4 Daze fire

Agreed. Which means Kiwi is 4 cuz Westbrook > Durant.

Coming home from 2 weeks of traveling, firing up the score app to see tonight's lineup of games, and seeing it's all star weekend was a real bummer. Guess Ill catch up on downton abbey.

THE MASTER

Durant, Dirk

he doesn't even have a single full season alltime great year, he's got 50 games of 1 season

his year last year wasn't that great

also he's a defensive liability pg when the people he's compared to play more important positions and miles better on defense

maybe around 2020 we can really talk about his place but he's got a long ways to go

Steph is comfortably better than KD, peak MJ/Lebron were comfortably better, I don't think anyone else in history is comfortably better. KD has a historically elite 64%TS on 29% USG. Kawhi is a great shooter from everywhere on the court but I'd like to see what his numbers would look like if you bumped his usage up by another 25%.

I still take Kawhi by a hair because of his defense, but offense > defense so I can definitely see the case for taking KD. It's absurd to say either one is comfortably better than the other.

Kiwi.

Dunc'd On had a bit on this I just listened to when Nate and Danny were discussing all-NBA teams. The main point of contention is that Durant is a historically elite offensive creator while maintaining super high efficiency and usage. Kawhi has the efficiency but not the usage, and while he does run some isos now he doesn't really run high PnRs and isn't a typical offensive threat. Kawhi has room to regress on midrange stuff too (though he also has room to give efficiency back and still be super efficient, but it's clear he can't really be the dynamic scorer Durant is). As far as defense, Kawhi's value over other wing defenders is absolutely massive so depending on matchup that edge can be more or less important. Pretty accurate assessment I think.

As far as in a vacuum, I'd take Durant.

idk, volume has to be pretty high for top 5 (or if its not that high, in the kase of someone like korver, you have to be insanely good at it and get hounded by opposing defenses)

steph
ray
durant
klay

after that it's a little murky and you probably have to choose a lower efficiency one like reggie or korver/kerr/dirk/nash who are lower volume (for different reasons, korver because he just didn't play enough minutes during his prime, kerr because no one shot that many threes back then, dirk are nash are amazing shooters but for htem it is more of a secondary thing). after looking at it a bit more i don't think dirk can really be considered. you just have to be >40% consistently to be considered on this list imo

Lotta questionable things being said, but the only thing I care to lol at explicitly is saying Curry's year last year was not that good

peja should actually probably be given some pretty serious consideration looking at numbers.

also if you guys dont' think klay is top 5 already it's just a matter of time. unless he's run hotter than the sun the last two years (he hasn't), looking at the pace he's on it'll only take a few more seasons to be considered #3 all time. we're in a different era so it's only natural that a role player on a good team is being considered for something like this. in fact i haven't looked at contests and there isn't sportvu data obv but i wouldn't be surprised if guys 10 years ago were just getting so much weaker contests on 3 point attempts as guys like phil jackson were cool if corner 3s were shot

finally, agree with everything said

didn't feel like arguing against the Nash and Dirk brigade

the Klay aspect of it is secondary but again, agree ftmp. He's just not this uber beneficiary of fit that he's being cast as. His trigger is so quick and his form above the waist is so consistent that he could easily be a #1 option and would be a top 5ish ITL scorer. Rarely mentioned, but his height matters. Just like it did with Peja and does for Korver.

Tossed Salad vs. Great Cock

Makes me sick, mother****er, how far we done fell.

as a theoretical 3 pt shooter, Jerry West would've prbly been

Klay plays with the best shooter of all time (who is a great passer), a good SF 3P shooter, a floor spacing PF, a great passing C, all on a team that has great ball movement.

Korver would shoot 80% on 20 3PA/G in that offense.

What's the evidence of Klay being a much better shooter than say JJ redick?

Like I think it'd be unfair to describe him as a role player who just benefits from Curry but at the same time he does seem to get more credit than he's due because people look at him as a natural shooter, he bombs the 3's with GSW play style, has a very good form, quick release and can be really streaky but we can't pretend being on the warriors doesn't help his shooting case either, it's somewhere in the middle. I mean Harrison Barnes is a 40% 3point shooter for GSW, Draymond is shooting 42% this year and Iggy who can barely make a free throw is 39%.

Per nba stats, 82% of Klay's 3pointers are open or wide open that is a HUGE number in comparison to others, KD is at about 60%, Korver at 66%, etc...

He is indeed good at off the ball movement and stuff but 82% open isn't just an accident, there's no way people could objectively argue that playing as a secondary option with not much creation needed from him, having the goat shooter as backcourt mate who draws more attention than anyone else and having 2 elite passers in your starting 5 doesn't boost his shooting case hugely.

Klay is a shooter, he's a really solid shooter but I can see plenty of guys that you put in his position and would end up as a 42% 3 point shooter too

how can we know that James Harden will be good away from the Thunder?

I agree, Bruce Bowen shot 44% from 3 one year

But what Klay could do in other situations plenty of other guys couldn't

Klay didn't just start shooting last year

He has been over .400 every season of his career, even when Curry wasn't BPITL and when Curry was injured and when MJax was still their lolCoach

He also does fine when Curry is on the bench as well


There are some good points being brought up, but also some serious underrating of him

People act like this year (and last year's) GSW is what he had his whole career

Regarding Reddick, he has never put up the >6 attempts/game that Klay did on over .400 while Steph played only 26 games due to injury

I think that season, without this system, mostly without curry and with lolMJAX coaching should put to rest some of these arguments about how he'd be just a good shooter on another team

Way to nitpick, he had 5.9 3PA last season at 44% and is 48% this season at 5.6 3PA. He never plays more than 30MPG really either

1. Steve Kerr
2. Steph
3. Hubert Davis
4. Drazen Petrovic
5. Jason Kapono

I didn't notice he was at 5.9; wasn't trying to nitpick

Take the JJ part away

Klay has proven he can shoot high volume (6.4/game) without Steph and Kerr so he isn't just a product of Steph or Kerr's system

I took your post incorrectly, sorry dude. I thought you were eluding to me only speaking about KATvsStaps as a lead-in to talking guys who play for Nugz.

Also wanted to get in a SB dig :P

Also not that it should really count against him when evaluating best shooters of all time right now but I believe with the culture shock of the NBA we'll be seeing a ton of Klay's in the future and Klay won't be talked about when discussing best shooters of all time 20 years from now.