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Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt

10-21-2011 , 02:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by evildeadalive
that was my guess too
thats who i thought off at first
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 02:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahSD
I wish someone other than me would clarify this, but here's what PA said:

1) He does indeed have less than $100 in his FTP account. (Though I think he misspoke and said he has exactly $100... whatever.)

2) He's owed $500k by people that he transferred FTP money to a bit before June 29th. Some people might think it's reasonable for him to count that as money stuck on FTP, though it's obviously not quite the same thing.

3) He's owed roughly $5 million from people from other stuff. He thinks he'd be more likely to get paid if FTP paid back. I don't really think a rational person could consider this to be money that's stuck on FTP.

So, he doesn't have $5 million at risk wih FTP. He has $5 million in loans out, and he thinks that FTP repaying might help the situation.

Anyone doubting my information should recognize that Antonius confirmed it in the interview, btw.

WRT how I got the information, I'm obviously not telling.




I'm not really sure if I should have released this. I did it because he lied in an interview trying to make himself seem like much bigger victim than he is in this, and I thought that was really really ugly. I hate misinformation and lies a lot, so I corrected him.

I didn't realize at the time that it would be a big deal. I naively thought I could post it in the containment thread so a few of the die-hard FTP watchers would see it and know the truth, and that would be it. Obviously, I should have realized that Antonius is a pretty big celebrity, so a piece of info like that is going to get picked up. I obviously need to be a lot more careful about what I say on 2p2 at this point because a lot of people are listening to me, and I forget that sometimes.
Justr re-read the interview and your summation is correct as far as I can see. Clearly he doesn't have $5M stuck on ftp and in that regard he misrepresented his own situation. Its still possible though that he stands to loose quite a bit of money if ftp goes under.

I guess the problem I have with what followed from your post, is that what I (and i think many others) took from that was that he was outright lying. Where as in reality his view may very well be that he stands to loose $5M if ftp goes under, but I guess thats our own fault for jumping to conclutions.

Mvh
Inga
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 02:23 PM
I would have less respect for Noah if he hadn't revealed that information.

lol at random .25/.50 grinders worrying about Noah releasing your info

There are an exclusive group of individuals who have made millions off their association with FT beyond poker earnings. They were paid millions simply to add legitimacy to the site. I'm not saying Patrik was privy to the inner-workings, but he profited from their theft. To play the victim after that, he deserves to be slapped with the truth.

Patrik wasn't a 35$ an hour plus rakeback pro; he was one of the main beneficiaries of the entire operation.

If he loaned $5 million to other players, you can guarantee it was self-serving, ie to keep a game going, etc. To characterize that action as similar to those who can't remove money from their account is disingenious at best.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 02:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahSD
I wish someone other than me would clarify this, but here's what PA said:

1) He does indeed have less than $100 in his FTP account. (Though I think he misspoke and said he has exactly $100... whatever.)

2) He's owed $500k by people that he transferred FTP money to a bit before June 29th. Some people might think it's reasonable for him to count that as money stuck on FTP, though it's obviously not quite the same thing.

3) He's owed roughly $5 million from people from other stuff. He thinks he'd be more likely to get paid if FTP paid back. I don't really think a rational person could consider this to be money that's stuck on FTP.

So, he doesn't have $5 million at risk wih FTP. He has $5 million in loans out, and he thinks that FTP repaying might help the situation.

Anyone doubting my information should recognize that Antonius confirmed it in the interview, btw.

WRT how I got the information, I'm obviously not telling.




I'm not really sure if I should have released this. I did it because he lied in an interview trying to make himself seem like much bigger victim than he is in this, and I thought that was really really ugly. I hate misinformation and lies a lot, so I corrected him.

