Oh, good, there were cats.

The consolation prize: Your reg date will send Niels and other conspiracy theorists into a cold sweat. Balanced strategy FTW.

Kerowo made this thread sooo awesome.

Does anyone else feel Nielsio's credibility was entirely diminished when he used the word "squadoosh"?

I have spent a lot of time looking up information on the 9-11 conspiracy theories and all the events that happened that day. I am sure that something happened that day that we are not being told about...outside of that it's very confusing and hard for someone like myself with limited scientific knowledge to draw any conclusions about it.

One thing I do know for sure is that the people who opposed Neilso in this thread and pretty every thread I have come across where someone takes the "9-11 essentially happened like everyone thinks it did" side acts like a jerk toward the truthers. I wish both sides would act better and more civil towards one and another, because the constant name calling makes these threads un-readable.

That's ofcourse exactly what they want.

lmao. That's right, I actually work for the government and don't want these threads getting any traction with the plebes...

Conspiracy kooks don't argue, they just bring up different points in lieu of responding to objections to their previous points. So I just keep posting cats to make the thread more enjoyable

You understand this is pretty much ALL Nielsio's fault right? If you dont believe me read the post after this one of yours.

Basically my position too, I have never understood why is that bad to have an independent investigation? and why is it ok to give the government a GIANT free pass on their responsibility? Where do the buck stop?

And I thought this forum have no jerks, but this thread proved me wrong, it's like reading OOT.

Personally, I could care less. I mean, I'm glad some people care. But I don't. And there's so much [censored] to wade through...

It's one of those cases where you have overly-credulous tin-foil-hat people fighting with condescending [censored], and neither side justifies their position well.

My position is pretty simple. I'm sure some things really don't add up, but incompetence is a more likely explanation than conspiracy.

I understand that it is really frustrating debating with Neilso. If I was on your side of the argument I would not see a point to continuing. I really don't want to go through this thread and count the amount of times people call him an idiot or a kook or stupid or something of that nature. There are a lot of people out there who are looking into this information for themselves and it's discouraging when every site I go to 911 truth people are harassed to no end.

WRT to his reply to my first post in this thread, well I am going to unfairly clump you in with all the people who are against Neilso in this thread, sorry if you never really did any of this stuff. I don't think he is insinuating that you're all CIA members or Cointel Pros or anything of that nature. It's just very obvious that you guys seem to enjoy derailing the hell out of this thread and making it unreadable. It's not a conspiracy theory, there are a ton of lolcats and ad hominems people seem to enjoy derailing this thread.

Thing is:

Terrorism isn't new. It's just 9/11 was a watershed incident for the US in dealing with terrorism. If I'm not mistaken, this hadn't happened on such a scale to Americans before, and the anger and frustration in trying to figure out what's happened is all well and good.

But when a poster posits an angle that it's part of a larger conspiracy, in a forum of logical thinkers (for the most part) he is going to be mocked.

Consider that terrorism isn't new and Europeans have been dealing with it on a scale for decades with collectively higher body counts. Certainly this isn't mentioned, except for his trying to tie later incidents into 9/11 as part of a larger conspiracy.

While deplorable, 9/11 is a single incident, using it as a rationale to further any kind of conspiracy agenda is at best Pyrrhic.

You won't find those same cat-callers diminishing the incident itself and the anger and dismay that such a thing could happen. It's when that a conspiracy theorist tries to rationalize his agenda by including statements like: "But that's what they want!" that he is going to be rightly mocked for such a view.

And consider that it's been over half a decade since the incident, and Americans should really consider themselves fortunate that this wasn't the start of a larger attack on American institutions.

Does this mean terrorism is no longer an issue? Sadly, no. Does this mean there's something more insidious at work here? No.

Are you even aware of any of the controversies surrounding these events?

That'd require wading through cat hair to find your angles to the situation, Nielsio.

What about the fact I pointed out, that terrorism isn't exactly new and it's only new in an American purview?

If you can summarize your opinion, and I heavily lean on the word opinion in this situation about what's actually going on in a paragraph or two, it'll serve as an exercise for you to try to rationally explain what's going on.

I was attempting to point out with my post that there's more than enough reason for you to be mocked as you have. I wasn't dismissing 9/11 as a meaningless incident, but your approach in trying to make it a larger conspiracy lacks cohesion. If you collected your information and summarized it so it was readable without the aid of video links, you might gain a little more respect and less lolcatty responses.

Sometimes it's delivery, not content that damns you.

