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The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: No smocking guns. The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: No smocking guns.

02-17-2018 , 01:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuv
That's basically my problem. Al capone getting busted only for tax evasion isn't a good thing. It shouldn't be celebrated. It's awful that he couldn't be convicted for his bigger crimes.
Yeah man, it’s a shame a monster like that couldn’t just stay out of jail forever and avoid any and all legal repercussions.

02-17-2018 , 01:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPantz
Lmao, Carter ****in Page was on Tucker tonight.
lol my imagination of how it went down:

Tucker *preparing the layup*: So Carter, how bogus is this hoax Russia investigation? I mean, you haven't committed any crimes, so what's the big deal?

Page: Well, I don't want to say that I've committed no crimes, per se.
02-17-2018 , 01:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loki
Yeah man, it’s a shame a monster like that couldn’t just stay out of jail forever and avoid any and all legal repercussions.

Wow.

I'll try again, slower this time, cause you don't seem like the brightest mod of the bunch -

'Catching al capone for tax evasion' isn't an example we should aspire to. It's not a symbol of a great judicial system or a just society. That doesn't mean it was better for Al Capone to stay out of jail or that it's better if Mueller doesn't investigate 'russiagate'.

I can try in several other languages, if you think it might help you out. I can do finger painting too.
02-17-2018 , 02:14 AM
Here's one for the christ, what an ******* files:

02-17-2018 , 02:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul D
Funny how you didn't quote the actual crimes alleged in the indictment in your dishonest trolling.
I'm not being dishonest nor am I trolling. I'm not saying that the indictment doesn't list crimes.

what i'm laughing at is the indictment's DETAILS (and impact) of the actual "INTERFERENCE."

put it this way. pretend the indictment said something one-tenth as egregious as the following:

Foreign nationals attempted to: bribe Wisconsin's secretary of state; threaten poll workers in Pennsylvania; beat the ever-lovin s**t out of would-be voters in Cleveland, etc......I'd add my full-throated voice to those screaming about ELECTION MEDDLING

But here's what CNN is saying today:

"The defendants allegedly posed as US persons, created false US personas and operated social media pages and groups designed to attract US audiences"

Like, hahaha really? We're talking about dank memes?
02-17-2018 , 02:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klingbard
Here's one for the christ, what an ******* files:

Literally impossible for that clown to have an ounce of empathy.
02-17-2018 , 02:30 AM
Article about Pineda’s illegal ID business. Sleazy scum bag running sleazy website pretty much spills any info he has as soon as fbi shows up.

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/...ussian-trolls/
02-17-2018 , 02:31 AM

02-17-2018 , 02:34 AM
It is weird that the police in Broward are not getting any shade given the number of violence related visits they made to that kids house and that they seemingly let him walk out of the school.

Not 100% sure on the later but was his plan and he did get out of the school I just don’t know how long it took police to arrive.

Seriously though the police and hospital staff literally just did their jobs. It’s crazy focus is being put on them over the victims and survivors in this set of circumstances.
02-17-2018 , 02:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chymechowder
I'm not being dishonest nor am I trolling. I'm not saying that the indictment doesn't list crimes.

what i'm laughing at is the indictment's DETAILS (and impact) of the actual "INTERFERENCE."

put it this way. pretend the indictment said something one-tenth as egregious as the following:

Foreign nationals attempted to: bribe Wisconsin's secretary of state; threaten poll workers in Pennsylvania; beat the ever-lovin s**t out of would-be voters in Cleveland, etc......I'd add my full-throated voice to those screaming about ELECTION MEDDLING

But here's what CNN is saying today:

"The defendants allegedly posed as US persons, created false US personas and operated social media pages and groups designed to attract US audiences"

Like, hahaha really? We're talking about dank memes?
Johnson, Stein or didn’t count?
02-17-2018 , 02:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuv
Wow.

