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[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash [Game Thread] South Park Mishmash

03-04-2015 , 02:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by South Park Mod
No one was punished for bold red, lol @ that.

If you mean what Chris did, it's because he used bold red twice in an ITA session, simulating a game action (bombing Walmart??). And the punishment wasn't even that harsh (auto miss on next char vig) compared to what it could have been.
Well the severity of the punishment isn't really the heart of the issue. The real issue is whether or not punishment is warranted. In general I have no problem with punishing acts that are forbidden as long as it "fits the crime" so to speak. If you're going to draw a line, there should be consequences to those who cross it imo, else don't draw the line.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CPHoya
Would like to clear two things up before I go HAM.

1. I was incorrect that domer cheated. That is due to mods communicating one thing to the wolf team, while communicating exactly the opposite to the ****ing masonry that Cartman was recruited into, to which he showed his mod communicated recruitment message from day one before asking the mods if he could. The mods told him it was fine after it happened. The previous night we had been told explicitly that the recruitment PM was "mod communication" that would not be seen by anyone else.



2. Domer spent the entire second day angleshooting his balls off, I will shortly quote like 30 posts of him knowing he's doing it and doing it anyway. Short of that ridiculous angleshot coupled with the ****ing stick being allowed to permanently angel him for 24 hours (we spent two vigs, a night anda day vig on him, both of which would have hit due to no one angeling him and both of which only missed because of THE STICK INVINCIBILITY) while angleshooting coupled with the mod miscommunication to us literally 100% causing us to accidentally kill Duck by missing the Cartman character vig, the wolves win this game in a ridiculously easy walk.

The most galling part of this was when we knew that LaDurpus was Cartman approximately always, and then domer begins ranting about the content of the recruitment PM. He did so by not specifically describing it, because he was told he could not, but instead by doing everything in his power to reiterate literally like 30 times that he would be modkilled if he discussed the thing he knew, but that he knew a thing he couldn't talk about - which was a problem he solved by just talking about it ****ing all day, couched in "I'm totally talking about out-of-game information I've been told not to talk about right now lol hi I'll be modkilled if I ever clarify this but I KNOW SOMETHING I SHOULDN'T KNOW HI." Anyway, once it was obvious he knew the contents of the recruitment, we character vigged him as Cartman. We did this because based on our knowledge from the mods it was *impossible* that he could be anyone other than Cartman, because no one else could see the recruitment. That caused Duck to die as punishment for "missing." That remains the single most rigged moment of the game.

Domer is an angleshooter and knows it. He will argue this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CPHoya
It's also frustrating that the mods knew that we were suiciding Duck due precisely and only to their own mixup, and it's doubly frustrating that mods knew that while this was happenning domer was hard-angleshooting for the entire day, and not only did nothing get fixed to re-balance the ****ups, or anything get done to prevent the ridiculous extra death of an extra wolf, but it was allowed to just be how the game was.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CPHoya
We went over this like 9 times in DVC. If Hurp decides to join the lolWILlage and then tries to out me, he does so in a situation where he cannot talk about the recruitment. That is an argument I can possibly win, and it's obviously a gamble I'm willing to take to recruit a new wolf PR in a game we're already completely dominating at that point.

What I cannot win is an argument where a third party to the recruitment begins explicitly using the content of the recruitment that he isn't supposed to even read to deduce who a wolf is and then begin ranting about how he knows this with 98% accuracy based on things he can't talk about because he was told not to talk about them which clears him, clears Cartman, ****s up our vig system thereby killing another wolf for no reason owing only to angleshot, etc.

"You cannot talk about this" does not mean it is fine to repeat over and over again that the result of your knowledge that you cannot talk about is X but you cannot talk about WHY or you'll be modkilled. That's an explicit angleshot because the only thing you are talking about is the specific thing you know you cannot talk about. This is so obvious.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CPHoya
oh for the love of god

the rule is do not talk about it

he talks about it

the justification for not punishing him cannot be that he broke the rule but HURP isn't in a position to know that, what's the point of the rule if breaking it is always fine so long as you could have been lying from the perspective of the hearer?

this is the same thing you said about the day long OTHER angle, and the whole point is THE REASON IT'S AN ANGLE is the hearer is being forced to MAKE DEDUCTIONS ABOUT RULE BREAKING, i.e. ABOUT STUFF DOMER IS ALREADY REQUIRED TO NOT BE TALKING ABOUT, BUT IS ACTIVELY TALKING ABOUT

so frustrating
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:23 PM
I probably would have let domer slide on the recruitment angleshoot due to mod communication...but then you see his stick of truth violation and no ragrets attitude and there's no other conclusion than he knowingly cheated, got away with it, and irreversibly changed the outcome of the game.