Correct, while we have experienced terrorism at home a couple of times, it was never on this scale. Also there has never been a terrorist attack anywhere on this scale anywhere before. Also, we have experienced terrorism abroad, IE attacks on embassies and the like.

Wouldn't the logical thing to do if these conspiracy folk were really just wild loons to just ignore them and let them be? I know that is not as much fun, it's just a lot more prudent.

Here is how I see the whole issue. I don't know a lot of what happened, I probably will never get the complete answers I want. Although that is not going to stop me from trying to find them. On 9-11 a lot of things happened that do not sit well with me. All I want is to find discussions about the event where everything does not turn into wild accusations and lolcats. I think that Borodog's posting of the conversation with Neilso, while rude to post a private conversation without consent, is what I am looking for.

Don't assume just because people don't agree with you that they are shooting you down because they are stubborn, hardheaded or not inquisitive.

Peace.

Of course, and it's a shock that still resounds years later, and people still want to find out what happened. Rather normal, really.

Well, a few posters tried that and when it became clear this wouldn't serve him, the mockery began.

Perhaps he was just attempting to point out Nielsio's state of mind and reluctance to accept a logical conclusion using science in a none-too-subtle way. GL with the search though, and try not to let it twist your rational outlook on the events. If you find the answers you seek, all well and good, and if that isn't enough, try not to accept any other explanation because the one given wasn't enough. That seems to be happening here.

That was not the point of my posts. I think that a lot of the people in this thread have already come to their conclusions about 9-11 and all that stuff. I was 15 when it happened, I am sure a lot of the people here were adults so they have come to their own logical independent conclusions in the time since now and then. I was not able to do that, so I am sure I am just re-hashing a lot of things people have already dealt with and they might find them to be tedious now. Or maybe I am completely wrong and some people just enjoy posting LOLcats.

I know you didn't mean to imply that. I don't think conspiracies don't happen, but I don't think 9/11 was an internal US conspiracy either - it would simply be too big. If you want a really good book on real conspiracy in the western world I recommend Eva Joly/"Justice under Siege".

The hard thing with this subject is that there is some good honest people looking for answers and then there are some people who are on the super fringes who believe in lizards who control the world and stuff like that.

I don't think it was an inside job per say. I just know that the US has a history of using false flags as a means to enter unpopular wars. While 9-11 is far beyond anything that has happened in history as far as false flags that I am aware of I would not be surprised if they had some type of role in the whole thing.

Why yes, I do enjoy posting lolcats. And if you wade through this thread from the beginning why I post them here will be more clear. Don't mistake this thread for a rational discussion of what happened on 9/11, it wasn't ever that. It was unsubstantiated points made by the conspiracy folks. When those points were challenged more often than not the challenges were ignored and another point in the conspiracy theorists litany was put forward, the original point never to be mentioned again. You will learn more about what happened on 9/11 from Nova than from this thread.

Whoops.

Giuliani has ties to terrorist harbourers. What a surprise.

Keith Olberman video:
http://www.911blogger.com/node/12738

And from sirio:
If you read the responses starting from the beginning, you'll see that almost everyone started off being polite and open to Nielsio's theories and stayed that way for a long time, which is more than you'd get in a lot of places.

But then a pattern emerged where Nielsio never responded to the substantial rebuttals and talking points, and never entered into a reasonable and open discussion of the very points he raised. He simply posted more and more unscientific and downright kooky theories and testimonies. And he continued to post falsehoods after they were shown to be 100% false, such as the aliminium stuff, the pancake effect, the freefall, etc. It's pretty obvious he's just a propagandist with little in the way of common decency.

I used to think Nielsio was harmless but he's actually rather irresponsible. He doesn't care at all for truth, but merely hopes to use these forums to get a superficially plausible story and videos out to as many impressionable and casual browsers as he can. The truth is secondary to his political aims, which ironically is the exact behavior of the people he so despises. IMO he does more to help the cause of Bush et al than your average Christian fundamentalist and is similar to them in a lot of ways.

I'm a little surprised that people reading this can't see that.

You're probably right, since I didn't read all the thread, but still I'm yet to have here a good discussion about this issue, I've tried in the politics forum, EDF, here and it's rather difficult to have a good discussion. I could care less for the kooky theories, but even with obvious things like government responsibility and accountability and the right to have an independent investigation, people in this forum are easily offended, probably since the majority here are Americans, it clouds their judgement and are pretty sensitive about this issue, usually it's easier to talk about 9-11 with non-Americans.