I'll try again, slower this time, cause you don't seem like the brightest mod of the bunch -

'Catching al capone for tax evasion' isn't an example we should aspire to. It's not a symbol of a great judicial system or a just society. That doesn't mean it was better for Al Capone to stay out of jail or that it's better if Mueller doesn't investigate 'russiagate'.

I can try in several other languages, if you think it might help you out. I can do finger painting too.
White collar crimes have been insanely under charged forever in America. There is pretty much never been to harsh of a sentence of a white collar crime.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuv
That's basically my problem. Al capone getting busted only for tax evasion isn't a good thing. It shouldn't be celebrated. It's awful that he couldn't be convicted for his bigger crimes.

While I'm no expert on history of american mobsters, I imagine that the next generation of murderes just hired good accountants.

[but again, by all means, please please please nail him for some campagin funding violations, for a speeding ticket or for pimping]
Foreign interference with US elections is not a speeding ticket. Being a part of it, conspiring to do it, assisting in it happening are all significant crimes. This is not some kind of gray area discussion.

I don’t know what your understanding of accounting is or the American IRS or our tax laws but the only way for a criminal to not commmit tax fraud when they are illicitly earning large sums of money is to report it. Which then is essentially admitting to a crime. A better accountant doesn’t magical make illegally earned money fine. Laundering such money just racks on an avalanche of conspiracy and RICO charges.

By the way Al Capone got syphilis and by the time he got out of prison he had literally lost his mind and spent his last days with a fishing pole in his backyard pool.
02-17-2018 , 02:56 AM
That won't help here as Trump clearly already have syphillis.
02-17-2018 , 03:00 AM
People who were embarrassed about having been so wrong on their election prediction have been SCREAMING about election shenanigans.

But now we know that a dozen Russians promised to reimburse some Trump supporters for the poster board & magic markers they bought.
02-17-2018 , 03:07 AM
it's all a hoax. crooked paulie manafort had nothing to do with "trump"
02-17-2018 , 03:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuv
Wow.

I'll try again, slower this time, cause you don't seem like the brightest mod of the bunch -

'Catching al capone for tax evasion' isn't an example we should aspire to. It's not a symbol of a great judicial system or a just society. That doesn't mean it was better for Al Capone to stay out of jail or that it's better if Mueller doesn't investigate 'russiagate'.

I can try in several other languages, if you think it might help you out. I can do finger painting too.
The point you seem to be making is neither relevant nor important.

Maybe you don't realize that Russia has been the enemy (in a real sense) of the United States for over 70 years. Couple that with the importance of elections in a democracy.

Elections, kinda important, wouldn't you say? And presidential elections are the daddy of all elections in the United States. I cannot believe these things need to be spelled out, but here we are.

People have different views on where Trump and his team likely fall on the spectrum of:
- there was no Russian meddling/interference
- unwittingly benefiting from Russian meddling/interference
- wittingly benefiting from Russian meddling/interference
- colluding with Russian operatives to influence the election.

The parallel with Nixon and Watergate is somewhat apropos. Many sensible people hated Nixon's policies and what he was doing to the country. But there was nothing blatantly illegal about those policies. So when the opportunity presented itself, Nixon was driven from office due to his behavior surrounding Watergate. It's not that anybody really cared about a second-rate burglary. It's what it revealed about Nixon and certainly involved illegal activities advocated and condoned by the president himself.

To circle back to Trump and Russia. Many people already believe that Trump is a dishonorable sleazebag with abhorrent political views who would likely do anything to get his way (including on his way to becoming president).

The fact that there now appears to be "smoke" in the Russia meddling/interference case suggests that Trump or his team may have committed illegal acts in this important arena (as spelled out above).

So let's agree to stop comparing Trump-Russia to Capone-tax evasion. Again, and I can't believe this needs to be pointed out, if Trump really is guilty of the behavior at the most egregious end of the spectrum referred to above, he would have engaged in what would be considered among the most heinous acts an American presidential candidate could ever do.

Personally, I think members of his team probably fall somewhere in the middle of the Trump-Russia spectrum. But that doesn't mean that we shouldn't vigorously investigate all the possibilities.

