I'm not concerned. I stated I was clearly in favor of both before the weirdos even came out and started screeching. The record speaks for itself

Yes, but there is typically one or two guys in the band who really give it their all in such circumstances.

It certainly does.

I think this is extremely obvious personally. It's unfortunate that the left is generally reluctant to concede things like this because of people like juan who will then start word-vomiting about how sexism is Fake News because he, juan, has Reasoned hard about it and that's what he concluded.

given the current situation, it seems weird for you to have this little self control and awareness. You're a moderator derailing the thread with empty attacks. On top of that, your outrage at picture of 14 year olds has far exceeded any outrage you hold for actual adults actually being bigoted. You just quoted me with links in the post that show a 2p2 member participating in this thread behaving racist towards another 2p2 member. Again you don't seem to care.

I'm trying to wrap my head around the reasoning and it's amusing. When a kid learns to use the middle finger at 8 years old would being shown the middle finger by that child annoy you more or less than members of 2p2 directing racist comments at another member? my best guess from most to least rage

1. 14 year olds in a picture doing a nazi salute

2. 8 year old giving you the middle finger IRL

3. An actual 2p2 member posting in this thread directing racist comments towards another member

You remind me that yesterday I pointed out (in response to the question of whether or not all of the exiles were just trolls) that the forum tends to interpret "argues badly" as trolling, and that's definitely one thing they all tend to have in common.

Where's the credible research on SSM? There isn't any as the change is too much in its infancy. That's why I've said I'm happy to debate the point in 20 years time when there is but until then we are going to have two opposing views with nothing to intervene apart from the greater popularity of your argument (which I'm not disputing is not significant btw).

Oh yeah, I meant to mention this. That "it's quite clear" is a huge tell, because it subsequently became obvious that bundy had no idea if it was true or not. These guys regard what is going on in their own heads as being on an equal footing with reality. That's the problem here.

The courts aren't experts? You do realise they take expert evidence in forming their opinions, don't you?

Wherein noted centrist and not at all anti Semitic Juan Valdez compares giving someone the middle finger with throwing a nazi salute.

I agree with you to some extent about the psychology of the left on issues involving social construction, but I disagree that this was extremely obvious. I don't think it's easy to resolve a lot of these questions about the role of culture vs biology a priori, although it's probably easy at this point to say that in issues involving biological sex it's going to probably be some of both and that they interact in nuanced ways.

I probably shouldn't write "psychology of the left" because I don't think these psychological tendencies to form positions in a reactive way are specific to people on the left, they are common to everyone and a larger problem on the right at this moment in my view, but hopefully my meaning is clear enough.

The collection I referenced before has ~80 studies going back to the late 80s, so nearly 30 years.

http://whatweknow.inequality.cornell...sbian-parents/

Courts can't control that

Yeah in how many countries again and what was the sample size?

I noticed you still don't care about actual racism by participants in this thread while having your face melt off about a picture of 14 year olds. This is probably a half dozens responses without even mustering a yawn. You care about racism when it's convenient or marginal (14 year olds). Spare us the moral grandstanding

bundy do you have any evidence that the courts wouldn't also find value in a kid spending time with both partners of a same sex divorce and rule in that manner? I don't think the courts finding value in a kid spending time with both parents means what you think it means.

It'll be quite ironic really, I'm pretty sure the last time the forum got shut down it was because of anti semitic posts.

That is nothing different to keeping a father in a child's life where he has separated from the mother just because he was the father and brings no redeeming qualities to the child's healthy upbringing of having that influence of both sexes.

Feel free to click the link. I understand that you recognize the value of folks doing their own research

Try reading.

A check on the history of how many countries have legislated SSM and when tells me otherwise but thanks for the offer.

Haha

A country doesn't have to have SSM to have gay parents. The research is on child rearing specifically.

You do realize that children have been raised by same sex couples long before legalization of SSM right?

Well named linked a site before with 79 studies, 75 of which concluded there was no disadvantage to children of same-sex couples. The 4 which concluded disadvantage had serious problems with confounding variables. None of these studies individually are very meaningful at all, but taken together they constitute strong evidence. If I flip a coin once and it comes up tails, that is extremely weak evidence that the coin is biased to tails, but if I flip it 79 times and it comes up tails 75 times, that is extremely strong evidence.

The larger problem is that there isn't even any theoretical reason why same-sex couples should be worse parents other than your instinct that it is so. And again, that's what you want, is us to credit your instincts with being at all valid in an argument, but they just aren't. It's "quite clear" to me that the desk I am typing this on is a solid object, but I'm just wrong about that. It's actually mostly empty space. Arguments like "well, that's what I think, let's see what people think in 20 years" or "well a poll of people found 80% of them think the desk is mostly solid matter" will not be taken seriously and rightly so.