Loldomer
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:23 PM
Gg everyone
Thanks to mods for the fun game.

I haven't played ww in months and had a blast

Monstr you were great.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:24 PM
Namath, my punishment was deserved and likely should have been worse TBH. That's fully on me.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Namath12
Well the severity of the punishment isn't really the issue, the issue is whether or not punishment is warranted. In general I have no problem with punishing acts that are forbidden. If you're going to draw a line, there should be consequences to those who cross it imo, else don't draw the line.
Talking about subs is unavoidable in most cases, and nitty (and petty) to punish IMO but you want to curb that.

I'm not going to be a nazi mod wrt minor rulebreaking, just the way it is. Chris' action was egregious and on fully on purpose, you have to go out of your way to do what he did. You can easily slip with subs.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:25 PM
ok so that's why the entire wolf team was struggling to post. They were raging about discussing subs in WC.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by StuckinARutt
That stuff about the stick kind of tilts me

I submitted the banana deep throater for the avatar contest and nearly won it. blegh

and then when domer lost it, it was RANDED to Lev? no, it should have come to me!

****
It still went to a villager bro, no worries.

And for the record, the "bunch of stuff they couldn't grant" that I asked for was angel related (which they wouldn't do because I was already an angel), peek related (d4 was too late in the game for a peek they said), vig related (I couldn't have gotten a dayvig on d4 because the cripple fight was "already effectively a dayvig", which it wasn't, really, since I couldn't choose who in'd the event and couldn't choose who ultimately died) and mechanically related (I wanted to know if there were any godfathers in the game).

I don't feel like any of those requests were angly at all, although I will grant that I probably don't have the requisite GUILE to make FULL USE of such an awesome device.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:26 PM
if you don't like rules having to be made up all the time to account for unforeseen scenarios, then you probably shouldn't play mashes.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MFFNike
I probably would have let domer slide on the recruitment angleshoot due to mod communication...but then you see his stick of truth violation and no ragrets attitude and there's no other conclusion than he knowingly cheated, got away with it, and irreversibly changed the outcome of the game.

Loldomer
What pisses me off is that he's just being a dick about it all.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:28 PM
Spoiler:
requisite GUILE

Spoiler:
awesome device
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:29 PM
Timeline of the Game Falling Apart:

  • Wolves dominate day 1, no one even has heat.
  • Domer wins the stick, is told not to talk about stick.
  • Domer recruits hurp by talking about stick. No punishment.
  • Stick night and then day angels him.
  • Wolves are told the recruitment message is "mod communication" to be seen by no one but Cartman.
  • Cartman chooses village, enters masonry with domer and someone.
  • Stick night angel saves Domer that night.
  • Hurp gives domer (and presumably someone else) the recruitment PM without asking the mods. No punishment.
  • Mods tell Hurp that is fine, even though wolves have already been told it cannot happen. Domer is aware he cannot discuss the content of the recruitment PM.
  • Day angel saves Domer again.
  • Domer spends entire day referencing the content of the PM as a deductive reason that Hoya is a wolf, acknowledging repeatedly that he will die if he discusses what he's "not discussing." No punishment, this continues.
  • Due to mod communication to us that only Cartman can see recruitment, we character vig Domer as Cartman, even though LaDurpus was outed as Cartman prior to that by his day vig flavor, which CPHoya observed and talked about in the thread on day 1.
  • That character vig misses even though, based on the rules understood by the wolves, it is impossible that Domer is not Cartman.
  • Missing kills a random wolf. That miss kills Duck. No reparations for this mod-and-domer-caused death.


At no point was a single thing done to attempt to rebalance this probably 50% win equity swing, which I reiterate is the only reason this game wasn't a laughable trouncing of the village.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:31 PM
gg everyone, exceptional WIM monstr

All of the mod praise belongs to effen and insanity
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:31 PM
Yes Hoya, no one but your namath, your night vigilante, mucks, who subbed out after randing wolf, killer, who was the third wagon (although that whole neil/killer situation was pretty slick I have to admit), and neil, who was getting some heat. Other than that, you guys were killing us
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:31 PM
What was the Marklarrr stuff about
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:32 PM
Hoya,

I didn't angel domer n1. I believe that was stick related?
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:34 PM
Yeah, it was the stick. It says that, you got ninja edited. I know no one angeled him.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montecore
Yes Hoya, no one but your namath, your night vigilante, mucks, who subbed out after randing wolf, killer, who was the third wagon (although that whole neil/killer situation was pretty slick I have to admit), and neil, who was getting some heat. Other than that, you guys were killing us
Ironically my wagon d1 didn't really take off until Hoya inexplicably decided to come in and bus me out of left field. At that point I had two votes (you, MB) and there were several others being discussed as well.

