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02-04-2013 , 04:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vuggie
You think he can only have 88 or JJ here? Sure, it's very unlikely to be a bluff, but don't you think he can raise a worse two-pair for value? A8, J8, A6 can all be in his preflop range and flop-calling range

also, if he were any good, I think many really good players wouldn't raise turn in this spot with a set, and the reason is to maximize value.
From what I know of him he looks pretty bad so I'm going to say he could well raise sets here but i don't think he could be so bad to raise a worse two pair here, granted it's close but i think people are so much more likely to raise 88/JJ here than a worse two pair.

probably wrong about shipping 90% of rivers since he won't ship a spade river but all blanks he'll ship
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02-04-2013 , 04:56 PM
@ WOO he is a nitty ****** but cold 4bets quite a bit, 18% over big sample.
also i had KQdd
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02-04-2013 , 05:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasticElephant
@ WOO he is a nitty ****** but cold 4bets quite a bit, 18% over big sample.
also i had KQdd
damn you are nitty, i would have shipped that in if i knew
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02-04-2013 , 05:15 PM
just would ship A2s-A5s and JTs KQs has pretty horrible equity if he calls.
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02-04-2013 , 05:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy Vercetti
how does this look? villain 20/16 reggy tag fish, cbet 2/4, hows the c/r? fwiw id c/c all my lower fd's

Poker Stars $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

BTN: $25.00
Hero (SB): $29.49
BB: $26.63
UTG: $35.66
MP: $24.65
CO: $14.10

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero is SB with T K
3 folds, BTN raises to $0.75, Hero calls $0.65, 1 fold

Flop: ($1.75) 4 7 A (2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $1.25, Hero raises to $4.50, BTN raises to $8, Hero calls $3.50

Turn: ($17.75) 6 (2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $7, Hero folds
I like x/c better on the flop.
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02-04-2013 , 05:26 PM
PokerStars - $1 NL (6 max) ZOOM - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: $173.83
SB: $125.05
BB: $108.96
UTG: $263.89
Hero (MP): $116.18
CO: $54.34

SB posts SB $0.50, BB posts BB $1.00

Pre Flop: (pot: $1.50) Hero has A A

UTG raises to $2.00, Hero calls $2.00, fold, fold, fold, fold

Flop: ($5.50, 2 players) 6 9 2
UTG checks, Hero bets $3.50, UTG calls $3.50

Turn: ($12.50, 2 players) 6
UTG checks, Hero bets $17.00, UTG calls $17.00

River: ($46.50, 2 players) 2
UTG checks, Hero bets $63.00, UTG calls $63.00

Hero shows A A (Two Pair, Aces and Sixes) (Pre 82%, Flop 90%, Turn 95%)
UTG mucks 3 3 (Two Pair, Sixes and Threes) (Pre 18%, Flop 10%, Turn 5%)
Hero wins $169.70

hmmmm
my sizing is so bad but general plan worked
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02-04-2013 , 05:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasticElephant
just would ship A2s-A5s and JTs KQs has pretty horrible equity if he calls.
That is wrong, if his 4b % is actually high, most of his range will consist of Ax hands (as that is the best hands to 4b bluff with), meaning KQ is the nut hand to jam it in with as it blocks legit hands like KK/QQ, while hands like A2ss block hands you want him to have. Obv this isnt right but coincidentally a range that consists of AA/KK/QQ AKss + every single Ax hand (suited and non suited) is a 16% 4bing range.
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02-04-2013 , 05:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 50nlRushandBeyond
That is wrong, if his 4b % is actually high, most of his range will consist of Ax hands (as that is the best hands to 4b bluff with), meaning KQ is the nut hand to jam it in with as it blocks legit hands like KK/QQ, while hands like A2ss block hands you want him to have. Obv this isnt right but coincidentally a range that consists of AA/KK/QQ AKss + every single Ax hand (suited and non suited) is a 16% 4bing range.
yeah true hadn't thought about the effect of blocking his bluffing his hands, was just thinking about equity vs his all in range.
you sure the blocking effect is enought o negate the equity we lose by having KQs instead of A2s though?
could well be I guess.
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02-04-2013 , 05:42 PM
The equity difference between KQss and A2ss vs a range of AA/KK/QQ/AK is less than 4%
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02-04-2013 , 06:44 PM
Did you have a read of V on the AA hand plastic?
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02-04-2013 , 07:24 PM
I knew he was pretty bad, his x/c range is pairs and good Ahi's imo. I block Ahi so may as well bomb it, as he will be pretty aware he is capped and make dumb calls, especially on this run out where all my percieved value hands become unlikely by the river.
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02-04-2013 , 07:35 PM
Making hero calls is my favorite thing in poker guys

Hand #1
Poker Stars $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players - View hand 2089918
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

Hero (BTN): $638.52
SB: $200.00
BB: $229.35
UTG: $254.58
MP: $829.61
CO: $2051.03

Pre Flop: ($3.00) Hero is BTN with Q J
1 fold, MP raises to $6, 1 fold, Hero raises to $18.72, 2 folds, MP raises to $42.50, Hero calls $23.78

Flop: ($88.00) J 3 T (2 players)
MP bets $47, Hero calls $47

Turn: ($182.00) 2 (2 players)
MP bets $122, Hero calls $122

River: ($426.00) 7 (2 players)
MP bets $430, Hero calls $427.02 all in

Final Pot: $1280.04
Hero shows Q J (a pair of Jacks)
MP shows A Q (high card Ace)
Hero wins $1277.24
(Rake: $2.80)

Hand #2
Poker Stars $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players - View hand 2089919
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

Hero (BTN): $265.58
SB: $100.50
BB: $126.48
UTG: $102.30
MP: $178.08
CO: $114.58

Pre Flop: ($1.50) Hero is BTN with J J
3 folds, Hero raises to $2, SB raises to $8, 1 fold, Hero calls $6

