The FTP that squandered our money is not the FTP that has a chance to apply for a US license. The PokerStars that allegedly also committed fraud and remained in the US after UIGEA will be the same company and personnel if or when US licenses are offered to offshore companies.

And I don't think FTP shareholders will agree to anything that doesn't make US players whole as I think that leaves them still open to lawsuits but I could be wrong.

Exactly 8 months after black Friday, to the hour to be exact, this is vindication baby. Ship the money's. What a day

Tapie 4 prez.

AGCC have always been explicit in stating that the original licenses can be re-issued if FTP ownership were to change, so i'm not sure if they really need this "out"

Dear sir, you nailed it, thx!

from pokerstrategy (google translate)

The purpose of this agreement - to provide assurance that if Full Tilt Poker will hand over its assets the U.S. Department of Justice, the GBT will buy them. Also, there are a number of additional conditions that are mentioned in other related agreements, including assurances that GBT will pay the amounts due to account holders who are not residents of the United States.

Will make one more step before you get DOJ control over the assets of Full Tilt. The fact is that Full Tilt will prepare an official register, the process of drawing up of which will appear, monitored GBT. Since then the U.S. will be able to get DOJ control over the assets referred to in this registry.

Lawyers for both sides until it provided their comments.

Maybe it's easier (less time and less money) to reinstate than to expedite a new license?

I have no idea, just a thought.

GBT deal with DoJ is for US players to be paid by DoJ so remove US element of 'players paid'. If for any reason US players are not made 100% whole, this cannot be held against the new FTP.

The civil suits dropped are those against FTP, not Bitar and the other individuals. These need to be dropped as part of the GBT/Doj deal as nobody would buy FTP if future liabilities to claims would need to be calculated for. So directors still on the hook.

FTP didn't act bad.....more the directors of FTP....a clean FTP is being punted on by the DoJ, in return for some money for the US players fund.

As often happens with corporate crimes, there are two cases, one civil and one criminal. You are talking about the CRIMINAL case. It is expected that PART OF the CIVIL case will be settled as a result of this latest agreement.

(Sorry if those caps look obnoxious. They're not meant to come off that way... just trying to be clear.)

so US players will likely have to file claims or something to the DOJ to be paid?

I personally don't see it that way. Anyone who buys FTP AND keeps the name is doing so with a calculated strategy to capitalize on the brand and would be doing that for BOTH the good and bad. If FTP1 doesn't pay back all players in full for whatever reason, in my eyes, FTP2 should suffer some consequences, too. You can't just have it one sided. Think about how tarnished FTP2 would or definitely should be if everyone is not paid back.

If I, as a US player, were not payed back in full and FTP2 opened in the US after regulation, I would invest a LOT of energy telling EVERY casual player I knew or anyone else who would listen what FTP1 did and encourage them not to play on FTP2 or whatever you want to call it. I won't even delineate between the two. I'll tell them: "I had X amount of money on Full Tilt and they didn't pay it all back. Wherever you play, DON'T PLAY THERE." Maybe that's sour grapes on my part, but again, you can't just have it one way.

The DoJ are effectively buying FTP for $0 (see agreement FTP/DoJ i.e. forfeiture). You are correct in stating the DoJ only has brand to capitalise it's return when DoJ sells FTP (minus the US) to GBT.

So, GBT will rightly benefit from the brand. Why else would they pay $80m (less $40m in bank) + $150m ROW players = $190m.

But you'd need a deluded bunch of friends to think the new owners were responsible for a) DoJ agreeing the take US liability and b)new owners making Ray Bitar and friends steal players money.

DoJ establishing a 'fund', US players to make 'application' to 'fund'. GBT giving $80m to DoJ, in return for FTP. Hopefully $80m makes it to 'fund'

Not yet known when applications can commence, or how they will be organised.

And in my mind will rightly not benefit, so far as myself and others can spread ill will, from the brand as well IF everyone owed money is not paid in full.

Remember when UB cleaned house and we found out they didn't REALLY clean house? I'd say very few people actually know what went on behind closed doors at Full Tilt. It could have been misconduct from 1 person. It could have been misconduct from every last person who worked there. Who knows? Who knows if the new owners will start with a completely different staff? I could care less about who worked there yesterday and who works there tomorrow ... anyone parading the FTP brand, no matter how they obtained it, will get nothing but bad press from me if everyone is not paid back IN FULL.

And, the average, casual person knows nothing about the old owners or new ones. I posted a Facebook link to the latest news article stating I hoped I would get my money back sometime soon and a friend commented "Wow! I didn't know that the money had not been released yet. Hope you get yours soon.." Like I said, I'll be educating everyone about the evils of FTP in the future if need be and will full court press my effort so that no one ever plays there again. If other US players aren't paid back in full, I'm inclined they will side with me and act similarly.