I didn't realize at the time that it would be a big deal. I naively thought I could post it in the containment thread so a few of the die-hard FTP watchers would see it and know the truth, and that would be it. Obviously, I should have realized that Antonius is a pretty big celebrity, so a piece of info like that is going to get picked up. I obviously need to be a lot more careful about what I say on 2p2 at this point because a lot of people are listening to me, and I forget that sometimes.
In my opinion the thing that stood out when you posted the balance originally was that it was in response to the interview where PA says he stands to lose a lot if FT goes down in a somewhat vague manner with little details. If he had claimed he has 5m stuck in his FT account id understand how its really ugly and all, but from his unique brand of english I never got the impression that if he has less than 100$ on his FT account then he must be liar. I'm sure in his own subjective reality he stands to lose a lot even if it was only losing future income.

So to me at least its more about the reaction being strong to a short interview where there was little to no factual information to begin with. I'm sure you know a lot more than I do but I still cant see how he is or was lying and trying to make himself look like more of a victim than he is.

It seemed to me that releasing the balance info would never accomplish anything other than create random theories and rumor, something very different from what you and S:P try to stand for. I guess it did flush out another interview from PA and the 5m of random loans story so people can speculate even more now.

Its just about high expectations you know, for you and S:P. And your post seemed to me at least to be pretty far from the whole 'news done right' idea, so its basically just feedback. The interesting part to me is how many people here seem to think that people who dare to comment on it are idiots and should just shut up. I mean I'm very aware that id never be able or even willing to do what you guys do with S:P, but at least in my eyes its something that should be open to feedback.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 03:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtySmokes
It amazes me that these guys can "afford" to loan their high stakes mates 6 figure sums. Patrik says he might have lost 5 million, but it's pretty incredible that he was happy to transfer 2.5 million to his friend (presumably Gus) when FT's liquidity was in question.
It's as if they were playing with Monopoly money. I mean, would *you* loan half your online roll to another player?
they basically were playing with monopoly money.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 03:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AKingdom
I would imagine it has to be Gus. I've wondered how much he (Gus) must have had stuck on FT when it went down. Gus probably accumulated this large debt to Antonius when he went on his huge downswing and then I'm speculating that later when he went on his multimillion dollar upswing, this money was not withdrawn nor paid back to Antonius but was rather left sitting in his account. I have no idea why Gus would have left so much money on-line considering he pays no tax in Monaco.
He says that if full tilt goes down that person who owes him 2.5 is TOTALLY dependent on FT.. I'm sure gus has enough in accounts outside of FTP to cover 2.5 million.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 03:37 PM
in bef NVG makes Noah the only person responsible of BF
manchrushed gonna mancrush
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 04:12 PM
It was probably Ilari. He was on the beginings of an upswing around then wasn't he?

sucks for all these HS guys. Imagine how much Ivey and Gus had locked up or even Galfond.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 04:16 PM
deleted

Last edited by tiltnonstop; 10-21-2011 at 04:23 PM.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 04:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChicagoRy
Yea, if I distorted my situation too and Noah called me out, I'd be pretty pissed off too. That doesn't make him wrong though.
I guess I take the amount of money I have and its privacy, both on FTP and elsewhere, far more seriously than you and others.

And Noah, being a respect journalist, couldn't have gotten in touch with PA's or his reps to find out what was going on before just posting his account details?

Also how did Noah saying that help anything at all?
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 04:48 PM
I don't get all the comments in relation to PA not having $5 million in his account. Or how its obvious loaning money is not the same thing as having money stuck in FTP.

For PA to loan Random Pro 200K, he has to have $200k in his account to transfer it. Had he not transferred this money, it would be in his account.

My instincts suggest that the combination of loans, pieces of other players equals $5 million. Just because this is not in his account and is loaned out to other players on FTP doesnt suggest that it is no big deal and that PA is not a victum. $5 million is $5 million.

I also am of the opinion that Noah has no business spreading private personal information. Doesn't matter what you think of the guy, doesn't matter if he ran over your dog, having access to said information was for other reasons; not to snoop and share private people's info. Sort of apologizing doesnt mean it's ok either.

