NBA Season Thread 2016-2017 - Page 79 - Sporting Events and Fantasy Sports

"Look at recent championships teams, one of the best teams of all time and a team with LeBron on it" doesn't seem like a solid reason to jump to conclusions about the value of a particular position. Especially when both teams had two-guards who proved themselves capable of guarding multiple positions well. PG defense matters when the guard you share the most minutes is a ball-dominant gunner who can't defend. It's part of the reason Portland is so meh. The biggest reason is obviously Evan Turner, lolVM.

12-19-2016 , 07:08 PM

#1952

darO

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Nerlol LOeL: Max Player

12-19-2016 , 07:19 PM

#1953

Seadood228

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Yeah Geoff is right, PG defense doesn't matter when your PG doesn't have to defend. Unfortunately he does for the Blazers, and you're left with a very shaky back-court on that end of the floor. There are also size issues with them as well which further exacerbates the issue.

The problem is they improve their starting lineup by swapping CJ for a great 3+D guy, but then their offense suffers.

12-19-2016 , 07:20 PM

#1954

Heroball

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Quote:

Originally Posted by TingsRgunagetGROSS

CJ already signed an extension.

As for the point about DAME, it's incredibly difficult to win an NBA title when your best plauer is a PG. Its the least important position in basketball

It did happen two years ago, though; and was a huge favorite to happen last year as well. It's incredibly hard to win titles period. What's pretty clear is that the majority of championship teams (especially in the current and evolving NBA) require an elite level perimeter creator on O; PG/Wing distinction blurred beyond recognition by LBJ types.

12-19-2016 , 07:26 PM

#1955

TingsRgunagetGROSS

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Heroball

Recency bias FTW. A simple way to look at it is "big people beat up small people" and PG is usually the smallest guy on the court.

GSW was a huge favorite to win the title last year?

Lebron, Curry, Duncan, Wade, Kobe, KG, Pau, Shaq, Ben Wallace, David Robinson, MJ, Hakeem are the best players on title teams in the last 25 years. Its also incredibly rare for the 2nd best player on a championship team to be a PG

12-19-2016 , 07:33 PM

#1956

yellowfever

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Quote:

Originally Posted by mjw0586

Gasol's probably been a bit better so far, but Gobert has been an absolute monster defensively. There's plenty of teams that Gobert would be more valuable. Agree that his offense is due to regress to some degree.

Speaking of people who have been awesome, the Pistons have struggled since Reggie returned, but KCP has been a beast this year. He ranks 2nd in RPM among SGs (behind only Harden) and he's been a huge positive for the Pistons on both ends of the floor. If anyone's interested, I wrote a good ~1800 words on him over at Piston Powered.

Yeah KCP has been awesome this season. He seems to improve every year.
Didnt know you wrote for pistons powered. Thats really cool man. I've been reading that site for a couple years. I'll check your article out later.

12-19-2016 , 07:36 PM

#1957

TingsRgunagetGROSS

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Seadood228

CJ and Dame should play the least amount of minutes possible together

12-19-2016 , 07:38 PM

#1958

darO

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Trading McCollum for Nerlol would be the Evan Turner signing of trades.

12-19-2016 , 07:47 PM

#1959

Seadood228

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I just realized Nugs are tied with Portland in the loss column, one game out overall. Harris is back, Mudiay is rolling... Jokic is starting. I think they can do this.

12-19-2016 , 07:50 PM

#1960

Cinarocket

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It really wouldn't though, I think it's worth considering for Portland. CJ is 3 years older on a max contract and absolutely terrible on D.

Noel on the other hand has no offensive game but has the potential to be a defensive beast, his rookie season numbers were phenomenal. Now he's been injured and sixers frontcourt is a mess so jury still out for development but frankly just having those kind of defensive numbers as a 20 years old + his athletic tools is enough to convince me he may become something special, the ceiling is much higher than CJ's so contracts make it a consideration imo.

12-19-2016 , 08:02 PM

#1961

SirOsis

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BlazerFan wants Noel in a trade where the big piece POR gives up is Crabbe. I'm all for that, but LOL.

