Honest question, do you feel the same hate for what gun control people are doing? Because they are making fear based arguments to push a political point just as much as the NRA

Itt gun control nuts hang their hat on grammar corrections.

Seems like the NRA is actually supporting Bipartisanship on the issue. They have similar talking points.

12/19/12


December 20, 2012

Reaching across the aisle (even if the plan is not perfect) should be applauded on both sides.

This (from http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/research...use/index.html) has been cited a couple of times. The problem with it is that the studies that claim a million + defensive gun uses per year ALSO claim that in almost all (~98%) DGU's a weapon is only brandished rather than fired.

To some extent, yes. But most of the people who are truly disgusted by this weren't as this invested before. Its a tipping point compared to using the death of children to press views/initiatives the NRA already have.

Also, the best way to make schools safer is to tackle the bullying issue. School shooters will very rarely be a parent/teacher/random. Violence/suicide by a bullied student is prevalent and doesn't need the national guard
There is also the point of the gun control/regulation views will save lives, while using the death of kids to arm more people in bad situations will lead to more death and continue the current cycle, perhaps even accelerating it is what draws my disgust.

Edit: post now out of order, on phone so w/e

Unless English is your second language or something, I find it very hard to believe that you are ignorant of the fact phrases like "can happen" carry a much looser degree of certainty than "significant chance of happening" or the difference between "can't do" and "shouldn't do."

My only real conclusion is that you are in here playing word games in order to win as many arguments as you can, and so my only real response is:

lolikes

So in reality you have no problem with people using a tragedy to further their political goals, so long as you agree with them.

Glad to see your actual problem is the disagreement and your complaint about using kids deaths is just hypocritical lip service

Head exploding amount of irony here. Play stupid 'word games', accuse opponent of playing those games. Awesome

We can argue about this all day but nothing is actually going to change. We have a conservative supreme court and between the conservative Democrats who owe their hides to the NRA and the Republicans in congress (who all owe the NRA) there is zero chance of any gun control bill passing.

Obama is making a fairly huge mistake by trying to go after this. He could waste his political capital elsewhere imo. Somewhere else like healthcare and taxes.

Really Ikes? There's a difference when the solution one side has to a tragedy is one that is much more likely to lead to more death and destruction then another. This is different from other politicized issues like taxes.

My problem is that one side wants action, the other is presenting a smoke screen to avoid/change the debate. Its talking to a wall, as the rest of the thread is used too.

Hey, another non response!

Also interesting that you refer to me as your "opponent." Hope you win the debate and get that ribbon you've always wanted.

still awaiting the relevant statute, regulation, standard, qualified opinion, hell I'd even consider a hs term paper at this point. but there are crickets itf today.

Someone needs to explain to me why gun nuts keep insisting on more guns even though we've had record high gun ownership for years now despite gun deaths still being among the highest on the planet.

Also, stop wasting breath on Ikes guys, he's just a provocateur and pretty much everyone here knows better than to buy his garbage.

I'm genuinely curious as to what rights ikes thinks the 2A protects and how a statute requiring gun manufacturers to keep track of the weapons they sell infringes those rights.

Did the coin come up tails this time? There's nothing wrong with this, and done in most places with registration. What you first proposed, and since flipping back and forth on, is real time tracking of a guns precise location. That's obviously not ok.

Lol and this is my exact point. You don't give two ****s about 'exploiting a tragedy'. What you actually care about is what you agree with, which is perfectly reasonable, but spare me the holier than tho attitude wrt using the deaths of children to further a political agenda.

Even if the american public does see through it, changing the status quo would take a massive concerted public outcry, and even that might change little. Apathy is easier. Like others have said ITT, if you hate the NRA, and guns, and gun culture so much, then leave your family, friends, and life here behind, and move to another country. 200 people demonstrating in front of the white house are simply outmatched vs. the apathetic majority.

The NRA and gun lobby is trying to change the argument to "school safety." This is the first school shooting in the US I can remember that wasn't by a student who was either bullied or mentally ill. To prevent school shootings, taking steps to prevent bullying and those who show signs of mental illness. It's much more effective and much less costly.

The NRA has absolutely NO intention of seeking solutions that show any real logical way of reducing the amount of shootings in the US. I find that morally reprehensible Ikes, sorry. They don't want to talk about the issue, it's not on the table in their eyes.

When the question is "what should be done after a school shooting? and one side proposes it should be harder to obtain assault rifles and the other suggests arming teachers, I'm at fault with the NRA, not the gun regulation people. I think thats reasonable. I just watched CNN this morning. An NRA spokesperson/former congressman compared not arming teachers to not having air marshalls after 9/11. It was vile.

To your point about "exploiting a tragedy," I don't know how far the exploitation goes as I expect nothing to get done. I don't think seeking an assault rifle ban or mental health checks for people seeking to buy guns is even exploiting a tragedy, it's common sense.

Again, you seem to be implying that the latter proposal violates the 2A and its lol obvious why. So plz tell me, what rights does the 2A protect, and how are they violated by such a statute.

It violates to 4th, 5th and the generic right to privacy

lol, there is no generic right to privacy, come on now

Yes there is. There's nowhere in the USC guaranteeing the right to privacy, but roe v wade affirmed it existed:

Not clear how requiring a company to keep a database on where the weapons they sell go violates the 4th. As for the 5th is it a due process violation, equal protection? What? What's this "general right to privacy" and why should we care about it in regards to the tracking of weapons?

Lol for the umpteenth time, it doesn't. You can't track a persons real time location.