Indeed, akin to Nixon and Watergate, vigorously pursuing the Trump-Russia investigation may turn out to be a fruitful means to minimize the impact a Trump presidency may ultimately have on a wide swath of important issues of the day.
02-17-2018 , 03:29 AM
It’s at least “wittingly benefited” from and encouraged by the Trump campaign. Here is the smoking gun:

Quote:
This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump — helped along by Aras and Emin.”

Goldstone asks Trump Jr. if he would be willing to speak directly with Emin, noting that he could send it to Trump, then the presumptive Republican presidential nominee, “but it is ultra sensitive so wanted to send to you first.”

“Thanks Rob I appreciate that,” Trump Jr. replies. “I am on the road at the moment but perhaps I just speak to Emin first. Seems we have some time and if it’s what you say I love it especially later in the summer.”
https://www.politico.com/story/2017/...-lawyer-240402
02-17-2018 , 04:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chymechowder
Like, hahaha really? We're talking about dank memes?
No, we're talking about 18 U.S.C. § 371—Conspiracy to Defraud the United States. You're talking about dank memes.
02-17-2018 , 04:02 AM


Perfectly normal that he forgot to mention over 100 Russian nationals he interacted with on his security clearance. He should be getting the most information. What is his title again? King of Israel?

But still junior is for sure the Trump family member most likely to be certainly guilty of bad acts against the United States.
02-17-2018 , 04:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chymechowder
People who were embarrassed about having been so wrong on their election prediction have been SCREAMING about election shenanigans.

But now we know that a dozen Russians promised to reimburse some Trump supporters for the poster board & magic markers they bought.
Pretty sure trolling is not tolerated if reported so post one more dumb thing please.
02-17-2018 , 04:12 AM
Oh yeah and here is a hot take that is fun.

02-17-2018 , 04:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuv
"Traitorous presideint is a traitor" is absurdly nationalist to me. That's exactly what bothers me. There's no difference to me between Russian-funded 'influence campaign' and Koch brothers funded influence.

Trump is doing terrible crimes that are supported by a very large % of the people in your country. I guess I just don't get the 'traitor' angle when looked at as more than a means to an end.
Name one.
02-17-2018 , 04:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by whosnext
So let's agree to stop comparing Trump-Russia to Capone-tax evasion. Again, and I can't believe this needs to be pointed out, if Trump really is guilty of the behavior at the most egregious end of the spectrum referred to above, he would have engaged in what would be considered among the most heinous acts an American presidential candidate could ever do.
"The most heinous acts an American presidential candidate could ever do" is to call Mexican rapists, to promote sexual assault of women, to encourage violence towards minorities, to vigorously act for the destruction of the enviorment, to mock gold star families.

So no, unless you're an extremely white rich male, "meddling/interfering", whatever you think that vague description means, isn't the worst **** that a presidential candidate can do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawnmower Man
Name one.
Definition of crime
1 : an illegal act for which someone can be punished by the government; especially : a gross violation of law
2 : a grave offense especially against morality

I can name 500 from this week alone for one of those definitions.

Is it really that hard to understand my point? Pwn has lumped my ESL ass together with The Young Turks, Chapo, whatever. I can dig up enough DVaut1 posts discussing Russia with similar (better argued) posts. Surely one of them has made that argument well enough so you at least know "wtf i'm talking about'.

Last edited by Yuv; 02-17-2018 at 04:38 AM.
02-17-2018 , 04:38 AM
You listed a bunch of things that aren't crimes while claiming investigation into actual crimes is just a means to an end.
02-17-2018 , 04:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawnmower Man
You listed a bunch of things that aren't crimes while claiming investigation into actual crimes is just a means to an end.
Correct.
02-17-2018 , 04:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuv
Definition of crime
1 : an illegal act for which someone can be punished by the government; especially : a gross violation of law
2 : a grave offense especially against morality

I can name 500 from this week alone for one of those definitions.
So then it should be pretty easy to name just one!

      
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