If a tree falls in the woods.......

I estimate the odds of us living in a simulated world to be lower than that of a deity existing. The world is way too logical to indicate any foul play.

Sometimes I think the problem is that we were never suposed to get to this stage as humans. We were suposed to stay at the level of thinking about finding food, water, shelter and sex; we weren't suposed to start questioning the world and that's why we get depressed.

Today a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration. That we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively. There is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imagination of ourselves. Here's Tom with the weather

Bill Hicks

I've been fascinated with the idea of ego-death ever since I could put into words that I could understand.

I experienced satori one night when I was reading a book on Zen I was reading along out loud in my room thinking how many pages I could read tonight, suddenly out of the blue, all my thoughts dropped, silence hit me and I felt connected to everything and I had a great big belly laugh that lasted for a few minutes enough to hurt my sides, I laughed so much I started to cry. Then once again the negative thoughts came rushing back into my mind and was back into my normal mode.

As anyone experienced ego-death? I'm tempted to do psychedelics, magic shrooms etc....but I fear getting caught.

The ego what is it? How do I drop the "I" that thinks its the center of the universe?

Not making yourself the subject of every post you make would be a start.

^ wp

Instructions: Pick guru. Pay for their book. Do what the book says to do. If that doesn't work, save up to go to one of their seminars. If that doesn't work, save up to go to more seminars and weekend retreats. Continue until it works.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ego?s=t

"People who have consumed ayahuasca report having spiritual revelations regarding their purpose on earth, the true nature of the universe as well as deep insight into how to be the best person they possibly can.[2] This is viewed by many as a spiritual awakening and what's often described as a rebirth.[3] In addition it is often reported that individuals can gain access to higher spiritual dimensions and make contact with various spiritual or extra dimensional beings who can act as guides or healers.[4]

It's nearly always said that people experience profound positive changes in their life subsequent to consuming ayahuasca[5] and it is often viewed as one of the most effective tools of enlightenment.[6]"

-wiki


Keep in mind that stuff you get off the internet is typically not Ayahuasca, but merely Banisteriopsis caapi which contains no DMT. It contains a mono-amine oxidase inhibitor which makes DMT active orally, but you have to get that from other plants. Actual Ayahuasca takes skill and experience to make. However, be careful not to get involved with anything like this:

The Dark Side of Ayahuasca

I find it difficult to engage in other topics because I don't know enough about the subject and to comment on them would look rather foolish on my part. But yes I see your point and it would be a good place to start.

Very good. I've find Alan Watts somewhat interesting and have started to read some of his books so fingers cross.

Oh man, you completely missed his point.

I don't see how I missed the point.

Posting in SMP is not a personal blog. 2+2 does have a personal blog forum which you participate in so your OP is redundant at best.

Only one point that needs addressing; if you had achieved or experienced satori (whatever definition(s) you may ascribe to it or experiences you interpret to be such, including misinterpretation) you would not make a post about it, especially in SMP. And I submit you would never understand why. Which says much.

Instead of reading Alan Watts (a perpetual jackoff king), it would be wiser to read Li Bai.

Warning: This thread can be closed or deleted at my sole discretion for any reason I deem appropriate. [SMP is not your personal blog, for example]

I understand their limon chicken is noteworthy.

He drank himself to death AND had excellent hair. I approve of your choice.

To lose your ego is to deny your human nature. You cannot exist without ego and the rest is pure bs regarding drugs, idiotic manipulations of your brain and nothing profound about them that can lead to anything significant after its all over. I am not denying however the possibility to enhance the human brain biochemically in some future point and experience as a result a completely different form of awareness. Lets leave that possibility open but arrive at it rationally by understanding how the brain functions, instead of experimenting like ignorant charlatans and alchemists did lol.

You can instead (until improving the brain otherwise is possible) educate yourself, become over time wiser and have a very healthy respect for your capacities and your own promise as well as your failures/lessons and limitations without however becoming idiotically humble about it to the point of not being any more optimistic and eager to improve (only become realistic i mean while still wishing to improve that reality with effort). Have absolutely no limits in what can happen and be very healthy skeptic of everything but at different levels of skepticism that seem to properly reward the various degrees of success of all knowledge you acquire. (for example in your skepticism reward scientific method more than dogma because clearly it has given you far more, but do not take my word for it, convince yourself with study and effort/examples etc).

You should not lose your ego because that makes you a slave, a machine, a person without identity, an assimilated system to some higher form of entity outside yourself. You should however improve that ego and mature and recognize the truly important which is not the apotheosis of that ego above and beyond all others, the stupid vanity of any egomaniac that puts self above truth and principles or the greater good (whatever that is to be studied ) etc.

I mean have a healthy respect for yourself and your promise as an individual human being without allowing your view of the world to become the center of everything, acknowledge and respect the existence and dreams of others, rather recognize your ego for what it is, a reality you cannot escape because it is your human nature, your identity as a living being, a record of your trip to this point. You do have only your brain and senses as starting point to experience the world. So you cannot escape that form of ego, that vantage point, that perspective, your own path of development from an infant to an adult and eventually a mature adult.