12-19-2016 , 08:14 PM

#1962

darO

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You forgot to mention the part where Nerlens is a cancer who destroys rental homes and cries about pt less than 2 games back from an injury while never staying healthy for a period beyond 2 weeks.

12-19-2016 , 08:28 PM

#1963

SirOsis

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Yeah I think I mentioned that in here recently. There was an article a couple days ago about how GMs weren't valuing him as much because it sounds like he's an *******.

12-19-2016 , 08:31 PM

#1964

Moneyball16

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Seadood228

Yeah Geoff is right, PG defense doesn't matter when your PG doesn't have to defend.

Which happens all the time, even on high level teams.

Compare that to recent great teams at the 3 position. Could you imagine if Durant/Iggy/Lebron/Kawhi/PG were as bad defensively as Steph, Parker, Russ, or Kyrie? You can still crush with a trash heap defensively at PG. It hasn't happened at the 3. PG defense doesn't matter nearly as much.

12-19-2016 , 08:32 PM

#1965

mcb33f

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Quote:

Originally Posted by SirOsis

BlazerFan wants Noel in a trade where the big piece POR gives up is Crabbe. I'm all for that, but LOL.

yeah not working straight up, and also not helped by crabbe's 15% trade kicker

but if anyone is in a position to take on a meh contract it's philly, and if the best they can do is a spacer like crabbe (given how bad the market looks atm for teams selling centers) then maybe the bridging asset that could get that deal done isn't too out of reach for the blazers. looks like they have the cavs 1st next year for example

Last edited by mcb33f; 12-19-2016 at 08:38 PM.

12-19-2016 , 08:34 PM

#1966

SirOsis

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POR's D is **** because it's **** everywhere, except maybe Aminu and the occasional Harkless shutdown. They have basically zero rim presence and sorry perimeter D so it's like walking into an unlocked home's kitchen and getting a cookie easy to score. They'd need a beast like DAJ or Gobert to make much of a difference, and it's not happening.

12-19-2016 , 08:37 PM

#1967

SirOsis

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I'd be amazed if PHI would do something like Crabbe + Layman + whatever filler for Noel, but if so I'd go for it. This situation isn't going to "figure itself out" or whatever pathetic mumbles people keep rehashing. I just don't see Crabbe as a very valuable player, rolling the dice with Noel would be A-OK with me.

12-19-2016 , 08:40 PM

#1968

darO

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Not like Portland has has issues in the past with players of "questionable" character.

12-19-2016 , 08:42 PM

#1969

SirOsis

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I wonder if this stuff in the CBA pisses off any players

"Other areas in the deal include health insurance and an increased pension for retired players, prohibited activities (now including fireworks, firearms, jet skiing, hoverboards, trampoline jumping, etc.)"

12-19-2016 , 08:43 PM

#1970

mcb33f

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philly also need to match salaries which makes it a bit awkward, but perhaps something like this could work: nerlens + ilyasova + filler for crabbe + cavs 1st

12-19-2016 , 08:46 PM

#1971

Moneyball16

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BTW good time to remind people that Noel was really good last year when he played without Okafor

1268 minutes 20.9 Usage 55.5 TS% 0.44 FTR, 11.9 AST%, 14.2 TOV%, 4.6 stocks/36 minutes

Without Okafor and with Ish Smith

704 minutes 21.1 Usage 59.9 TS% 0.47 FTR, 12 AST%, 13.5 TOV%

With Okafor

696 minutes 17 Usage 50.9 TS%, 0.26 FTR, 8.5 AST%, 20.6 TOV%, 2.9 stocks/36 minutes

If Noel is healthy and in a position to succeed, hes really good. Having him stand around and watch Okafor hold the ball and chase stretch 4s around on D isn't it.

12-19-2016 , 08:49 PM

#1972

Cinarocket

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Noel for a package centered around allen crabbe. lmao

And 3 months ago people were saying lol philly because of some noise of jeff teague for noel trade and rightly so