Tens of thousands of player have played large field tournaments for the past year plus when Covid was raging far more than it is now, and no venue has implemented the sorts of measures you suggest and no venue has been deemed negligent. The scenario you put forth is not completely out of the realm of possibility, especially in the times we live in. But why should anyone accept it as anything but a fringe possibility at this time? Again, your entire line of argument is that the current set of policies does not make you feel safe and you want the powers that be to implement other policies to satisfy your sensibilities. Fair enough. But your judgement is not sacrosanct. You can complain about it. Debate it. Scream about it all you want. Those who do not feel the same way you do have valid arguments too, even if you are too blind to acknowledge that.

Ok. Ignore many months of data if you like. That sounds like a reasonable scientific approach. But what explains the rapid drop in cases and hospitalizations the last few weeks? If I were the WSOP I’d be pretty optimistic about recent trends in LV. Is the delta variant taking a time out? I’d love to know what the theory is. Maybe ask one of your experts and let me know.

I don’t think you know what the meaning of the word “objective” is. Or “personal”, for that matter. And if you think you’re safe/not safe because some group of people tells you you are safe/not safe, then you clearly have no idea how safety standards come to be. Do some research on it. You’ll find lots of the bugaboos you keep throwing out to disparage the WSOP… stuff like profit motive, negligence, acceptable loss, risk tolerance, etc. it’s really kinda scary when you see how the sausage is made. I assure you your sense of safety is almost entirely based on your own perceptions and understanding of the world around you. Those things can certainly be easily manipulated by others, with good and bad intentions alike. But they are still your own perceptions. IMO you should take pride in having ownership over that instead of so willfully and carelessly giving it away to others.

BTW, human beings cannot fully explain the phenomenon of gravity, but they can predict it’s effects a heck of a lot better than they can Covid. Think about that next time you start deciding you know what the difference between belief and understanding is. The reality is, most of what you think about Covid falls into the realm of belief. That is the way it is for the vast majority of us.

You misspelled "its." Anyone who misspells a three-letter word can't credibly masquerade as an authority on anything.

Your report of a "rapid drop in cases and hospitalizations" um...lacks credibility as well. That's probably a more charitable way to put it than "is utter raving nonsense." Fortunately, decisions will be made based on what is, not on what you wish for.

So they're saying if you are confirmed within 6 feet of someone who is Covid Positive for 15+ minutes they can boot you from the event (i.e. even if you have no symptoms yourself and aren't sick).

But if you happen to have gotten the vaccine and show no symptoms you can stay.

No Symptoms & Not Vaccinated - Booted with no compensation

No Symptoms & Vaccinated - You Can Continue Playing

But I'm pretty sure I've read that those who took the vaccine can still be infected and act as vectors of transmission. So you have the vaccine, show no signs of illness, but you're still spreading the virus to others around you.

Just more silliness like the one-way aisles in grocery stores, plexiglass for the cashiers but not for the baggers, etc.

A bunch of half-measures meant to make it look like the people in charge are "doing something" while only providing an illusion of protection.

Just cancelled my trip last night, not gonna go through a multi-day tournament only to have the Rio decide I was near someone who had Covid and now I'm eliminated because of it.

If you're vaccinated but nonetheless carrying the virus, you wouldn't necessarily be showing any symptoms. They obviously don't have any way of detecting or stopping that--it's not like they'll be willing or able to test everyone daily.

If you're fully vaccinated, they won't boot you from the tournament, no matter what, unless you're showing symptoms and test positive. If you would test positive (because you're inadvertently carrying the virus) but show no symptoms, you'll be able to continue. It's only in the scenario where someone else shows symptoms and tests positive and you are determined to have spent 15+ minutes near him AND you then test positive, that you would be booted.

I agree that they shouldn't let in anyone who isn't vaccinated--period.

With these rules, you'd hope they enforce a mask mandate for all tournaments regardless of the state policies.

I know I won't play in anything less than an N95/KN95 to avoid catching anything

That would be the responsible thing to do, but it would be -EV. The current rule allows them to allow unvaccinated to enter, giving them rake and increasing prize pools. Then they can DQ half the field because they found somebody with covid in the poker room and a lot of people were unvaxxed. This saves them a lot of money on dealers, and the vaccinated still in the tournament make more money. EVERYBODY WINS!

I will be attending WSOP . My only purpose to go there is to play WSOP .

I will take any steps to protect against the virus by myself. I will only be attending WSOP if I agree with all the safety steps WSOP is putting forward.
I know I only can do what is in my control, that is to attend or not. Any way I will be playing on their turf.

