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Anyone want to have a formal debate? Anyone want to have a formal debate?
View Poll Results: Do you want to participate
Yes -- For the atheist side.
11 50.00%
Yes -- For the theist side.
11 50.00%

06-02-2013 , 01:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeaucoupFish
Freteloo, apologies for the indelicate wording of my suggestion: I had in mind that Catholicism does not rely solely on the Bible but places great importance on the Church / tradition etc (ahh yes, "Sola Scriptura" - thx OrP) when I said "plain" Christianity!

While most of the potential debaters I am sure could do a good job for either side of the chosen topic, for certain topics I like the idea of keeping the debaters on the same side as their actual beliefs, for the possibility of their getting sucked in emotionally and having their hearts trampled on as well as their intellect and ego .

I like the idea of having a fixed number of rounds, so it doesn't devolve into a hue and cry as it proceeds, and also like the idea of the submissions being made concurrently. To mimic time limits as in a live debate, word count limits would be a good way of keeping the debaters on their toes and not boring the audience to death in an Aaron / uke style marathon.



Also, I nominate zumby vs old prunes debating the topic "There is no evidence 'I' exist"
Yes, freteloo would also be good. Second zumby vs. old prunes on the divisibility of identity.
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06-02-2013 , 02:05 AM
I don't mind whatever format is used. I just want to lol at theists.
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06-02-2013 , 02:51 AM
Well I initially said I would be happy to debate anybody BUT Aaron. Although on second thoughts I am mildly curious as to the results of such an interchange in a highly structured format. But still, less interested than debating most others. Aaron gives me lots of action, but only at CAP PLO. I'd rather some deep stacked NLH. And while it is often hard to get action from the theists, there are more than few rather overvalued atheists here too
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06-02-2013 , 04:41 AM
I'd be happy to provide biblical/historical minutiae to either side, but I don't want to be a debater myself. I still think a role-reversed MB vs. noober-match over the reliability of biblical arguments or w/e would be pretty awesome.
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06-02-2013 , 05:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Original Position
Yes, freteloo would also be good. Second zumby vs. old prunes on the divisibility of identity.

Anyone but zumby. Otherwise it will just descend into inconsequential pedantic philosophical verbiage.
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06-02-2013 , 05:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jokerthief
Let's make the debate question this: Is it more rational to believe in a theistic god or to not believe in a theistic god.
Well almost everyone would consider me an atheist, however I think for many people, maybe even most people on the planet it is rational to believe in a theistic god. So I am not sure where I would stand.
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06-02-2013 , 08:19 AM
I'd like to see this happen but I vote against the theistic vs theistic subject suggestion because I think it could only benefit me from a 'learning how to debate POV'. I would have little interest in the content of arguments regarding who's version of something I consider to be a fantasy, is the 'better'.

I'd like to see a debate on whether or not religion has had a net negative effect on our development. It encompasses several arguments that I'm particularly interested in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fretelöo
I'd be happy to provide biblical/historical minutiae to either side, but I don't want to be a debater myself. I still think a role-reversed MB vs. noober-match over the reliability of biblical arguments or w/e would be pretty awesome.
Always nice to find out people think I'm an idiot.

Last edited by Mightyboosh; 06-02-2013 at 08:25 AM.
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06-02-2013 , 09:11 AM
^^that wasnt really the reason for that suggestion.
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06-02-2013 , 12:06 PM
As far as the debate topic is concerned, I think the most fair way to determine the topic is if the two debaters decide the topic. People who voted itt voted for my suggestion. Some may not want to debate a new topic we pick for them.

Also, the time deadline that I chose is not going to work. We need more time to iron things out is appears.
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06-02-2013 , 07:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Original Position
Yes, freteloo would also be good. Second zumby vs. old prunes on the divisibility of identity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cwocwoc
Anyone but zumby. Otherwise it will just descend into inconsequential pedantic philosophical verbiage.
wooooosh
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06-03-2013 , 06:47 AM
I'm down I'd do either side.
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06-03-2013 , 10:46 AM
Quote:
As for participants, my strongest preference would be to avoid a Aaron W. vs. uke_master debate.
AMEN.
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06-03-2013 , 11:05 AM
Most of the debate topics put up for consideration have been done to death here, and quite frankly, are going to bore to tears.