Is it suspicious that an owner of FTP or rather a person of high regard has conviently emptied their account prior to the nuclear bomb, absolutely. Conspiracy minded or not, anyone is going to feel this is shady.

I am thankful for all the work the good people do but I am of strong belief that your efforts have to have limits. And quite frankly, releasing PA's personal account balance is of a God-complex mentality; no pun-intended. I think b/c this is FTP and many people across the land have money tied up, people thing that this is no big deal all things considered. But, if a local teller, b/c he or she didnt like something you did started releasing your account balance, deposit history to random people, I'm pretty sure you would be in uproar too.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 04:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalexand42
You idiots criticizing Noah for releasing information are unbelievable.

That's what good reporters do, they dig up facts that aren't available to the general public and REPORT them for the BENEFIT of the public. And they don't burn their sources.

The fact that they were red pros, endorsing and endorsed by the site, paid by the site, and likely could have had inside information makes them FAIR GAME.

Poor PA. Since he was paid/had ownership/etc... he was helping to cash those checks coming from player money. Did he offer to return that money like Durrr has?
No, PA complained that FTP didn't pay him more money in June -- after Black Friday.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 05:03 PM
why are you taking PA's word like its proven fact. he can claim anything, The fact is he had just 100 bucks in his account.
he was called out when he said he would lose alot if fulltilt didnt recover. alot doesnt=100. so he has to cover one lie for another thats impossible to ever disprove to save face.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 05:40 PM
Why is it hard to believe PA is owed 5million$ isnt he like 12million$ winner life time online?
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 05:57 PM
seems disingenuous (vid that is), but idk.

paging joe navarro... lol
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 06:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by molinn9
Why is it hard to believe PA is owed 5million$ isnt he like 20million$ winner life time at ftp?
fyp
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 06:31 PM
I feel kinda awesome that my FTP roll is in the same ballpark as Patrick.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 06:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by molinn9
Why is it hard to believe PA is owed 5million$ isnt he like 12million$ winner life time online?
Thats what I'm trying to figure out, we know how much money he has made, and he is also known for staking many players, so i don't see how this is hard to believe. Also why would he want to make this up, he has nothing to gain from it?
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 06:35 PM
lol at folks who feel naked in a nickel and dime home game without their HUD now yapping about privacy
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 06:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hamsamich
So with Tom this is now the second nosebleed player to confirm that their account was busto on BF.

interesting.
I have no idea about patriks knowledge of potential indictment or anything of the sort, but I will say that it is not out of the ordinary at all for either Tom or Patrik to have had 0 in their account. It is very common for a nosebleed player to keep less than 500k in their account, and then go and play 200/400. Especially knowing what we know now, that quick loans from FTP were easy to come by if you were a big FTP pro. I wouldn't read too much into the account balance until something more significant surfaces.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 06:40 PM
Here's a working link to the Cannes interview with PA. Contrary to what an earlier poster said, I think that PA sounds very genuine here.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 06:46 PM
Noah seems to be coming out a bit douchey in this to me. His "reporting" was a result of being pissed at PA's interview, doesn't contradict anything that PA said in the interview yet implies that PA is lying. Noah didn't mention trying to contact PA for a comment before releasing his "report" because he was too busy being pissed off and wanting to give PA the middle finger to bother with getting both sides of the story. Not exactly quality work.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 06:47 PM
Maybe it is just me but I am more concerned about the players as a collective rather than one person who lost money. Something tells me he is better off than most who has money stuck on FTP still.
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 06:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kailua
Interesting that you’re censorious of Noah for his initial release of relevant (and now apparently substantiated) information, while at the same time presenting an appeal for further proof. You might want to reconsider what you wish for.
no im not you moran, i've said nothing at all about noah or how i feel about his release of PA's account information, so stop putting words in my mouth
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote
10-21-2011 , 06:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shug_bomb
no im not you moran, i've said nothing at all about noah or how i feel about his release of PA's account information, so stop putting words in my mouth
moron*
Antonius Says  Million at Risk with Full Tilt Quote

      
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