I do, if I book a win and my cashout includes a few scraggly $1 bills. Selfishly, I get more enjoyment from tipping the cage because they seem to appreciate it more, because it's less common for them to get anything.

I think his point is that the fact that they talk about it like it's just assumed some large sum of money is owed to them if it hits is indicative of exactly the attitude he hates. That's the kind of thing people make arrangements about only when a large sum of money is involved, like splitting a lottery ticket.

I would counter this by saying they know what the standard has been up to now, so they can make a pretty good prediction of what they'd get. It's not necessarily indicative of presuming they're owed a share; just that they expect a similar share to what other dealers got.

I have found that to be the prevailing attitude in poker rooms all over the country.

Some dealers, however, take it one step further: they expect your expression of largess to be free. I number of years ago I hit a small BBJ (small because it had been hit in that room just the day before, apparently). It took a while for management and security to do their thing, holding up the game until they were through. I asked the supervisor what dealers in this particular room normally averaged, tip-wise, per down. I also asked what was the customary jackpot tip for the room.

After I got paid, I walked over to the dealer as he was getting up from another table (this was 90 minutes or so after the BBJ hit) and held out three times the what the supervisor told me was the average tips per down. I figured I was compensating the dealer for lost time (i.e., tip income) plus a bit because I'm a nice guy. He looked at me and with a straight face said, "That's all for that size jackpot?"

Ordinarily, I'd tell him not to complain about free money. In this case, I knew that he was simply expecting more, based on what the supervisor had told me earlier. I replied, "You're right. I'll give you 5% of the jackpot. First, give me your social security number and address so that I can send you a 1099 at the end of the year."

When he realized that I was serious, he told me to forget it, he wasn't going to pay the taxes.

Can you believe it? He'd rather have nothing than a couple of thousand to avoid paying a few hundred in tax.

I think most people would tell you to forget it rather than give you their social security number and personal information for a gift you could withhold the taxes yourself. Can you even 1099 a toke?

You don't ask someone for their SS# so you can "send them a 1099" at the end of the year. If you happened to be a business (which you probably are not), and hired an independant contractor, you would ask them to fill out a W9 form. This has nothing to do with a bbj. They are taxed on that money when they get paid.

If you are too cheap to tip them out of your taxable jackpot I am sure an accountant can show you the correct way to write it off.

he let you off too easy because if it was me I probably would have told you to go **** ********...

It's a douchey statement. Which followed the dealer's first douchey statement.

Y'all are missing the point: he expected a large tip and acted as if he was entitled to it. Was I an ass in response? Yes, absolutely.

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Ok, so basically your 1099 line was BS?

I'd be curious to know exactly how much you won on that BBJ and how much you tipped because I can't imagine tipping a dealer and then having them tell me "That's all for that size jackpot?" And then he tells you to forget it?

To which I would say, "Okay, and consider yourself tip-free from me from this day foward."

Admittedly, I'm sure if I ever hit a BBJ I would tip an amount that dealers would be pleased with, but, that doesn't mean that they are entitled to an extra large amount, it just means that players like myself are too nice when it comes to this subject, because in reality, the dealers have contributed nothing to that BBJ drop and therefore should not expect to receive the dollar amount that they think is owed them. Nothing but a couple of hundred bucks is owed them, and when you think about it, $200-500 is more than fair.

Whatever my opinion, I can't imagine saying anything except "thank you". If I'm seriously working in a room where I have to rely on that one rare monster tip to offset day after day of bad tipping, then I'm working in the wrong place. I'd much rather have my regulars treating me well on the 999,999 other hands I deal, rather than stressing over that 1-in-a-million hit where I got unlucky and hit the wrong guy. Just saying.

q/q

where do you people work??
if you are bitching about the dealers let us know where you work .
im sure most of you dont live off tips if you did you would shut up
if you do work for tips let me know where you work so I can
come treat you like crap make your day miserable and stiff you !!

You are why containment threads are necessary.

I hope you don't live off tips, with that kind of personality. If so, I can see why you're so bitter.

But then you would have gone from getting some tip, to no tip, to being fired. But, at least you'd have your pride!

No one told you that part of working for tips means sometimes you'll get stiffed and sometimes people will treat you like a king so it all averages out?

You sound like just because you work for tips that people should just tip blindly because working for tips is tough. Sorry, but it doesn't work that way; your customers didn't force you to take a job for tips.

I received approximately $20k and I gave the dealer $200. Based on what the supervisor said, the dealer likely lost approximately $30 waiting to be able to resume dealing, so I thought it fair. As you say above, the dealers don't contribute to the promotions pool and (in a non-crooked game) don't purposely deal the "right" cards, so I don't understand why they have any expectation, much less a substantial one.

Wow. Vitriol like this is why we have a containment thread, I guess. It's too bad that ad hominem arguments are ineffective, or I might get upset.

Much earlier in my life I did make a substantial portion of my income from gratuities. I was smart enough to not deliberately insult, berate, or otherwise belittle my benefactors, also known as my customers. No matter what your business or how your money is earned, if you piss off your customers you'll soon have no income.

The best dealers whose tables I have occupied over the years had the following traits in common: they said very little beyond what was necessary to run the game; they were quick, accurate, and knew the rules of the game they were dealing; and they said "hello," "goodbye," and "thank you," at the appropriate times. In other words, they did their jobs professionally. Those folks get tipped by me, every pot I drag, even just the blinds. The exceptionally professional get another tip from me when their down ends, regardless of the outcome of my play during their down.

And I'd have $200 more in my pocket, giving you nothing. That seems like a fair trade to me.

Unless of course I was upset enough to return your petty gesture with one of my own: speaking with your supervisor. But I'm a reasonable man and am usually willing to let it go, especially if you look like you're still wet behind the ears. In that case, I may seek to teach the customer service lesson in a manner that doesn't threaten your job.

Dealers are usually good about not talking about their expectations on their tip if they deal out a jackpot. Most [good] dealers will say the company line of "I am appreciative of any tips." But sometimes you catch them and they will say something like "Bill dealt a bbj yesterday, $120k to the loser, 60k to the winner...and he only got $2k!"

It's no surprise that dealers hope to deal the bbj, in hopes of a good tipper giving them a good payday. The flaw is they think that high tip on the bell curve of tips should be their normal tip.

but didin't the supervisor also tell you what they expect to be tipped from the BBJ

The standard is usually 3%. you tipped 1%, the dealer should have gladly taken the money. But the speech about the taxes and asking the dealer for his SS# was so uncalled for imo.

In my regular card room the jackpot hit a weak or so ago and the big winner stiffed the dealer (jackpot was 450K). That is all everyone has been talking about ever since in disbelief. Don't be that guy.

So you're saying that one should tip ~3% to avoid social exile?

$450K jackpot.
Big end (40% ?) $180K.
"Expected tip", $5,400

$5400 is a rather expensive "deodorant", if that is the motivation for tipping.

If one has other reasons for tipping on a BBJ, then it might not be that expensive.

No one else in the room should even know how much the dealer was tipped for the BBJ. The card room should make it against the rules to make it known.