That's not to say that my wagon might not have still taken off absent Hoya's bussing, we'll obv never know either way, but if I never re enter the thread there's a strong nonzero chance I'm not the lead wagon at EOD.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CPHoya
Timeline of the Game Falling Apart:

  • Wolves dominate day 1, no one even has heat.
  • Domer wins the stick, is told not to talk about stick.
  • Domer recruits hurp by talking about stick. No punishment.
  • Stick night and then day angels him.
  • Wolves are told the recruitment message is "mod communication" to be seen by no one but Cartman.
  • Cartman chooses village, enters masonry with domer and someone.
  • Stick night angel saves Domer that night.
  • Hurp gives domer (and presumably someone else) the recruitment PM without asking the mods. No punishment.
  • Mods tell Hurp that is fine, even though wolves have already been told it cannot happen. Domer is aware he cannot discuss the content of the recruitment PM.
  • Day angel saves Domer again.
  • Domer spends entire day referencing the content of the PM as a deductive reason that Hoya is a wolf, acknowledging repeatedly that he will die if he discusses what he's "not discussing." No punishment, this continues.
  • Due to mod communication to us that only Cartman can see recruitment, we character vig Domer as Cartman, even though LaDurpus was outed as Cartman prior to that by his day vig flavor, which CPHoya observed and talked about in the thread on day 1.
  • That character vig misses even though, based on the rules understood by the wolves, it is impossible that Domer is not Cartman.
  • Missing kills a random wolf. That miss kills Duck. No reparations for this mod-and-domer-caused death.


At no point was a single thing done to attempt to rebalance this probably 50% win equity swing, which I reiterate is the only reason this game wasn't a laughable trouncing of the village.
afaik, this is just speculation... at the very least, it requires clarification as to exactly what was said what was shared and when

today domer said in dvc that he didn't see the pm

I believe that your recruitment message should be viewed as a player message and that the mod saying otherwise was in error

regardless, sharing the pm was not required for domer to acquire knowledge that hoya was a wolf

as in, even if the message were classified as mod communication, everything going down the way it did is fine
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Christophersen
What pisses me off is that he's just being a dick about it all.
wait wait wait wait

hang on, who is being a dick about it? Hoya accused me of cheating, multiple times. In the thread...in DVC...I'm surprised he hasn't been PMing me. I'm half expecting the FBI to show up at my house at any moment on some terrorism tip.

Nothing I did was cheating or angleshooting. This is a figment of his active imagination. I have elucidated this many times now and I don't think I have anything new to bring to the table. There is line you cannot cross, and I didn't cross it.

A decision didn't go in the lawyer's way (the recruitment) and he is all butthurt that he outted himself. Every complaint stems from that. If he has a problem, it's minor quibbles with the mod. And cut the mods slack, effen and insanity are first-timers afaik. The problem here is not that a mason shared GAME INFORMATION with his MASON (lol at this not being allowed in your opinion), it is that I should've been allowed to say where I saw that hoya outted himself because it was a *********GAME MECHANIC************ that should have been allowed to be outted. "So uh there was a recruitment last night guys and in the wolf recruitment it looks like Hoya is a wolf." If you ask me, the major problem was that I couldn't say that. If I could say that, I would've said. The duckburg death ALSO stems from me not being able to say that.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CPHoya
Timeline of the Game Falling Apart:

  • Wolves dominate day 1, no one even has heat.
rofl

i stopped reading your list at that point
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:40 PM
I mean you angleshot for like 12 consecutive hours bro, of course he thinks you're a jerk.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:40 PM
And bright that's not speculation, it's true.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:42 PM
and just to be perfectly clear, I was not sent a PM or shown a PM or forwarded a PM from the mod.

Hurp quoted from the wolf recruiting message in our mason chat.

if I knew there were pictures of that girl in there, I would've gone from 98% Hoya peek to 99.5% Hoya peek.
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote
03-04-2015 , 02:42 PM
"Wolves dominated day one" LOOOOOL this kids delusional
[Game Thread] South Park Mishmash Quote

      
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