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PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]**

03-15-2012 , 03:24 PM
Thank you for the reply.
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 03:28 PM
Please give your thoughts on the advantages and disadvantages of a time charge for playing internet poker instead of rake?

Obviously varying with the stakes.
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 03:39 PM
Did you actually even answer anything in tht message? Lol, hardly one response. 'Cant comment', 'Not going into that', 'will tell players if new software is coming out', 'can't comment'.. lol.
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03-15-2012 , 03:40 PM
p.s what about adding games in GBP? - (always ignored in every thread - being husng and software one heh)
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03-15-2012 , 03:46 PM
Any chance pokerstars will stop with the sng rakewhoring? I personally feel it hurts the games very much on many different levels. When I was a casual sng reg before BF, I would play the $16s instead of the $27-38 level because I made $0.20 less a game post rakeback and there was no point without SN.

What is the point of playing midstakes if you are not a rakeback pro? Why is it that crappy regs will make the same per game as me in the $30 level despite the fact I would make 4-5% more per game prerakeback? Is killing the games really worth a little more rake?

Dont get me wrong, I love pokerstars, and find your site to be the best among the sites. Does it really take another company stepping upto the plate for stars to do the right thing here? If there were another site with anything close to similar volume in midstakes, I would play there at least 1 day a week just to give you another competitor. I understand this is a simple business proposition, but it would be nice is stars held themselves to the higher standard they claim.

Basically I think your team should take a hard look at the viability of play without rakeback for all sng games vs with rakeback. Hypers are likely to be worse in this regard, GL for sne, doomswitch for everyone else.

TYIA and sorry if this comes off wrong, it is genuinely meant to be constructive criticism.

Also, thank you very much for capping tables for the people playing too many tables. This is definitely a step in the right direction.

Last edited by Regret$; 03-15-2012 at 03:54 PM.
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 03:51 PM
Do you think Pokerstars will be adding or subtracting more online pros in the coming year?
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 04:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Jones
So, we're not going to discuss rake, rake changes, dealt versus contributed, or any of those kinds of issues here. Those topics have been covered in excruciating detail elsewhere (in threads such as here and here). We have engaged our customers at an extraordinary level on this subject and continue to do so (including flying representatives out here this week and next month). Having spent 34 years in the professional workforce, I can assure you that this level of engagement (and financial transparency) is unique, perhaps unprecedented.

But more importantly, it ills-serves everybody to allow that single topic to hijack every conversation between us and our customers. So we're not going to do that.
Do you not find refusing to respond to rake questions kind of like ignoring the pink elephant in the room?

In that thread you linked to ( http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...012-a-1145272/ ) where rake was covered in "excruciating detail" and customers were engaged at an "extraordinary level", Steve made a grand total of 10 posts after his OP - most of them having nothing to do with rake issues. Does that really qualify as "excruciating detail" and engaging your consumers at an "extraordinary level" to you?

Speaking of "engaging your customers at an extraordinary level on this subject and continuing to do so" here is Steve's position from the more recent thread on rake (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...012-a-1159146/)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerStars Steve
....

Thanks to all who have participated in these discussions about rake and VIP Club changes over the past few months. Player interaction and feedback continues to help us improve the world's largest poker room.

I do not plan to participate regularly in this thread going forward. However, these discussions will continue with players both on these forums from time to time and in regular meetings on the Isle of Man.
In other words he is refusing to discuss the matter anymore and if people want to continue the discussion it will only be done behind closed doors, in private and only if you're willing to fly out and spend a week of your time on the Isle of Man and submit to an extremely strict nondisclosure agreement. Extraordinary indeed!
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 04:11 PM
There is a time and place for:
  • a public forum
  • private meetings with player representatives
  • company decisions and action
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 04:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by VP$IP
There is a time and place for:
  • a public forum
  • private meetings with player representatives
  • company decisions and action
I completely agree. However his post led me to believe he may not be entirely up to date with what's been happening. The reality is that Stars has provided extremely little in the way of feedback and they seem to be using these player meetings as little more than an excuse to ignore the issue: "Oh that's interesting - bring it up at the next private player meeting [in 'x' months.]"