I sent PokerStars.fr an email asking if I, as an Italian citizen, living in Italy, could play on the .fr site and they replied:
"Thank you for contacting us with your query.

If you reside in Italy, the only legal PokerStars platform is PokerStars.it, so unfortunately you will not be able to play on the French site.

To clarify the UE point for you, PokerStars.fr is able to welcome real money players if they have a bank account within the European Union or the European Economic Area. Although Italy is part of the EU, it also has its own regulation regarding online gaming which specifically indicates what I have mentioned above: within Italy, only the Italian site is allowed.

I hope this clears up the matter for you, but please let us know if you have any further questions.

Regards,

Robert
PokerStars Support Team"

Also if you look at the .fr contract, it specifically states that no one can play from the US, even someone vacationing in the US.

So does this mean we will see a time frame similar to Neteller payouts from this point forward (many months) or can it move faster than that?

This may have already been discussed, but has there been reliable conjecture of the amount of money owed to US Players Minus the money seized? I'm interested to know how much additional money would need to be seized by the DOJ in the form of assets to ensure everyone from the US is paid in full. Are there any other ways the difference could be obtained? Is it a FACT the the DOJ will use money seized to pay us back?

It seems like at this point we should have a pretty loose blueprint of how the rest of this is going to play out.

The estimate is $150m owed and c. $160m seized.

Remember to take account of the $122m of phantom deposits made by the US thou. Also, the seized monies date back 4 years, DoJ might have spent it by now; isn't it those guys that eat the expensive muffins?

Could be $38m net...depends on how the DoJ view it

You're saying estimates are the DOJ has seized 160 million and that US players are owed 150 million? How do phantom deposits play into it? Is that 150 million figure for all players, including those who deposited money that was never taken out? I'd be interested to know the balance owed to all US players if you take the current outstanding balances and THEN subtract deposits not taken out from players in such a way that they are left with a non-negative balance in their account.

So, if player "A" deposited $100 that was never taken out of his bank account and played his account down to $30, his account balance becomes $0, not -$70. Player "B" deposited $1000 that was never taken out of his bank account and he played his account UP to $2000. His account balance becomes $1000. If you did that exercise, it would be nice to know the sum of all balances in relation to money seized.

I'm having a hard time believing the DOJ would allow all these negotiations and anyone to profit from the FTP brand ever again unless everyone was going to be paid back in full. But, I'll believe it when it hits my bank account and not a minute sooner

See Vamoose, you change your avatar back, and good things happen!...lol.

Go on and derail this thread on more goddamn time with nonsense like patting yourself on the back for something you had absolutely nothing to do with.

See what happens.

JFC some of you people make me sick.

Wow does anyone else think pokerstars got hosed here and fulltilt held the us players as hostage?

1. Pokerstars promptly strives to refund players and makes it their #1 priority while funds are seized/frozen and will probally never be allowed to enter the Us market.
2. Fulltiltpoker makes stupid decision after stupid decision and the goverment then returns seized money and Howard Lederer, Bitar etc will probally never see inside a jail cell. Also leaving the doors open to reentering the us market?(just because they transfered the company to another shady person?)

Im glad you guys got your money but what is the Doj doing? Whos to say Tapei is not one of Bitar's personal friends and that they will own the company in secret laughing at the Doj?

I mean, that's all just conjecture right now. We have no idea and CAN'T have any real idea what will happen if/when poker is legalized in the US because it will depend on the laws that get set up.

I agree it would be a massive slap in the face both to PS and the players if the only company that has behaved in an honorable fashion in regards to repaying players and running a solid company (leaving aside the, um, money laundering and bank fraud they committed to serve US players to get around the UIGEA ) was left out while FTP was allowed in, but that's MILES down the road.

Seems premature to worry about that now.

I mean at this point FTP wont be what it was, the name of software will be the same but I'm not sure why the guy putting a ton of money to buy it and repaying players should start below stars.

If anything, Tapie & the bunch should be favored in the upcoming US market.

imO

Well, while the board may never see the inside of the jail cell, they also lost what was probably one of their biggest business ventures...in addition to the fact that their names are pretty much mud in the poker world right now.

There's also no guarantees that either will/won't be allowed to enter the US market in the future.

As Sgt. RJ said, a lot of that is just conjecture. Let's just get paid back and get online poker legalized here first...then we can worry about if Stars or Tilt will make it back here

Its ok im sure they will come to terms with the 50 mil each they stole from the player funds. The lobsters will keep coming. Russ Hamilton steals 10 mil + and never sees a day inside a jail cell and playing golf at a golf course near you and poker at a casino near you freely. Im sure Lederer will be eating lobster at a restuarant near you and playing poker at a casino near you soon 50 mil richer laughing and rubbing on his tittys. Note to your children crime does pay espicially in the poker world.