I was worried people would be delaying vaccination of the AZ trying to selfishly game the system and get pfizer/moderna for themselves. The main defense ITT seemed to largely be that enough people would want AZ that they would not actually be delaying the vaccination rate, it was just a swap with our eager fellow Canadians being the one to get the putatively worse vaccine insteaad. I worried that with 24 million AZ shots coming, and only currently allowed in the 55-65 age group, that the day when this mindset is actually meaning we are delaying the population level vaccination rates would come quickly.

Quickly might be tomorrow. Yesterday a family member in the 60-65 age group got the pharmacy call they could get AZ shot on Monday. Any time, they were wide open. However, as BC just opened up mass shots for the 60-65 through the central (ie not pharmacy system), the family member has cancelled their Monday pharmacy appointment and is going to wait 3-4 weeks for the central BC Health shots hoping they get Pfizer. Now I'm only speculating, but given the wide availability on Monday and an expected torrent of last minute cancellations it is possible that literally this Monday we will have a day where all the available AZ doses are not being distributed to people. Hopefully not. Hopefully it will be another couple weeks before the selfish people manage to delay the vaccination rate for the rest of us.

I haven't been kind to Doug Ford's largely empty gesticulating through this pandemic, but I do appreciate his public show of getting the AZ Vaccine to try and help combat the disgusting vaccine hesitancy we are seeing in Canada. Again reading between lines a bit and speculating, I highly suspect the doubling to 1400 of the number of ontario pharmacies offering the AZ vaccine is highly related to this exact issue.

Well if you fear monger people daily for a year straight then don't be surprised when they're actually afraid of anything and everything. I don't agree with those skipping the az shot, but I'm not surprised in the slightest

These people in that age range delaying their turn for another shot are really not running the numbers. They have a much better chance of getting covid in that time than getting an adverse reaction to az

Yeah, I don't know if I quite agree with "fear monger people daily for a year straight", but there is something to the last year having had a detrimental effect on people's trust, and so it might be a bit simplistic to dismiss AZ hesitancy as being strictly selfishness.

It's not "AZ is bad, no-one should take it", its "Pfizer for me, AZ for thee". This is an inherently selfish act. We are all relying on a quick vaccination uptake based on the premise that millions or tens of millions of other Canadians will be taking the AZ vaccine (which is very safe and very effective!!). But some people are under the misguided belief that it is better for them personally to wait for pfizer than to get AZ at the first opportunity. En masse, this is very likely to cause delays in the Canadian vaccinations and ultimately the lives and economic costs that go with that, which means what might seem like a small act of self interest ends up adding up to big consequences.

That's the mentality you're talking about, yes; what I'm saying is that isn't universal. But I'd agree it's likely the majority of cases.

Hundreds defy montreal's curfew-breaking windows and setting fires

https://www.cp24.com/mobile/news/hun...area-1.5383480

Here is my question for you. So the consensus is yes the vaccine can cause blood clots and has killed people. Though the amount of people that have experienced blood clots is so small that the risk of catching Covid and dying is higher than the risk of getting the shot and dying from clots is what they are telling us.
Though would that not apply to those under 55 years of age as well? Why than are they advising younger individuals not to get the shot.

Though I do agree that if doses are being wasted because folks are not taking the AZ we have a problem.


Again you are speculating on this as well

They will but they want to take a slight amount of time to evaluate the data. The reality is that the perception of the vaccine is more important than the actual results. So, being able to take a few weeks and then assure people that the numbers have been crunched and the vaccine is safe will make people more comfortable taking it, and that's what we need to get this stupid thing under control and over with.

Though this NY Times article says its safe fore anyone under 30
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/10/h...ood-clots.html

Sadly your asking folks to trust the government and pharmaceutical companied who we all know never serve their own self interest. As well JT has secured so many doses of Pfizer and Moderna .....

Though with the onslaught of variants I am coming around to your viewpoint on this but I think it should be everyone gets a vaccine but no one gets to choose the brand not just folks over 55

Minor update: the family member did get the AZ today, and the pharmacist said they received 200 shots and 700 applications so that gives some current perspective on relative demand. Hopefully this lasts for a few more weeks in that case.

