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NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion

03-23-2011 , 11:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by capone0
Obviously no biases with respect to some of your statements.

East and West are pretty close. I think West has better top line talent while East has more talent as a whole.

UNC has around 4-5 future NBA players-3 definitive in Henson, Barnes, Zeller and 2 future in Marshall and Bullock (could be a while for him). tOSu has a couple as well in Buford, Sullinger, Lighty and I'm pretty sure tOSU fans could give me others (not really familiar with their team). Kentucky also has 3 NBA products--one of which isn't playing but 2 lottery picks in Knight and Jones and of course Kanter.

Uconn has walker. Duke has Irving, Smith, Singler and I think one of the Plumlees (Mason is a future project). Is curry a possible future NBA player as well? SDSU has one player as well. Zona has one that I know with Williams.
how does the nba pertain to this discussion?
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 11:58 AM
how does it not?

And lol the 2 Dukies saying the West by far when it's clearly not the case. Kentucky, UNC and tOSU all have a ton of talent (IE 2-3+ NBA prospects). SDSU, Zona, UConn are both 1 man deep with respect to true "talent" while Duke has a couple. It's clearly not as clear as you two are making it out to be.

Do you want to go by Kenpom?

UNC is #1, UK #8, UNC #12 and Marquette #26 vs #2, #7, #13 and #30? Seem pretty similar. It's not as clear as you 2 are making it out to be.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by capone0
how does it not?

And lol the 2 Dukies saying the West by far when it's clearly not the case. Kentucky, UNC and tOSU all have a ton of talent (IE 2-3+ NBA prospects). SDSU, Zona, UConn are both 1 man deep with respect to true "talent" while Duke has a couple. It's clearly not as clear as you two are making it out to be.

Do you want to go by Kenpom?

UNC is #1, UK #8, UNC #12 and Marquette #26 vs #2, #7, #13 and #30? Seem pretty similar. It's not as clear as you 2 are making it out to be.
bc the question isnt what team will be better at basketball in 5-10 years. Its about what team has the most talent right now. I mean, its no more ridiculous for me to count Austin Rivers as a Duke talent right now than for you to project who will be better in the nba and say that it makes them better right now.

wtf does kempom have to do with it either? have these 5 players played a season together vs other teams?
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:06 PM
and Mason Plumlee is supposably a lottery pick but that doesnt make him good right now. It makes him an average contributor right now who has his most value on the offensive boards.

NBA projections are really dumb for rating who is better right now IN A COLLEGE SETTING. If you used those you would know that Josh McRoberts was dominate as a freshman and JJ Redick was decent, but not phenomenal that same year. Having watched that team play I can tell you that that was a great way to measure our success. I went into every game expecting 25/15 from Josh and hoping to get 14 points out of JJ. Josh was definitely the backbone of that team and it showed.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:08 PM
Well he says region when clearly I guess he means top 5 team from that region. If I take 1-15 from each region the gap clearly closes. East's 6-10 are clearly better than West's 6-10...and 11-15 is pretty much the same thing.

Both regions have considerably more talent due to how things played out than the Southeast and Midwest Brackets.

If you don't like NBA projections it's clearly visible that UK, tOSU and UNC all have a ton of talent and are more than 1 deep. Zona, UConn have been reliant on 1 player for most of the season. Duke has very deep and there is no disputing that. Not as sure about SDSU but I know they do have some talent.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:09 PM
i doubt any of the rest of tosu contributes in the pros. buford and lighty will get a shot. lauderdale no way. diebler miniscule chance. thomas and craft are young but will eventually get a shot, too early to tell. thomas sucks ass and absolutely kills the team btw.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by capone0
Well he says region when clearly I guess he means top 5 team from that region. If I take 1-15 from each region the gap clearly closes. East's 6-10 are clearly better than West's 6-10...and 11-15 is pretty much the same thing.

Both regions have considerably more talent due to how things played out than the Southeast and Midwest Brackets.

If you don't like NBA projections it's clearly visible that UK, tOSU and UNC all have a ton of talent and are more than 1 deep. Zona, UConn have been reliant on 1 player for most of the season. Duke has very deep and there is no disputing that. Not as sure about SDSU but I know they do have some talent.
Hes saying which 5 player team (composed only of players still left in the tournament) is a better roster AT THIS MOMENT IN TIME.

benches dont matter. coaches dont matter. other good players dont matter.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CalledDownLight
Hes saying which 5 player team (composed only of players still left in the tournament) is a better roster AT THIS MOMENT IN TIME.
But he doesn't really say that. If you read his THOUGHTs. He begins to mention other players such as henson, Zeller, Harrelson, Johnson Odom which aren't listed on those teams. The East has a ton of talent and I could argue from top to bottom it has more. At the top 5 the West has more but not clearly the most overall.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by capone0
But he doesn't really say that. If you read his THOUGHTs. He begins to mention other players such as henson, Zeller, Harrelson, Johnson Odom which aren't listed on those teams. The East has a ton of talent and I could argue from top to bottom it has more. At the top 5 the West has more but not clearly the most overall.
who cares if the 30th best player in the East is better than the 30th best in the West? No one ever makes a 38th team all-american list. These things are routinely judged by the top of the pack, not the bottom or middle and rightfully so. There is no way anyone can reliably tell you if the 9th-11th guys on each of the 4 teams in a region would beat the 9th-11th guys on 4 teams from another region. Its a pointless exercise.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:21 PM
Fine, then 1-15 I'd say the east as better. The 2nd team on the east is significantly better than the West team.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor
i doubt any of the rest of tosu contributes in the pros. buford and lighty will get a shot. lauderdale no way. diebler miniscule chance. thomas and craft are young but will eventually get a shot, too early to tell. thomas sucks ass and absolutely kills the team btw.
Thomas has the most upside. He's pretty bad now, but he's a shooter and if he can refine his game, he could be pretty damn good. He's just very raw right now.