So far I didn’t see anything which will make me stay home .

I don’t pretend to know everything as I don’t know everything.

I will trust all the precautions advised by the medical experts.

There is nothing wrong if someone make suggestions in favor of or against the WSOP rules . It’s individual choice.

I will never say WSOP doesn’t know how to run their business! As I have never manage a business grossing over million and more than 4 employees.

WSOP is multi billion $$ business with tens of thousands employees. And CZR is business for profit corporation and will look for what is best for them.

Let’s keep discussions civil and constructive and enjoy what we all love “WSOP”, either playing in it or following from home.

Good Luck

I don’t think there is anybody on 2P2 who is a credible authority on anything. Perhaps even poker . Be that as it may, I am reporting information which is readily available here:

http://covid.southernnevadahealthdistrict.org/cases/

I don’t think you know what any of the words “credibility”, “utter, “raving” or “nonsense” mean.

Really on the fence about going. I’m leaning yes with the rule clarification, plus huge overlays will be sexy. Not looking forward to 12 hr mask days and the s**** show this is sure to be.

Can you find an example of anyone who has been DQ’d from a tournament without a fair arrangement in the last year+? If so, I think that would be useful information to give people an idea of what sorts of circumstances they might have to deal with. If there are no examples, then isn’t the hoopla over rule 115 really just much ado about nothing?

I really believe if the WSOP felt that they would find themselves having to DQ lots of people, they wouldn’t brother holding the events. It’s not worth the bother and/or ****-storm which that would cause.

Great Point . It’s like Jaywalking laws . It’s there but only used in extreme situation. I don’t remember one instance where someone was ejected from the tournament. There may have been some instances but never came across.

Another factor people aren’t taking into account is, vaccine verification is not a simple process. In order to be done correctly it requires time, money and training of staff. And if the process fails somewhere along the way it opens up the WSOP to legal attacks. And even if it doesn’t fail, there will be instances where vaccinated people cannot get through due to paperwork issues or whatever, leaving angry customers.

All in all, I just find it hard to believe the WSOP would take on such a challenge without it being mandated by the governing bodies (NGC or state). And if that were to happen, I would not be shocked if they just decided the WSOP as scheduled would not be worth the trouble.

I have some anecdotal evidence of players showing symptoms being asked to exit. But there was always some sort of arrangement made (getting back part of buy-in minus rake or something). It’s clearly a case-by-case sort of thing, but I honestly don’t think it’s that big a deal, given how rare it is. If it becomes a big deal at the WSOP, for whatever reason, I will have been proven wrong. But I feel like, let’s cross that bridge when we get to it. If people are really concerned about this possibility, the really, they probably shouldn’t participate. There are plenty of other things to take into consideration which would seem to be more important and/or likely to occur.

I attended May/June Venetian series No one even checking body temperature. On the contrary I visited Parx Casino in July, there were two security officers checking body temperature with a remote device.

That's a little depressing, but I'm still holding out hope that they'll enforce the rule strictly. It would be a benefit to all players if they did so.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/harrah...-vaccines/amp/

Harrahs in New Orleans has started requiring vaccine or negative test. Some Vegas casinos are also considering this.

I'm ok with this requirement, but still think taking money from the unvaccinated and then politely asking them to leave is the best option.

If vaccine verification was mandated by the government, which it should be, it would almost certainly cover mere entry into casinos, not specific events like the WSOP.

They should have plans in place for what they will do if such a requirement was added mid-series.

Currently masks are not required in St Louis County Casino's (Hollywood) nor in St Charles County (Ameristar) Casino's for patrons let alone proof of vaccination. The Casino's follow the local and state laws/ rulings. I am unsure of the St Louis City Casinos as they no longer have poker rooms. Employees are masked. I suggest you send your opinion to WSOP if you choose to. As to Government mandate of vaccination while there are specific Federal exceptions (Military recently as an example) the preponderance of all legal opinion is that it is NOT within the powers of the Federal Gov't to mandate vaccination for the general public short of the declaration of a national emergency. Private business has a much greater latitude in this regards.

Venetian checked body temps with a camera at every entrance up until the state relaxed its regulations. I don't know if body temp monitoring was ever required by the state, but at that time I remember Ballys checking for hotel guests only at the front desk entrance only. I did not see temp monitoring at general entrances in any other CZR property. I doubt you will find any Vegas casino still doing this, though I obviously wouldn't know for sure. I, too have not been there since mid-June.

