Little high on your estimate, but I agree. You can pretty much be set to retire in 20 years barring unforeseen circumstances.

Dude 28 and 120k a year? I'll take your job if you don't want it. That's really good money.

150k a year as a ceiling is way more than enough to live life comfortably

Personally I don't see the appeal in retiring early. I'd rather work past retirement age - you just have to work at something you find interesting. I'd also rather have more money than most people in my 20s and 30s than in my 50s and 60s.

You don't have to retire though. You can work a satisfying job/project/whatever. Financial security is a very good thing.

What would you do to spend more money than he already does? AFAIK he travels, doesn't act like he's busto, etc.

fryke what other options would you be considering if you did leave your sales job?

it doesn't sound like you have any other options directly presenting themselves. if i were in your position i would continue this job that you enjoy, making much more money than you're spending, especially with the state of the world economy. just keep increasing your savings, taking advantage of wise investment opportunies, and try to build the right connections. connections are more important than actual experience on a cv, and given your current positon, i think yoy have the ability to be patient and wait for those connections to present themselves.

rather than forcing your way in at the bottom somewhere else, why not just wait for the right opportunity to present itself to skip the queue and enter at the middle?

I don't see the distinction. There is being stupid with where you are just wasting money on stupidity but there is no way living on $45k you are not sacrificing quality of life.

These jobs are not hard to get but they do require that you have the right aptitude. Not everyone has the right personality for sales so for some people it is natural while others would have to adapt a completely different personality. Doing it when it isn't natural for you is probably very tiring.

The worst though are people who don't have a natural personality for it and don't at least force themselves to act that way -- they make no money and are usually fired in under three months maybe six.

The problem with doing sales past a certain age is that for most industries not only is there a relatively low ceiling compared to where you started but you also start to decline. When I 50+ person comes in as a sales rep I see loser when a 28 sales guy comes in I don't. I'm much more likely to do business with the under 35 sales guy than the over 35 and since your income is performance based you start to slide down and make less.

Also being in sales regardless of how much you make is still a job that society frowns on. It is like being in the service industry. There are people in the service industry making way over $100k even over $150k but people will show some middle management guy making half that more respect.

Lastly there is the stability issue. Having 60-80% and in some cases 100% of your income performance based in fine when you're young but it doesn't work so well as you get older. This is especially true when your performance is heavily dependent on the company you work for being good at what they produce. It is also subject to industry changes. Imagine being at Pitney Bowes -- their reputation is **** and their main product line is serving business mail which is in fast decline. If your good at sales you could switch to a different company in a different industry but as they new guy you'll have the ****tiest region.

This is my attitude. When you get the most out of money is when you are younger and earning less. The idea of saving money at 28 if you make less than $100k seems absurd to me. The older you get the more you earn but the less important money becomes. There is plenty of time to save then.

Those jobs are not hard to get? 120k in 20s is an easy swoop?

Lol so out of touch with reality. How does nobody see that the biggest troll is Henry since he is always saying others are wrong and he is always right on every topic. Seriously, all his posts are correcting somebody and people like 3Bet are just wondering how a likely homeless dude posting in the library is viewed as an authority on every topic

It depends what you mean by it. Actually getting the sales job isn't that difficult - as the-fryke said he just had his degree and little work experience with a huge gap in his résumé. Being good enough at sales to make 100k+ is the difficult part.

No. You are wrong. I don't know about Australia, but I'm guessing that is an aberration case. I work in the sales/marketing field so I am knowledgeable. The key here is 60k Base for a sales job. That means 60k regardless of how much you do or don't sell. You think it's easy to get people to cough up 60k guaranteed to a schmuck regardless of what he sells or his abilities? Sure buddy. Half of 09 graduates wouldn't be unemployed or underemployed if you could just pull that job out of your ass. The average for a bachelors is around 40-50k for someone that age and you think nobody had discovered that sales jobs can pay 60k BASE plus commission? Lol really

And sales jobs with 60k base many times the AVERAGE rep makes 100k total comp

There not. A lot of these places have a really high churn rate because most people suck at sales so they are constantly hiring. The competition isn't hard because most people don't want to sell. Most people would rather take a job paying much less that didn't involve sales than do sales. Putting together a good sales force is one of the most challenging things for a business so if you can sell you can get a job anytime. The job is revenue generating and your compensation is based on performance. Under what circumstances would a business not be interested in this?