I wouldn't be posting here if not for the fact that I really respect Lee. He has a great reputation in the community and I can't imagine he's just working as a mouth piece for Stars using public relations double speak. I think it's more likely he genuinely just hasn't been following what's been happening lately which is certainly no fault of his, it involves thousands of posts from players and tweezing out and interpreting the handful of evasive and vague posts from Stars reps scattered about in those threads. I don't think he would call what Stars has done as engaging players at an "extraordinary level" through "excruciating detail" had he been following recent happenings, or even if he realized that in the thread he keeps linking to the Stars rep only posted a total of 10 times (less than once for every 200 posts from players) - with most of his responses having nothing to do with rake issues.
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 04:38 PM
Hi Lee. I also learned a lot from your Limit book, and believe the advice within remains relevant, so you shouldn't feel old and past it just yet.

Are you temporarily wearing the "Head of Poker" hat? Pokerstars has been advertising that job opportunity for a long time, and it strikes me as a little odd that the vacancy has apparently not been filled. If it has, who is the "Head of Poker"?
http://www.pokerstars.co.uk/about/careers/#HeadofPoker
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03-15-2012 , 04:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Do it Right
<snip>
Your points are valid.

I imagine that rake decisions are made by someone else, and only after the revenue projections have been exhaustively analyzed and challenged.
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 05:11 PM
Lee,

Plo has been gaining a lot of momentum and populairity as a game. How do you view this will go in the future? Do you think average skill level of players will increase a lot next years?
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 05:39 PM
Lee, the auto sit-in feature (or "never sitout") on software like tableninja and other ahk stuff is really common and really well known. I'm a little surprised you had never heard of it.
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 06:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Jones
[*]Timing out and auto timing back in. I'm not aware of such software, but I'll find out about it. That would appear to be on the hairy edge of legit, but I'm sure we've got an official ruling on it (if such software exists).
Lee, you are showing your age...
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03-15-2012 , 06:33 PM
when are you gonna start hosting the FTs of the sunday mill again?
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03-15-2012 , 06:37 PM
Are the 0.01/0.02c zoom tables going to be 100bb or 250bb max buyin?
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03-15-2012 , 07:00 PM
do you think it is fair to run games that are unbeatable due to extortionate rake. 50 PLO an below are getting raked at 20bb/100. As am sure you know that means you would need a win rate greater than this to show profit. What are your thoghts on this Lee?

Or are you just here to answer the nice easy questions?
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 07:03 PM
what will be the highest stakes you plan to release , 2-4nl?
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 07:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MicroBob
Lee, the auto sit-in feature (or "never sitout") on software like tableninja and other ahk stuff is really common and really well known. I'm a little surprised you had never heard of it.
Age and disconnect from most recent third-party software apps acknowledged. I have been aware of Table Ninja, but not its full feature set. I'm also aware of AHK scripts; again, I didn't know this was a feature they could employ.

Thank you for clarifying that; I can now ask my colleagues questions and not sound quite so stupid.

Best regards,
Lee Jones
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 07:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by KiWiKaKi
what will be the highest stakes you plan to release , 2-4nl?
This. And approximatively how long does it take to fully test a new feature (mainly in order to reach that stake)?
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03-15-2012 , 07:16 PM
Are you guys planning on implimenting LHE for zoom?
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03-15-2012 , 07:33 PM
Thanks Lee for answering my questions. I have to say though that calling a ps moderator is definitely a "cop out". If you want to depend on mods, then just employ them. Having volunteers in a multi-million(billion?) dollar turnover business seems just lol.

Regarding the auto-timebank software, as mentioned above this is standard for most multi-tablers. The way i see this is one step from auto folders, which is one step from auto limpiing in etc. It is the forerunner of automatic software for me.

On another point i would like to say that most of the issues raised in this thread are probably from winning players, or at least people that make profit from the vip system. The points that they raise are probably salient, but you (and they) would be far better off listening to the issues that stop the losing players returning to the site.
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03-15-2012 , 07:39 PM
How long will a player be allowed to act in Zoom and how long will the timebank be when activated?
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03-15-2012 , 07:42 PM
slightly confused as to the actual purpose of this thread since most of the questions I'd want to ask a stars rep apparently belong elsewhere, but Lee's already managed a Monty Python reference so I'm sure his general awesomeness will make it all worth reading anyway.
PokerStars Roundtable  **[Updated 15-Apr-12]** Quote
03-15-2012 , 07:58 PM
lol raking 20bb/100 at micro plo and giving "recreational" players 4x more hands per hour means theyre gona lose money 4x faster. Please do something about the rake at plo
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