Flop: ($17.00) 2 7 2 (2 players)
SB bets $9.60, Hero calls $9.60

Turn: ($36.20) Q (2 players)
SB bets $21.60, Hero calls $21.60

River: ($79.40) K (2 players)
SB bets $61.30 all in, Hero calls $61.30

Final Pot: $202.00
Hero shows J J (two pair, Jacks and Deuces)
SB shows T A (a pair of Deuces)
Hero wins $199.20
(Rake: $2.80)

View all 2 hands
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02-04-2013 , 07:43 PM
not sure which hand i like more
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02-04-2013 , 07:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy Vercetti
im not sure whether you really are on another level or hmm im not sure (i dnt want to say bad - most likely i dont understand)

fwiw i jsut read the sauce blog post on the 6bet hand vs aarookie so poker seems even more complex
Its not difficult, both rivers are snap calls, Hand 2 is easier since its less bbs but hand 1 i was pretty confident as well.

I am from the same city as sauce so its in my blood obv.
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02-04-2013 , 07:47 PM
u only call hand 1 cuz u think he does that only w bluff or JJ right.. I mean he doesnt hav many JJ left at this point so.. I wouldnt call im jus sayin, I would snap fold A$AP like a boss
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02-04-2013 , 07:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by khangura175
u only call hand 1 cuz u think he does that only w bluff or JJ right.. I mean he doesnt hav many JJ left at this point so.. I wouldnt call im jus sayin, I would snap fold A$AP like a boss
Haha i wish it was that easy. Villain is def shoving AA/KK, all two pairs etc, i was worried about getting value owned with AJ also.
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02-04-2013 , 07:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy Vercetti
im not sure whether you really are on another level or hmm im not sure (i dnt want to say bad - most likely i dont understand)

fwiw i jsut read the sauce blog post on the 6bet hand vs aarookie so poker seems even more complex nd i now understand nothing
link?

Quote:
Originally Posted by khangura175
u only call hand 1 cuz u think he does that only w bluff or JJ right.. I mean he doesnt hav many JJ left at this point so.. I wouldnt call im jus sayin, I would snap fold A$AP like a boss
slightly wider than that, all ss/dd missed/block topset/tptk/twopairs only 89/QQ some/KK/AA really unsure about dynamics maybe has TT/AJ some.
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02-04-2013 , 07:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 50nlRushandBeyond
Haha i wish it was that easy. Villain is def shoving AA/KK, all two pairs etc, i was worried about getting value owned with AJ also.
fwiw i think villain shoving AJ is extremely unlikely without some bigger dynamics between you two. rest i agree w tho
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02-04-2013 , 08:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasticElephant
PokerStars - $1 NL (6 max) ZOOM - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: $173.83
SB: $125.05
BB: $108.96
UTG: $263.89
Hero (MP): $116.18
CO: $54.34

SB posts SB $0.50, BB posts BB $1.00

Pre Flop: (pot: $1.50) Hero has A A

UTG raises to $2.00, Hero calls $2.00, fold, fold, fold, fold

Flop: ($5.50, 2 players) 6 9 2
UTG checks, Hero bets $3.50, UTG calls $3.50

Turn: ($12.50, 2 players) 6
UTG checks, Hero bets $17.00, UTG calls $17.00

River: ($46.50, 2 players) 2
UTG checks, Hero bets $63.00, UTG calls $63.00

Hero shows A A (Two Pair, Aces and Sixes) (Pre 82%, Flop 90%, Turn 95%)
UTG mucks 3 3 (Two Pair, Sixes and Threes) (Pre 18%, Flop 10%, Turn 5%)
Hero wins $169.70

hmmmm
my sizing is so bad but general plan worked
sizings seem fine, how much bigger/smaller would you go and why?
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02-04-2013 , 08:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy Vercetti
What kind of villains would you target to c/r against?

also reasons for c/c rather than c/r?
bc it looks like exactly what you have, any competent villian can 3bet this flop and its going to be super profitable. his sizing was terrible tho so a call isnt bad i guess, think about your range and his and think why c/r is silly.

c/r this board against a bunch of different villians is going to be bad.
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02-04-2013 , 08:10 PM
Should have made it so I could feasibly jam river.

JJ seems borderline, would have to do some maths to be sure, I call in game though. QJ seems fine post if he's going to betsize like a ****** but everything pre is bad.
Run so good though getting the nut board to station down.
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02-04-2013 , 09:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy Vercetti
i cant have 44/77/a4/a7 in that spot? if i c/r KsXs + my value hands then c/c every other fd

my range =

value combos

9 x a7
9 x a4
4 x 77
4 x 44

semi bluffs

ksxs = 16 combos

cant i have 10 more combos of semi-bluffs/bluffs to be balanced?

im not disputing that c/r is better than c/c but im not sure "it looks like exactly what i have" is true.

if im wrong, correct me please
really doesnt matter what you think you can have.

you cant have A7/A4 alot unless you have certain dynamics or your a fish i mean even calling with 44/77 is terrible(debatable). youd likely 3bet sooted/a7,a4 and you just have alot more sooted ss broadway crap/air. you cant really balance when your range is already capped (obviously dynamics yadadyadya) and EVEN if u did have that entire range otf, dafuq would you c/r all of it bbvbtn?

also your sizing sucks, but so does villians so it balances out
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02-04-2013 , 09:43 PM
dont c/r K high fd tommy
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02-04-2013 , 09:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasticElephant
Should have made it so I could feasibly jam river.
Meh, still dont think its that big of a deal.
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02-04-2013 , 10:51 PM
ahh soz thought it was 50nl, sizing is fine.

find better spots to c/r
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