For a base that is a bit higher than average but what the base is doesn't really matter.

If you have a high base you'll have lower commissions so for people who have an aptitude for sales you'll be worse off.

For people who suck at sales having a high base just means you get fired faster than if you have a lower base. The base isn't just free money. You're expected to perform at a certain level and if you don't you're gone.

There are companies where I swear I have never seen the same rep from twice. Every time someone comes in the there has been a change. I can tell they are not coming back because they are not really good at sales. They usually last between six weeks and six months but very few make it past three or four months.

I missed the part where he is making 60k base, you are correct in that those jobs are not "easy" to get. However, sales jobs with the potential to make 100k (obviously with a lower base salary) are not difficult to get.

Either way...it's not like some schmuck is going to keep his job if he's losing the company money. If he's not performing up to his base he will be let go and they will find someone else. I don't work in the field so I may not be as knowledgable as you but I've known people who get sales jobs with a base like that and they basically need to sell enough to clear the base. While they are still getting a steady paycheck even struggling it's obviously better than a low base with high commission but they'll be let go fast if they suck.

No. The high turnover you are talking about is not anywhere near that common at 60k base salaried sales positions. That is why they are not easy to get. You think these companies are eager to piss away 15k + benefits and hiring costs & time to any schmuck just to see if he works out? You are living on another planet.

60k base jobs most often require minimum of 2 years of documented sales success. And that base is often found in sales jobs such as medical devices or pharmaceuticals or experienced roles. Most entry level sales jobs are 30-40k. You prove yourself at those then you move on to the next level. Unless if you know someone, Henry, I would lay 100 to 1 odds on a bet that you couldn't land a 60k base salary job unless you have any documented sales experience I am unaware of. If you do, "those jobs are easy to get" is misleading. Most likely I think you are talking out of your ass again though

Sales jobs with potential to make 100k either have strong base salaries or no base salaries at all such as insurance sales or any 1099 position. Those positions are obviously easy to get because you are strictly paid on a commission basis, so the company loses nothing but a bit of time and minimal resources if you end up sucking as a salesperson.

The whole point here is Henry talking out of his ass saying 60k base salary sales jobs with 100k+ on target earnings are easy to get. Not that "sales jobs with the potential to make 100k+" are easy to get. And for the record, of those jobs that have that potential through 1099 full commission compensation basis such as insurance sales, only the very elite percentage end up making 100k. As I said before, most people with 60k base salaries jobs make 100k+, at least I feel like the average rep does given how heavily they screen in order to dish out a 60k base. That's not candy money to hand out

3Bet,

If you're just talking about getting the job w/ 60k base, I agree with most of your main points.

I was under the impression we were just talking about someone who is a great salesman in their late 20s making 100k+. There are def sales jobs out there that aren't hard to acquire with that kind of earning potential, but they require elite skills.

Agreed. There are salesmen like that with jobs that are easy to get but where few will make that kind of dough. But To make what Fryke is making with a 60k base salary is not that uncommon or elite for the individuals that can land that position to start with.

Since it is a relatively diff position to land and he is killing it, I strongly advise he just milk it (or another similar sales role If he gets bored) for as long as possible and live frugally to save up to start a business. Or he can listen to the advice of pompous a-holes who think that to live off 45k a year is to live like a homeless man who needs the libraries for internet and computers (ironic). You need to live at least of 70k to have a decent quality of life.... Right????? No.

I'm just surprised he has the willpower to do that. It's one thing if you're making 45k you obviously get by but he's saving like half his take home, that is remarkable.