You want to protect that being that is you and remain optimistic about its capacities without being delusional and hurtful to others. In that sense your ego is a healthier one.


My suggestion to all is to recognize we are all in this together and alone in a limited form on occasion but never truly alone because even if socially alone and removed from active society you still have their culture and the wisdom of your old "friends" that lived before our times. So maintain a healthy demand to improve yourself and celebrate the power of the individual human spirit that is yourself, your ego. But try to do that in an ethical manner and realize that others deserve the same respect for their promise (until something profound challenges that respect but not before). Have a healthy ego, confidence and respect for the truth and you will recognize then that ego is a dependable good friend to your self/body/life. No reason to lose your ego. Just improve it and you can do that by imagining a world without it very often and developing empathy and respect for all nature and the logic behind it and by self reflection and objective critical thinking. Remain aware and open minded.

Imagine if he had real beer or fine wine or whisky...

The implications are making me wobble a bit.

Secret suggestion to all egos lol. You do not need to read any one single person or the big name philosophers as a starting step. That is the lazy way out. Study them only as supplement really, as part of human literature/culture/history. What you really need is more physics and math (and of course all sciences eventually but those 2 initially are the core of everything) to understand the world better and develop your own confident truth searching thinking. And then philosophy will be a byproduct of your thoughts and wisdom with the benefit those great thinking giants before us never had, moreover their potentially greater IQ on occasion; Modern results! Then you can read them as well to see if you agree with them or spot the naivete that not having access to modern information produced, moreover their brilliance. For clearly it is the math and physics that will be the real guiding wisdom constructing process/tools and you cannot entirely trust people that lived long before these modern tools which are best suited to objectively recover for you the nature of the world around you.

QFT. This inspired me. masque appears to have a clue. Just wait for the contribution of PLAAYNDE.

This is almost 100% ****. Maybe the best idea in the video is that man created the devil for dealing with natural parts of our existence. People missed out of that much stuff when going from a multitude of gods to just one, so they had to get an antithesis.

We all know that what we are to the core fundamental root is something beyond this human existence. We just don't know what it is. To lose your ego is not to deny human, but to begin to stop denying our true nature whatever that is. In terms of evolution, a larger time scale, we are not human but life.
This is really redundant to say tho right?

Even science believes that drugs can make great lasting changes on the mind, even positive. I'm not a fan of prescription, and I don't believe in 'satori through drugs', but I'm not sure we can say they cannot lead to something significant.

In the context of satori the idea would be changes in the brain are a product of the awareness.

If knowledge can be shown to be the opposite direction of satori, then in the context of the op, the accumulation of knowledge is the impeding ignorance. You can't take a car with you in death, what will we do with knowledge?

The paradox is the wisdom does not accept time nor the process of becoming.
Some would say to just observe this process with no attachment to the ups and downs, rather than 'this is happening to me' more like 'this is happening'. Its a different use of the mind and will, and before we argue the merits I should like to outline it well.

This I think deserves and asterix in the form of time and other fundamental axioms that aren't allowed to be dropped in this forum section.

The 'eastern' philosophies ask the students to be skeptic to their root, which includes skepticisms not allowed by those that believe in science.
That might be true. But it might be true that ego is the single conformity that none of us break free from. I would argue each of us, in this world today, lives as a slave to all our daily lives. For much of the world its not that hard to show. Is it tough to show that even. prince william is not in control of his daily life and free to do what he wishes? I do agree though that any belief of assimilating with some higher form outside of oneself is just a belief.

Yes all this, but you point to a different definition and use of the ego here.

I think when someone brings up 'escape' the general projection of it becomes something that does not pertain to the actual problem. Or we might agree one cannot escape, but they can cease the process of attempting to escape..
But that instinct to protect the self is a chain, it is not a choice. I'd say one can only know about such a thing when they feel the freedom of not having it.

This is a pacifier to me, thats how I view these words. Satori, points to the attempt to face an eternal loneliness, that others (specifically our culture) seek to fill their daily moments with distractions from the fear of facing this fear of emptiness. This is a good example why it involves letting time go, or the belief that past is what makes me what I am in the present.
I think that improving oneself indefinitely eventually leads to the want to experiment with egoless moments. In these moments there can be a snap change in our being because without the ego one can finally realize what ego is, and that if there can be no ego, then ego is not an inevitability.

In respect to the word satori, truth is what lies beyond the state of ego.

The ironic thing is that imagining a world without ego is the very validation and arising of ego.

These are the opposite of an ego rooted state.

The issue is the at the highest peak maths and sciences become a barrier that forever block us from really knowing and experiencing what 'this' is.

I agree with this, that the sarcasm suggest that such a process is ridiculous. I done a brief overview of as many lists of 'gurus' I could find. The problem of course is truth doesn't imply a good speaker, and a good speaker doesn't imply truth. There are many other problems obviously as well. Including a plethora of terrible information, and terrible teachers (of all subjects). And as students we are generally bad at wading through the bs.

There have also been great pains taken throughout the history of man to condition the average mind to be confused and adverse to the real wisdoms of eastern type teachings.

I don't know that, and haven't found any evidence for it. Why would we be anything else than our human existence?