the last time this came up soah posted a pretty reasonable argument for it being +EV to do as a vanillager, IIRC.

What happened the two times it didn't work?

Not if you're doing it every time.

I knew I needed some sort of caveat on that but I couldn't remember the details well enough, so I figured you could just correct me.

I thought the argument was intriguing as I recall but I've never taken it up because it didn't seem like it was worth annoying everyone :P

I believe the vanillager claiming was lynched.

That doesn't even count as failure.

Scoot is correct. They were lynched anyway. So it didn't cause any drama. But I don't know... I can deal with what soah is saying - it's a weapon to be used sometimes. But when I see it in 3 straight turbos, I don't think that's good, personally. Not that I have any calculations or anything to back up my feeling on this. I think I'm just in line with well named here - I'd feel really selfish and horrible if I got the actual seer lynched.

So I guess if this is a weapon that some people want to utilize at times, then I'd ask that they please factor in whether or not they think the other wagon is a likely seer or if they feel really confident about the other wagon being a wolf. Meh.

if I had claimed seer on d1 of the hydra game it would have made you want to lynch me more, rather than getting kokiri lynched :P

hahahahaah yeah

the only reason I was so so so close to switching off you was that you DIDN'T claim seer

There was a really bad stretch in turbos like a month ago where the seer was lynched d1 heaps.

People don't believe claims anymore, and all the vanillagers claiming is just making it worse IMO. Its a tool to be used infrequently, not every time you're wagoned.

It seems to be an awful play because you are massively increasing the chance the seer or the seer's peek will be lynched. The seer will never peek you n1, if the wolves don't kill you either then it's essentially impossible not to get lynched in the game and mislynches become much more antivillage after d1 in a turbo.

There's really no reason to play "like a seer" as a vanilla villager. Don't try to fade lynches based on soft or hard seer claims. Don't try to protect your "peeks" from getting lynched beyond how you'd just normally defend them. Pretending to have knowledge you do not have is rarely pro village; I don't mean fake peeks, fake PR cover, etc, I mean ACTING on fake knowledge.

If you disagree: PyramidScheme. He's the worst WW player, period. No debate. Read any of his games, they are equally as bad as the others. And this is exactly how he approaches every game.

Cliffs: just play WW

Always claiming vanilla is the best strategy iyam

I suck at turbos but I think that FPSing as a villager is completely unnecessary and it's especially harmful if you are a vanilla. Others have brought up the fact that you could end up lynching the real seer.

That's probably right, although I claim seer as seer every time. I think I maybe go too far outing myself not to get my peek lynched as well. I claim in those spots a lot. Feels leaky. Usually I just try to shove my agenda hard as the seer so I don't need to worry about it and my goal is simply to have two living peeks d2.

Another leak is I don't even really try to not act like an outed seer with 2 live d2, I see too many times where everyone is trigger happy placing votes and it's just titling. Almost certainly has to be correct for no villagers to even consider voting in the first 10 minutes of d2 in a turbo. I lol every time it goes to maj as ifthat ever helps anything.

yeah d2 of turbos i basically dont vote until there is like 3 minutes left in the day

I have outed as seer when I'm the real seer in the past. Worked for me most times
I have also FPS as the seer and left fake peeks to catch a wolf and it worked wonderfully,
Basically I had two wolf people in my sight, both super sketchy and acting similar so I peeked one and obv booom wolf n1.
So next morning instead of outing my real peek I said I peeked the other guy wolf.
Everyone was like what but that real wolf I peeked just ended up outing himself and trying to protect the wolf I peeked since it was a power role lol.
I told villa in middle of the day I actually peeked player b wolf and me saying player A was wolf was a way to just get both with one peek.
Lynch one vig other boooom both wolfs, peek a new player and profit

The more people fake claiming the more real claims won't be believed ldo, another downside. I could see scenario's in long games where a fake claim is a good play but it all requires right time right place play it by ear, even then it's always best to be soft claiming. If you've been running an elaborate soft claim throughout a game and it makes the wolves spend any amount of time thinking about it then you're doing good work. There's no need to fake claim just as there is no need to really claim. Werewolf always is more important than cover.

As a wolf you should definitely be leaving a a trail in MM's especially and in the event you think you've left enough of a trail to pull off a play where you can help your team do it. Wolves who claim tend to be bad at leaving these trails, it's not hard to do either. Fake claims as a wolf in MM's can straight up win games & run trains on villagers because of how villagers just believe everything surrounding claims and stop playing werewolf entirely. I honestly don't think a highly coordinated wolf team leaving strong trails of cover for all sorts of things would ever lose a big game where they're managing to snipe seers ldo.

I believe this to be the first turbo ever run on 2+2:

http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/show...fpart=all&vc=1

"time limit for a round will be an hour, but if it starts to get to where every round actually takes an hour, i may shorten this."

holy hell

mets, or someone else, correct me if I'm wrong, but:

For at least a year, you guys ran like 3-5 turbos every single ****ing day? Jesus christ. I'm never gonna be able to grab all these turbos. I have to manually find every single one of them.

You wanna know why the oldschool regular games didn't have as high post counts?

Because they were too busy playing 5 ****ing turbos a day!!!!!!

no

So much clarity gained, thanks soah

We definitely used to play a lot of turbos though, yes. Many more than run now except on Saturday nights.

----

As regards claiming seer on d1 of a turbo, it shouldn't matter what people do since the village should ignore any and all claims. Doing anything else is allowing wolves to freeroll on getting a mislynch. That said, I am opposed to people claiming seer on d1 (whether they are actually seer or not) because every time people do it as a non-wolf it makes future villages less likely to ignore claims.

I'm guessing it was 6-10

I think gorie hosted the first one