Buford will have a better shot than Lighty.

Craft just seems too small to be a real NBA threat. But he's an excellent PG and who knows, he might get a shot to be a role player.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by capone0
Fine, then 1-15 I'd say the east as better. The 2nd team on the east is significantly better than the West team.
1-5 is the discussion. the only edge east has is sullinger.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CalledDownLight
1-5 is the discussion. the only edge east has is sullinger.
Well he should have made it much more clear in his thoughts when he mentions talent but then in his next statement talks about the # of bigs who aren't on that same list. It's not clear what he is really referring to. I know what your intention is now (CDL) but it's really not that clear in (DOs)
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by capone0
Well he should have made it much more clear in his thoughts when he mentions talent but then in his next statement talks about the # of bigs who aren't on that same list. It's not clear what he is really referring to. I know what your intention is now (CDL) but it's really not that clear in (DOs)
I thought it was fairly clear that he was asking people to create their "1st team all region"

I thought his lists were decent as is.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:36 PM
How is that clear when he puts a general statement and then continues to populate the rest of his thoughts with players that are clearly not on his list with respect to discussing talent?
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03-23-2011 , 12:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyOcean_
The Southwest is devoid of guards. It's really ****ing thin. Taylor is good, and then...? Josh Selby was hyped, but his numbers suck butt. I thought about putting VCU's Joey Rodriguez because he is their floor general (plays the most minutes and has the most assists), but he's shooting 35% on the year and isn't great defensively. Richmond, meh. FSU's Kitchen is what I came up with.
You should probably include Kevin Anderson of Richmond, to be quite honest.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 12:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rockrollins
You should probably include Kevin Anderson of Richmond, to be quite honest.
Kevin Anderson is the best guard left in the region.

"Richmond, meh." = "I don't know anything about Richmond so I'll just leave them out."
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 01:07 PM
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 01:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CalledDownLight
1-5 is the discussion. the only edge east has is sullinger.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 01:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyOcean_
WEST

Kyrie Irving
Kemba Walker
Nolan Smith
Kahwi Leonard
Derrick Williams
this seems fine, though this team is quite undersized

Quote:
EAST
Kendall Marshall
Brandon Knight
Harrison Barnes?
Terrence Jones
Jared Sullinger
i think terrence jones blows. i really like jae crowder, but he hasn't put up the #s needed. i'd go henson, zellar, or harrelson over jones. the latter two would allow sullinger to move to his more "natural" PF position, and the former would be a good contrast to sully's style. this would be a scary region if you could grab a bench (...all of OSUs starters?).

Quote:
SOUTHWEST
Derwin Kitchen?
Tyshawn Taylor
Chris Singleton
Marcus Morris
Markieff Morris
chris singleton is really only if healthy. and yea, almost everyone else comes from rock chalk. i might throw burgess in here for singleton.

Quote:
SOUTHEAST
Jimmer Freddette
Jordan Taylor
Chandler Parsons
Jon Leuer
Matt Howard
i definitely like shelvin mack > taylor... at literally everything. i'd go
jimmer
mack
parsons
[leuer
macklin
howard
hartsock]

meh, im not sure, you've got a dozen bigs that could make a case for here, including the red head kid that breaks hearts from sconin, but the 1-3 is really good, maybe as good as any region (even nolan smith/kemba/kyrie, although it's a TOTALLY different and much more balanced 1-3).
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 01:25 PM
capaneo trying to say how much talent UNC has. cool story bro
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 01:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JumanjiBoard
capaneo trying to say how much talent UNC has. cool story bro
they do, sorta. they just don't have a lot of shooting and are extremely young. each part individually is seemingly greater than they are as a team... and like i said, very unpolished with the exception of zellar, and he's not the lotterypick type. should be a very good team if everyone comes back (henson/barnes seem like a longshot) and mcdonald/barnes/bullock learn to shoot the [open] 3 consistently.

edit: if you're building a 10 deep team, say, it's hard not to have 4 guys from carolina. that team (the region's team) would be awesome with unc's length and osu's ability to stretch the floor (as is, osu is the best team in cbball and their biggest weakness is depth).
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 01:47 PM
Yes but mentioning guys like Bullock who don't play much and sport a nice 46% TS is just ******ed.
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03-23-2011 , 01:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomCollins
Thomas has the most upside. He's pretty bad now, but he's a shooter and if he can refine his game, he could be pretty damn good. He's just very raw right now.

Buford will have a better shot than Lighty.

Craft just seems too small to be a real NBA threat. But he's an excellent PG and who knows, he might get a shot to be a role player.
Tom, how disappointed are you folks over there with Lauderdale? When he came in, I thought he had the capability to be good, but it just seems like he never has performed like he should. I've been underwhelmed with him from the get-go.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote
03-23-2011 , 01:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JumanjiBoard
capaneo trying to say how much talent UNC has. cool story bro
Uk and tOSU has a bunch as well. It's not really clear that the West bracket has more overall talent since Zona and Uconn are almost 1 man operations.
NCAA Tournament:  Pre-Sweet 16 Discussion Quote

      
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