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10-06-2020 , 11:41 AM

#1276

SABR42

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 23,481

While I agree that pitchers these days are babied too much, the level of offense is far different today than 50 years ago.

I've read Gibson's autobiography, and he said he started off most batters with a fastball right down the middle. How well do you think that would work today?

Pitchers today throw way harder on average and throw more breaking balls. It's going to lead to more injuries naturally because the human body hasn't changed enough in 50 years to cope with the additional stress.

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10-06-2020 , 11:51 AM

#1277

businessdude

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 10,915

what was Gibson's velocity in his prime?

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10-06-2020 , 11:57 AM

#1278

All-inMcLovin

Wholesome Mod

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 55,620

quick googling says:

Bob Gibson pitch speed
He's still considered one of the best to ever throw a baseball, and it's estimated his fastball could reach 100 mph.

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10-06-2020 , 11:59 AM

#1279

SABR42

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 23,481

I don't think we have data on that but I'm guessing mid to high 90's?

My point is even the hardest throwers now like Cole and DeGrom don't just groove fastballs all the time because batters are too good at hitting fastballs now and everyone can take you deep. There was a lot more soft contact back when Gibson pitched.

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10-06-2020 , 05:22 PM

#1280

borg23

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Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 17,983

Quote:

Originally Posted by SABR42

i agree on the offense but elite pitchers are still babied way too much.

while your point is valid on the human body not changing that much in 50 years they're also getting an extra days rest.

if gibson was transported to today's era he would also have access to today's training and nutrition leading to him throwing harder and these front offices would still treat him like a little *****.

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10-06-2020 , 07:23 PM

#1281

FellaGaga-52

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Join Date: Oct 2018 Posts: 10,574

Pretty sure it was low 90's for Gibby. That really has evolved. His delivery, stuff, and mind was a big problem for the hitter. It was nothing like Ryan, who was mid-to-upper 90s, explosively. That movement on the ball that some have is crazy. It's hard to even catch it let alone hit it. Gibson had that I guess.

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10-06-2020 , 07:26 PM

#1282

FellaGaga-52

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Join Date: Oct 2018 Posts: 10,574

Lost 12 games with 1.12 ERA. I've always wondered what the totals were in his duels with Koufax and Marichal, etc, if they even had them then. 5? 4? There was some sick amount of 1-0 games in his '68 game log. Forget how many right now. Might have been 14. He broke his leg I believe the year before. His arm got a lot of rest and there was hell to pay.

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10-06-2020 , 07:42 PM

#1283

FellaGaga-52

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Join Date: Oct 2018 Posts: 10,574

Quote:

Originally Posted by borg23

There is the factor of the tremendous investment made in players nowadays. Injury/breakdown prevention is more important ... and also the fact that you have millionaires in the bullpen and performance for almost all starters decreases as the game goes on, I get the innings pitched thing. That's what I'd do if I was managing or owning a team.

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10-06-2020 , 11:40 PM

#1284

FellaGaga-52

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Join Date: Oct 2018 Posts: 10,574

Quote:

Originally Posted by FellaGaga-52

That 14 1-0 games stat is all wrong. The stat may have been he lost 14 1-0 games in his career. In '68 his log included 13 different 1-0, 2-0, or 2-1 games, 15 shutouts both ways ... Gibson with 12 shutouts, none in April or May, 12 of his last 23 starts were he pitched a CG shutout. World Series Game 1, Gibby shutout. WS Game 4, Gibby allows 1 run in win. Both 5-hitters. Game 7 is history. Different era.

Last edited by FellaGaga-52; 10-06-2020 at 11:45 PM.

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10-12-2020 , 12:24 PM

#1285

mrbaseball

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Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 15,401

Renteria and Cooper OUT for White Sox. Can't say I am surprised or disappointed. Next season is go time and Renteria built a great culture but really isn't the guy to get them to the promised land. He totally screwed up the last couple of weeks of the season.

I'd like to see Ozzie come back myself. But in any event the team is so Latin based and centered I think it is imperative that they get a Latin manager. Already talk of Hinch and I think that would be a mistake.

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10-12-2020 , 12:37 PM

#1286

Ungoliant

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 4,340

Oh man, poor Ricky, lol. I've been joking for years that he'd get the boot from the Sox right before they actually got good, just like he did with the Cubs, and there he goes, right on schedule.