

yeah if they lose that game (and the series), there's a 30 for 30 on that

Pippen probably gets run out of Chicago (unless MJ stumps for him when he comes back), and maybe becomes an infamous sports villain

Shooter's story isn't believable. I don't doubt the police would be coercive in getting a confession, but I doubt they would fabricate a robbery. Shooting someone under that circumstance would be illegal anyway, although it would probably be manslaughter. And his story about respecting the danger guns pose doesn't jibe with bringing a gun to to get $10. Or with showing off that you have one instead of walking away from a fight.

I have no idea what you guys are talking about, but i'm interested. I'd watch a 30 for 30 on that.

When did the "Broke" episode air? I just watched it on ESPN On-Demand.

Good episode. I mean for your average upper middle class white dude I'm sure many of us are rolling our eyes, but socio-economic status really plays a huge roll in players blowing their 25 million wad in under a decade. Interesting how colleges do not educate one bit on future of finance for their careers or whatever. Even though most don't go to class even a refresher or mandatory class discussing athlete finances would probably be beneficial. Maybe it wouldn't.

Funny story...I remember seeing Antoine Walker playing big NL live at the Bellagio during the 2004 WSOP summer. Pretty sure the game was built around him (iirc either Paul Pierce or another player was in the game as well). Eitherway stacks were really really deep. The money must've meant nothing to him at the time being paid ~15mil/year. Now he's broke and in and out of bankruptcy court.

Broke was around 3-4 weeks ago. There were actually like 2-3 pages of comments about it itt (50 p/p pro setting obv) because it was pretty entertaining, but it also got panned by some for being about an inch deep and a mile wide.

I can understand the mindset behind these guys wanting to make it rain and show everyone how much money they have etc., coming from nothing and wanting to show everyone that they've made it. One thing the documentary opened my eyes to was just how many people some of these guys end up supporting and how hard it must be to know where to draw the line and say "no", not to mention what happens when their careers are over. That's a legit issue even if they aren't ******ed with their money.

Just a little education and they might figure out how badly the college system is screwing them.

Illini fans have always claimed he (Benji) was the missing jewel. As far as I can tell, it seemed like Illinois and DePaul were on pretty even footing for his school choice. Illinois fans hold up a phone conversation Benji had after Lowell Hamilton committed where he told Lowell, "it looks like I have to go to Illinois now", and Nick Anderson's later commitment to Illinois where he mentioned fulfilling Benji's path as evidence.

Not only did Nick Anderson wear #25 at Illinois and throughout the pros, a ton of Simeon stars have worn #25. Most notably, Deon Thomas wore it after Anderson at Simeon and Illinois. Thomas remains Illinois' all-time leading scorer and was a top 5 recruit nationally. Bryant Notree and Calvin Brock wore #25 at Simeon and at Illinois, also.

not really.... people look at what colleges make and think player's are getting screwed.

1) Basketball doesn't make that much. It's football that's making money.

2) There aren't good substitutes. Players benefit from their 'minor' leagues being tied up in universities as much as the schools benefit. The alternative is what you see with MLB and NHL. Sure, you can make some dough, but it will be in obscurity. The trade-off for co-opting people's love of their alma mater with exposure for minor league sports is you don't get the get paid option as you do in other sports. It's my opinion that universities should have nothing to do with being minor leagues, but that's a different argument. Regardless, it's tough for me to believe the players are getting screwed. They can easily go the Brandon Jennings route and pursue the dough if that's what they want.

it's a charter/vocational school, ie allowed to recruit players if they are within the borders of Chicago. There's a reason Simeon, King, and Whitney Young have had flashes of dominance.

For example, Illinois just got a commitment from Jaylon Tate, Simeon's PG. Tate was at De La Salle his first two years of HS. He moved to Simeon to improve his basketball prospects. Pretty good to churn out top talent when the top talent will choose you for the competition to distinguish themselves from other guys competing for high major scholarships.

King HS churned out more talent for much of my life, but Simeon is leading of late.

This one's pretty good. The director is trying to tell the story of the football team along with the civil rights history.