Without getting into the question of "should", as that would undoubtedly be a political discussion, I really don't see how this suggestion would be at all tenable. The hotels might have to close some of their entrances in order to maintain control. You see them do this during New Years and other times when increased security is needed. And in the remaining entrances, crowds would be enormous. Not only would this be a huge fire/emergency tragedy waiting to happen, but a major turn-off for guests. If you were in vegas last winter like i was and saw what a nuisance waiting 15 minutes just to get on an elevator was, you would understand how this sort of control on a large scale just doesn't work. There is just no way a hotel is going to monitor its visitor's vaccine status. At checkin... it may be a possibility, but then you're not considering people who aren't staying there, so what's the point? You're just losing customers and gaining no real safety.

The WSOP could make vaccination a requirement in order to enter an event. But that brings in all of the logistical/legal issues I mentioned in my previous post on this topic. And then they would have to bar anyone who isn't an entrant from even being in the room. Again... more control they probably do not have have the wherewithal to implement. If they try it, it will undoubtedly be nothing more than window-dressing. Maybe that's enough... but like I said, it really opens them up to get in trouble from a litigant or even the NGC.

I wouldn't count on it, but I guess we'll just have to wait and see. The problem with this sort of thinking is obviously everyone has a different idea of what safe means, and what is the "proper" action that should be taken in response to some circumstance. If they DQ someone who shows obvious symptoms and/or a positive onsite test, that might be enough for some. But others might want them to do full contact tracing. It would quickly escalate to an unmanageable situation. There comes a point where either large groups are going to be allowed with few, or easily-implemented restrictions (like masks) or they aren't. At this point, they are being allowed with few restrictions, and the sorts of restrictions some people are looking for just don't seem to be realistic.

There are two supreme court cases affirming a government right to require vaccinations:

1) Jacobson vs. Massachusettes https://www.oyez.org/cases/1900-1940/197us11

2) Zucht v. King https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/260/174/

These were state and local laws that were upheld. I don't think the case of a federal vaccine mandate has been looked at. Point is, if the state of Nevada or the city of Las Vegas wanted to fine people for attending crowded events while unvaccinated, they would have the power to do so and Caesar's Entertainment would have to comply for the WSOP.

This appears to have been done to comply with local laws... per the article you referenced

It comes as New Orleans Mayor LaToya Cantrell announced a new vaccine requirement for many indoor activities starting Aug. 16 that includes indoor dining and bars and other indoor entertainment. You will need to provide proof of vaccination or a negative PCR test if you are 12 or older for any activities the city deems as having a “high transmission risk.”

As you properly point out STATE LAWS have this precedence - the original OP referenced a FEDERAL MANDATE and that is where the legal rub lies and what my comment addressed. Currently the last I read the Nevada Gov has said he has no plans to make such a requirement OF THE GENERAL POPULATION although state workers fall under a different directive. Who knows what the legal position of the elected officials will be in a month (or two)

You are correct in your assertions. I also think the existing case law, thin as it is, would face some serious challenges should a Covid vaccination mandate case come before the Supreme Court. The Massachusetts case revolves around an infectious disease which was some 30x more likely to kill a person (even more so for children) than Covid. And still, the decision was limited to the ability of a local jurisdiction to impose a vaccine mandate. And the second case held up the ability for a state to mandate vaccination amongst school children. Both of these allowed for exceptions and neither came anywhere close to the scenario where the government tried to mandate the entire population become vaccinated in the face of something like Covid. IMO, this is obviously a different situation and would set a very dangerous precedent.

Anyhow… back to the WSOP. Assuming there is no random large spike in cases or hospitalizations, my guess is the fervor over Covid countermeasures will die down over the next month or two. What will be interesting is to see what happens come late October and beyond when cases are bound to rise again. Some will blame events like the WSOP, completely ignoring the history of this virus. Others will simply look at things taking a turn for the worst and again raise the alarm bells and call for measures like vaccination mandates.. I think best case scenario is next winter is a better version of last winter, but still nowhere close to business as usual. If all goes well, maybe this time next year we can all say things are pretty much like they were pre-Covid. Of course we will be heading into an election in the US at that time, so the idea that we might have some reasonable discourse about Covid is probably wishful thinking. Frankly Covid is more likely than not to become an even bigger political football in a year.

The casinos have a financial incentive to figure it out. Some sort of technological solution involving a phone app that requires less human checking of proof seems to make sense.

I would like to put the casinos in a situation where they will come up with a solution that can be applied to elsewhere.

Some restaurants are now requiring proof. Lollapalooza ran in Chicago while requiring proof. Concerts and sporting events are moving towards requiring proof.