Meh, he makes a grip more than I do and I save 40% of my take-home. I also had a gf for the majority of the year and live in 2 miles from Hollywood blvd. A penny saved is a penny earned I always say, I live a good life without needing to get crazy with bottle service and expensive BS I don't need

Please leave 3 bet

Dude you own diamond earings and a movada watch

Right and I didn't say anything about $60k base jobs. I said it is easy to get sales jobs where you make over $100k.

The sales people I know who make more than $100k all have bases in that range. I would say $35-45k. I doubt any of them have a $50k base. They still make over $100k and these these type of jobs are easy to get.

Using me as an example is really bad because I know enough owners who I could just ask for a job so you'd lose this bet but only because of angle shooting.

If you read my posts I said getting $100k sales jobs are easy. I said multiple times that most people who get these jobs will not make that kind of money and will be gone in a few months. I even mentioned that the compensation is mostly commission. Maybe you should get less worked up and actually read what I said. Outside of really specialized industries where you need a degree to be credible selling the product it is hard to come up with examples of $60k base jobs.

The watch was a gift and the ice was a little over 2k from a few years ago. Hardly breaking the bank. And dude you are arguably the biggest troll on all of 2+2 non-poker related forums, there isn't even a debate on that it's just generally accepted as gen knowledge in threads like online dating lol

Why do you keep saying I live like a homeless man? My rent is 57.6% of what you claim is your pre-tax income.

After adjusting for the fact that you likely lied-- people making $75k don't make statements like $30 is enough to spend on a gift for someone you're dating-- and after taking off taxes I couldn't pay my rent with what you make so really you sound like an idiot.

Yes please. How much trolling does someone have to do before they're banned?

Don't forget I'm in AUstralia, so this is not really comparable to US. The median income in Melbourne I believe is 60k. Minimum wage is effectively 40k (I think it's actually like 30k, but I've never met someone on less that 40), bartenders make like $25/h wage etc.

Also, this job is somewhat an exception and is exactly what Henry describes in the post below you. Turnover is extremely high, most people last <3 months. I've been there 13 months and of a sales floor of 30 people only 5 people are still there from when I started. There's probably been more than 100 people come through. However job security for myself is rock solid. The job is extremely easy to get, it's just that you you will probably be fired within 3 months. They recently just hired 20 people, most of whom suck, and about 10 are getting fired in the first week of the New Year. It's a churn and burn place, but for whatever reason I actually genuinely enjoy it.

Job is like this, base is "repayable" in that you only make commissions on top of your base once you have covered costs, however you have that base as a floor. Base used to be 45k and people lasted 3-4 months on probation, now people seem to only last 1-2 months due to higher costs.

Appreciate all of the comments people, still have a few to read, but will quickly chime in on investment property: I have to buy at least one because mum doesn't own a house, so it's not really for investment purposes, it more just doubles as this. She will be a reliable tenant for 15 years then retire and have rent free living. House number perhaps needs more thought, but I figure I could just hold it for 5-10 years with rent almost covering mortage and then flick it down the track

Re other jobs: There are tons of jobs in Melbourne where I could get a ~50k base with OTE of 100k, but my concern is I wouldn't be good at them. I'm not actually very good at selling, but I can work long hours and have good customer service/am professional which are the main requirements for this job. It's quite an easy sell (solar systems for residential properties, TV ads/product itself do most of the selling). I'm very good at my current job but I'm objective enough to realize this would not automatically translate to other sales jobs, hence my reluctance to leave.

Re income: I feel like 45k is a decent amount to live on. That's living off 100% of your means after say 401k/super contributions on a 70k salary. I just happen to make more luckily. I need to buy a new car shortly and at 30 will probably reevaluate my living situation (currently have flatmates) but apart from that I live relatively well. Planning on only dropping 30k on a house deposit for a 1BR apartment for mum, so this year will have 15k+10k tax return (2 years combined) for new car, then life is pretty much set imo.