How about a debate related to...


The Trinity (JW position debated).
Muslim vs Christian view of Jesus.
The existence of miracles.
Jihad in the quran.
Gen 1-3 and evolution (yec vs evolutonary creationist).
Pre vs post-trib.
Jewish vs christian view of Jesus (using ot scriptures).
Cessationist vs glossolalist.
Prosperity gospel.
Pascal's wager.


Basically anything besides what will amount to a snooze-fest, as two participants contend endlessly over definitions and philosophical minutiae.

Last edited by Doggg; 06-03-2013 at 11:21 AM.
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06-03-2013 , 11:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doggg
Basically anything besides what will amount to a snooze-fest, as two participants contend endlessly over definitions and philosophical minutiae.
I imagine the format would prohibit much of this. If we are mirroring typical live debate format it would be something like:

- Opening statements
- 1st rebuttal
- 2nd rebuttal
- Closing statements

Enforced word counts would also help (probably something like 1000, 600, 600, 400)
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06-03-2013 , 11:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by fretelöo
I think I'd be much more interesting (and instructional -- at least for them personally) is if people chose to argue for the opposite side of what they actually believe.
Leaves open the 'take a dive' strategy. Lose the debate, claim victory for your ideas.
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06-03-2013 , 06:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doggg
Muslim vs Christian view of Jesus.
Could be a good one.

Also, are there any Mormons around here?
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06-03-2013 , 07:12 PM
Sounds interesting!

I share the opinion that persons should argue for the beliefs they actually hold. I think it makes it more exciting and personal. That said I think Orp would be persuasive and entertaining on either side.

Topic Suggestions:
1. Secular humanism v. Christian morality
2. Is Christian belief rational?
3. Net effect of Christianity +/-
4. Does life have meaning in a theistic/atheistic universe?
5. Was Jesus resurrected from the dead?

ps. not claiming the above ideas were all mine, I know some are repeats from others posts. Look forward to the debate!
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06-04-2013 , 04:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LEMONZEST

Topic Suggestions:
1. Secular humanism v. Christian morality
2. Is Christian belief rational?
3. Net effect of Christianity +/-
4. Does life have meaning in a theistic/atheistic universe?
5. Was Jesus resurrected from the dead?
I vote against a focus on Christianity, or any other specific religion.
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06-04-2013 , 07:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LEMONZEST
Sounds interesting!

I share the opinion that persons should argue for the beliefs they actually hold. I think it makes it more exciting and personal. That said I think Orp would be persuasive and entertaining on either side.
I vote against OrP. He is very verbose and incoherent in his arguments. We need someone with a sharper mind.
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06-04-2013 , 04:41 PM
Yeah, let Hector Celif (or whatsisname) dazzle us with his spear-like logic.
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06-04-2013 , 06:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyboosh
I vote against a focus on Christianity, or any other specific religion.
Topic of intelligent design vs. evolution debate would be interesting too
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06-04-2013 , 06:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LEMONZEST
Topic of intelligent design vs. evolution debate would be interesting too
I'm not so sure. Maybe it's because I've been reading some Dawkins again but the idea of intelligent design just seems so easy to refute.
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06-04-2013 , 06:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husker
I'm not so sure. Maybe it's because I've been reading some Dawkins again but the idea of intelligent design just seems so easy to refute.
I'm against such a debate. The way I see it going down, things quickly fall apart because of the size of the gap between the idea of design and any sort of empirical measurement. I haven't look at it in several years, but from what I saw, people just weren't able to bridge the gap in any meaningful way (despite their best efforts).

I should add that I'm in *favor* of the idea that design can be detected. Philosophically, the idea of intelligent design is not unreasonable. However, the absence of a meaningful evaluation mechanism creates an insurmountable barrier for the affirmative case for ID.
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06-04-2013 , 10:03 PM
Incidentally, while I am definitely down with this, I will wait until July. Hence why I have not proposed topics yet.
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06-05-2013 , 03:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LEMONZEST
Topic of intelligent design vs. evolution debate would be interesting too
But that's focusing on Christianity again. I'd much rather see a broader topic such as whether or not religion, in general, has had a net negative effect.
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