Moving Up Stakes, 2015 and beyond - Page 71 - Poker Blogs and Goals -- Two Plus Two Poker Forums

My transition as a player was pretty similar to everyone else's...

At 5nl when I started I was probably running like 25/15/3 or something then went to be like 24/18/5 then transitioned to be something like 30/25/12

08-12-2016 , 07:26 PM

#1752

meale

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 9,768

30/25/12 would prob get you into a bit of trouble if you weren't playing mostly anon tables I'd guess?

08-12-2016 , 07:43 PM

#1753

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,133

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

30/25/12 would prob get you into a bit of trouble if you weren't playing mostly anon tables I'd guess?

I play like 27/21/8 on solid tables and maybe even a little tighter..... loosen up a bunch with fish.

08-12-2016 , 07:44 PM

#1754

meale

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 9,768

Ahh, cool. Interesting. :3

08-12-2016 , 08:34 PM

#1755

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,133

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

Ahh, cool. Interesting. :3

You should open a wider range with whales behind, and also call more too.

08-12-2016 , 10:02 PM

#1756

meale

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 9,768

This is common wisdom but I'm not entirely convinced by the theory behind it. I like to wait for strong made hands vs fish/whales before I look to play against them because I don't have the luxury of fold equity and thus piss weak visibility in the vast majority of spots.

08-12-2016 , 10:37 PM

#1757

cheltNAM

veteran

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 2,204

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

This reasoning may be ok on normal tables but it's stupid in zoom, you don't get to sit with them for ages so you need to put yourself into more positions to play for stacks when you have good equity rather than just a good hand.

08-13-2016 , 02:55 AM

#1758

Mzbourg

banned

Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 6,670

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

Poker is a race to the whales/fish' money. You play like this you will be losing these races very often.

08-13-2016 , 05:56 AM

#1759

meale

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 9,768

And if you play ****ty hands just for the sake of playing with a fish, you'll be frustrated a lot when they own you.

Ofc I have no experience at reg tables lately but agree w chelt that it's harder to go aftet fish at zoom w marginal ****

08-13-2016 , 07:25 AM

#1760

TheDefiniteArticle

Indecisive

Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 14,123

We open a hand when it's +EV to do so, and the EV of opening every hand is higher when there's a chance of getting into a pot with fish because they're going to make big mistakes postflop. Opening tighter with fish behind is just silly (caveat: if there's a dude 3b jamming 100bb or something silly then opening slightly tighter is obviously correct).

08-13-2016 , 07:58 AM

#1761

meale

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 9,768

Quote:

and the EV of opening every hand is higher when there's a chance of getting into a pot with fish because they're going to make big mistakes postflop

It's not autoprofit. You need to hit a flop, make a hand, hope said hand is actually stronger than fish's hand, have it hold, etc.

You open 9To from the CO because there's two fish in the blinds. BTN folds, both fish call.

Flop is A89r

You are never going to print money here unless you get lucky (and villain doesn't get luckier).

08-13-2016 , 08:43 AM

#1762

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,133

Logic is pretty bad.

a weak reg and I'll open T9o in co btw.

08-13-2016 , 08:51 AM

#1763

meale

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 9,768

Can't see this being +EV at all.

08-13-2016 , 08:57 AM

#1764

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,133

So just grinded a bunch. Got in about 2600 hands at 100nl reg.

+$9

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL.

Ran like crap. Lost tons of pots with KK/AA and sets. Only reason I was able to rustocko was some huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge whales on a couple of my tables. Like.... the kind of whales you dream about. Calling 25x pre with Q9 kind of whales. Unfortunately didn't make much off them but oh well.

08-13-2016 , 08:59 AM

#1765

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,133

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

Can't see this being +EV at all.

That's because you are a massssssssssive nit.

JTo is a pretty standard open in CO, maybe if there was some super aggro 3betting going on and very good players it'd be slightly negative EV.

Weak players = widen range = play T9o.

I play T9o in CO as default in almost all my tables and if I filter over 400k hands it shows profit.

08-13-2016 , 09:06 AM

#1766

ChipsNcrisps

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 4,946

Quote:

a weak reg and I'll open T9o in co btw.

yes, finally. lol

08-13-2016 , 09:11 AM

#1767

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,133

I'm up $7.89 over 575 hands of opening T9o in CO if I've filtered correctly. This is very close to breakeven which makes sense since it's the bottom of my opening range on most tables. But, this hand obv. becomes more profitable with a whale in blind = easy open.

08-13-2016 , 09:50 AM

#1768

Clanty

veteran

Join Date: Oct 2015 Posts: 2,686

I open 89o co vs fish behind me. Weaker the players the more I open. I found myself opening K5s from utg the other day vs 4 super fish and a standard fish (super fish being the fishiest of fish lol). At first glance it's like wtf, but then you realise you're making like 30bb/100 vs 4 of the players and it becomes pretty +EV

08-13-2016 , 10:00 AM

#1769

meale

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 9,768

You guys must be good at hitting flops/bluffing vs fish :|

08-13-2016 , 10:38 AM

#1770

TheDefiniteArticle

Indecisive

Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 14,123

here's the thing... if we flop 3oak, we'll stack a fish way more often than a reg, and they'll stack us way less often than a reg when they do. Just stuff like that over different boards.

08-13-2016 , 10:57 AM

#1771

Clanty

veteran

Join Date: Oct 2015 Posts: 2,686

It's not about all about hitting flops or bluffing fish. The way I look at it is the skill of maneuvering within your range vs specific player types. As TheDefiniteArticle says, in this instance, we make more than we should vs fish, thus the EV is increased meaning we can open more hands.

08-13-2016 , 02:37 PM

#1772

Mzbourg

banned

Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 6,670

Quote:

Originally Posted by meale

I mean this example is just such pain. Jesus christ. It is one of the simplest concepts in poker. Not sure why you are arguing this.

08-13-2016 , 03:35 PM

#1773

Clanty

veteran

Join Date: Oct 2015 Posts: 2,686

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mzbourg

I mean this example is just such pain. Jesus christ. It is one of the simplest concepts in poker. Not sure why you are arguing this.

All about merging bro

08-13-2016 , 04:12 PM

#1774

ChipsNcrisps

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 4,946

what's with all the merging?

08-13-2016 , 04:58 PM

#1775

Brokenstars

Verified Coach NLHE

Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 16,133

Yh I will also open 98o with fish behind, but generally never open 87o for example in co.

As for UTG I will expand to K8s/K9s with whales in blinds, but table would need to be pretty soft to open k5s

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