Its the same here they opened a mass vaccination center at the Expo Ctr in Edmonton 6000 shots a day and booked into later next week.

In the USA they suspended the J&J vaccine due to the same concerns

Most pharma companies also have practicing MD's working on their products, all of whom take an oath on their first day of med school to 'do no harm'. I don't know many docs but all of the ones I so know take that very seriously.

If the goal is to get everyone then I don't think the 'shopping' is too much of a concern, because if someone in an eligible group wanted to get Pz vs AZ I'm sure there'd be plenty of takers for the AZ shot in their place. As was pointed out, the demand is still heavy and well outpacing supply. And based on numbers from elsewhere if we're vaccinating as many people per day as they're reporting then the cases counts are going to start dropping pretty quickly here soon.

We have our first case of a blood clot in Quebec.

As well USA media slamming Canada on Covid CNN to boot

https://thepostmillennial.com/watch-...-incompetence/


Nice to see Chrystia Freeland say " Covid has created a window of political opportunity"

Lolcanada

So this is what happens when a teacher/snowboard instructor runs a country with a bunch of people hired because of their gender rather than competency.

We can point to all sorts of issues caused by a teacher/snowboard instructor running a country, but our lack of vaccines isn't really one of them, as it isn't his alone to bear. Not even close. I don't think we've had major vaccine production in this country since the 80's.

You're debating with shifty and lozen. You've already lost

Something to make everyone feel better...

Canada Ranks No. 1 in 2021 U.S. News Best Countries Ranking

I'm pretty sure "U.S. News" is the consensus leading authority on best countries in the world, amirite?

100 % correct other than he banked on partnering with the Chinese company to make vaccines. No other party would have delivered vaccines quicker or slower. Chances are they would have all done the same job. As well I know Andrew Scheer would not have implemented federal policies as well. He would have told us to pray more.

I just thought it was funny that CNN that worshipped our woke prime minister now tossed him under the bus.

Canada is a great country as per the rankings I am not sure if I would have it at #1 but top ten for sure. Though Justin is sadly in my opinion destroying it. As much as Trump was not respected by world leaders I doubt Trudeau is respected much as well
Uke loves him and many others do as well but I just never see him gaining a majority government in the future


Not really I am open to any argument and Uke changed my opinion on a few things . Just because we do not agree with your position ......

I really hate these slippery half-truths that always need to be slapped down. Yes, Trudeau - probably correctly - reached out to a Chinese company about vaccine productions, an approach that didn't ultimately work. But it nonsense to imply "he banked on [it]". They had an extremely multilaterial approach where every and any avenue to sign deals was seemingly explored, and ultimately they signed 7 companies ordering more vaccine than anywhere else in the world. This is partly why when even with two of our ordered vaccines seemingly faltering (AZ and J&J), Canada will STILL be able to meet and likely exceed the september target. They didn't bank on any one strategy the way other countries like australia did that is now backfiring badly. The insinuation that they hurt Canada in some way by considering one option that didn't even come to fruition is pathetic.

But lets be fair and post the whole comment. I have given JT the credit on vaccines he deserves in many posts. I still am critical on his federal leadership overall with regards to lockdowns and covid relief

I can't evaluate your counterfactual of how other leaders might have done. But I CAN all utter BS on your claim that he "banked on" the chinese one. That is just not remotely true of a statement. This was one of many, many options they explored and ended up going for a highly diversified strategy that didn't bank on any particular vaccine candidate.

Yeah I would agree banked is not the best word. I would say his first option might have been better. That would be his only mistake I can see on the procurement of vaccines. Did it impact the delivery not at all just a waste of CDN tax dollars

So basically the plan was to go with several options in case one didn't work out, and that's somehow being spun as a mistake? Am I reading that correctly?

Partnering with a Chinese company was a mistake when you factor in China's treatment of Canada and the two Michaels. If we got no vaccines and gave them money would that be a mistake? Kind of like investing 1.8 billion $$ in a pipeline that there is a good chance will be cancelled by the new president .
Though I can not say how much money was invested by Canada in this partnership due to a lack of transparency from Justin Trudeaus liberals

FROM a Global article

https://healthydebate.ca/opinions/ca...e-partnership/