plus chez do you even know that the vaccines have no normal permit yet?
they still have a temporary permit only. that status was never changed. it can't since it was rushed. it's not according to all vaccine guidelines that existed.

We're not going to agree.

I really dont think you should take so much heed of what some doctors said on tv. There is ~nothing some doctors wont say on tv.

I have heard such things. I dont know why it should bother me at all. It doesn't.

he is debating with other doctors on the tv show. they couldn't discredit him. so it's all most likely true. he is a famous doctor who cririze other doctors and writes books. I would show you but you would have to understand german.

you should have. the vaccines are all on a temporary permit. that makes sense since they were all made under rushed conditions. so they didn't pass through all normal phases what vaccines morally have to through. most phases like trials got rushed even manipulated according to this doctor. this is big money big pharma and they are famous for this kind of disregard for safety. huge money. you would have to very naive not to believe this.

Why wou;ld you need to discredit him. He is just a doctor. If you care what doctors say then I'm pretty sure they arei n favour of the vaccine. They have been discredit either and some of them even speak english

Personally I dont much care what the doctors say as any sensible doctor will readily admit they aren't remotely expert on this.

oh I misread your post. you heard it.
yeah it bothers me a bit too much to disregard it for me. it's still too much conflict of interest. but then again better have something than nothing here. I just don't think I should take it.

Ok. I worked in the clinical trials industry and I strongly approve of the expedited process and am not remotely worried about it. I'm not a medical person so do not take that as medical advice.

I've no idea what could have been done that would change your view. Exxcept maybe many decades of real llfe data but that's not an option.

It's too staggering unlikey that the data in the NHS/etc in the uk were faked for the benefit of big pharma (even if we allow they would behave so criminally as to fake the data on something so high profile). Plus all the other major countires with their own independent research. It's just way out there. You're grasping so hard at such small risks.

these numbers can not be mistaken.
every man on the streets should understand what they mean.

it's so easy I don't know what's not to believe here. 0.8 % have strong side effects from the vaccines most likely more since there was a trend in relutancies of no reporting.
that in itself is very discomforting to me and it cries foul play, especially when you consider they promised no side effects. which was impossible btw.

yeah I find it for you in English.

"However, for Dr. Jeffrey Lazarus, from the Barcelona Institute for Global Health (ISGlobal), the "end is not in sight yet".

I think this is more about politics than public health. After each wave, they make a new suggestion. Earlier it was the outdoor face masking, now it is to stop counting and stop testing," Lazarus told Euronews"

Spain on going endemic.
https://www.euronews.com/2022/01/18/...-to-an-endemic

and it says the jab is very dangerous? or that the disease isn't nasty?

I think we can all agree that the situation is better than it was. A change of status might well be justified but that's not an argument against getting vaccinated.

and why do they make it so hard for us to research this?

I just kept punching in 0.8% strong side effect and you know what I get? nothing! it's almost impossible to find something. they are covering their tracks and I mean literally. what kind of business ethics are this? I tell you what I think this seems very wrong and covert, as if they try to downplay it. that's typical you knoe?

we know of many cases of damages to the heart, myoncarditis, and other side effects but they hide these facts. what's up with that?

I found this though:

Why is it so hard to investigate the rare side effects of COVID vaccines?


https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-00880-9

no it says the jab is dangerous to at least 0.8% and these are younger people I think in the range of 18 to 50 or something. those get the strong side effects at these rates and some of them even died of the vaxx. of course this get burried again by the media and pharmas.

where does it say that?

and it's always hard to research rare side effects. That's also true of the not so rare side effects of a nasty illness.

You do accept that recovering from fairly serious illness might still leave some problems?

Chez,

here is the problem, the vaccine is basically, from my understanding
forcing your body to create antibodies. So its basically the virus
in itself that you are getting shot. Some people, and thats mostly exlusively people from 18 to 50 are getting strong reactions to this,

mostly that the body reacts with strong anti immue responses.

The system just goes nuts and destroys itself. Thats whats happening and whats concerning. People died from the vaccine and its much more than it is reported. I find that outrageous in itself. They should be honest and not lie.

That should be common knowledge if you pay attention imo. Like I said doctors are talking about it now on live tv.


And yes its especially hard if they only report a fraction of the real side effects and make it hard to research anything. And then they downplay it all. But as is now happening the truth comes out. Fauci is playing dumb and gets exposed by rand paul etc. Things are etting uncovered now slowly due to this idiocracy. I mean you have to admit that it was mental what they did in some cases and it was heavily politized and not following science so much in many cases. Such as natural immunization, school closed, old people left to die without company of family, etc etc.

And I think this is worse for those certain people than the virus alone. It obviously is here, its making the whole body fight itself to death. No kidding or exaggertation. The vaccine is programming the cells to fight the body and take it too far in those cases.
Again this is only 0-8 % or more and only people in this range of age,
but it is something to consider and its getting downplayed. It ranges from syptoms of long covid, mycon, unableness to perform, etc etc. The range is similar to people with bad outcomes to covid and permanent lasting damage from covid. Only it is on people who were normally super healthy and not being of risk of covid itself. you know? why take the risk for them? Its the same as for kids. Why why why?

Do u have any credible data about this ?
Vaccine been around a long time with profound success .
why would this particular vaccine be more dangerous then any others, especially for a virus according to you, that is even less dangerous then other illiness where vaccine works wonder ?

usually science gets better over time but in this specific case u disagree .
So the evidences shouldnt be hard to find since it would be so much out of the normal results.

I've paid a lot of attention. You're relying on your common sense understanding. It's an ok starting point but a very bad approach to drawing scientific conclusons.

Sure there are unknown risks. there always are. This is true of not beign vaccinated as well. Research, especially into rare effects, is going to take a lot of time and may nevrr be fully resolved because the data is very messy and they're rare.

Its not so difficult chez, more and more cases are getting linked to the vaxx alone. How is that not a scientific conclusion? You have the vaers database telling you this. It cant get anymore scientific imo.

If someone dies shortly after getting shot the vax and was superhealthy there is an undeniable link to exlusivley the vaccine, and those are getting reported now. Same with the lasting and bad side effects, they make up thoese numbers. And there still is a lobby that is trying to hide this and its sad. Namely bc they earn from the pandemic or dont want to stick out.

I heard if this was a normal vaccine it would have been taken off the shelf by now. The nubers of side effects is too high. But its not a normal vaccine, its for emergency use, and not under a normal license.

Yes I have database of vaers.


Of course you can find these cases.. The so called derps are bombarding you litereally with those cases. Look up athletes dead after vaccination in example. Of with lasting damages.

Ok I dont think that's science. Not remotely.

The database has some use as a starting point for some research

you are right there is a big problem here, the people know what caused it. The victims and the relatives and anybody looking at this objectively knows the vaccine did this. And then you have the doctors attesting to this, that this was a vaccine reaction and nothing else. Then you have pure science my friend.

I think you almost never exhibit an understanding of anything you talk about in this Forum.

btw chez, you have already cases reported that make it certain that the vaccine caused these deaths and permannent side effects.

The doctor only has to attest that this was undoubtfully this and its not that hard to attest. if you get sick with something unormal shortly after the vaxx, there is nothing really to argue anymore.


I think this database is pretty good, and not only indicitive.